My turbo projects!

[Fredrik Grönlund]

I have been reading for this forum for a while and now i decided to post my own In DA Werks project thread.

In 2005 i bought my first Beachbuggy. From the beginning i only had a plan to put on a turbocharger and have fun with it but during the tuning session Mr police caught me for speeding
So without driving license i had lot of time to start to fresh it up litlebit..
From the beginning i thought just to make some minor moficication but it ended up total "restoration" and it took about 3 years to finish..

Then a turbo conversion which where done almost in a week..



I had forgot how ugly it was
Donor car


Some project pictures:













In 2008 my brother bought his first aircooled VW. I promised him to build a economy 1600 with TC. Target was to get about 120hp with stock engine. I had a engine that had been laying in the garage for a while. It was a stock engine with a grinded camshaft. After couple destroyed stock pistons we managed to take 187 whp with 1.4bar.
Best et with that engine in the baja was 13.4s and 12.97s in my beachbuggy


During last winter i got a strange idea to buy a vw based Kitcar. I had a idea that it would be intresting to build a twin turbo engine. Plan was again to just use stock or almost stock parts.
Turbos came from a vw 1.9TD engines and IC was siamised nissan 200sx coolers.
When the engine was dynoed i managed to get 208whp with 1.6bar. I did not like the car itself and decide to sell it as a roller and to put the engine to my beachbuggy.
First thought was to put also the twin turbo system but after some thinking i sold it to thesystem to  same guy that bought the kitcar.

After i bought it




And here how it ended up










Here a dyno chart from the baja engine and twinturbo engine



After i sold the Ft Bonito i decided to mount the 1584cc engine to the buggy and build quickly a single turbo system. I used the same exhaust that we had used on the baja. I had a goal to get 250whp but with small turbo i had i could not get the boost above 1.7bar. And i also had problems with carbs to get the AFR to be god on the whole rpm range. Best ET with carbs and 1584 where in the range of 11s.  After i melted my last 85.5mm pistons i decided to change to efi.

I made quickly a EFI conversion from megasquirt and 48mm throttlebodies. I also changed the turbo to a Holset to get real Boost from the system.
Engine size was also changed from 1584 to big bore 1641
With 2bar boost i managed to get 262whp that should be in the range of 300 engine hp. Best et on the quarter where 10.93s@188km/h and on the 1/8 6.95s(with stock tranny).











Latest test has been to change the cam schaft to little more fancy than the old Engle 41. I had a Scat c55 laying so i decided to test if there would bee any difference.
Sadly i had some misfiring etc so i decided to test what the engine would give with methanol. So i changed to nozzles to 1000cc. After some fuel table tuning i tried to measure how the power curve would look like. Sadly i got the misfiring again and after some melted sparkplugs i had to finish the day. But summa sumarum what a incredible fuel methanol is. Engine sounded much better with methanol than it ever has been with pump gas..

I have to take some time to investigate why i have missfiring issues..

Here i have a dynoshart with 1641cc with methanol and about 2bar of boost. IT is obvious that i have quite bad missfiring above 5500rpm..



Then a comparssion with normal pump gas and methanol.




Some videos also
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/kqkx4fj2bqA" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/kqkx4fj2bqA</a> (high speed camera)

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/To9BWwB8-F0" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/To9BWwB8-F0</a>

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/tcOJnfyzxX0" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/tcOJnfyzxX0</a>

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/uHv8H3pt93Q" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/uHv8H3pt93Q</a>

[Fiatdude]

very nice

[Fredrik Grönlund]

For couple of weeks ago i bought a real steel Vw Beetle.
Plan is to build a combine Et racers and a nice summer car that can also be driven if it rains.

Eng spec
Bad as eng case (deck +9mm)
Cb 84crank
Cb 5.7" h-profile rods
Wiseco 94mm with 2#total seal ring
Cb Comp elimanator heads
TCS-30 camshaft

The car itself is a 1952 splitwindow with removed heat chanels.
Plan is to tube the rear axle with 3" on both sides and to fabricate a full roll cage..

[thejohn66]

nice, a presume there is a turbo mixed in there judging by that cam, you have certainly made your other ones buzz!

[Fiatdude]

Fredrik -- -- Since we are the best of friends, you should offer me the '52 for a straight swap for my '56 -- (OK, I'll send a little cash your way as part of the deal) LOL

[Fredrik Grönlund]

nice, a presume there is a turbo mixed in there judging by that cam, you have certainly made your other ones buzz!

 
Yes a Holset will find his way somewhere between the rear decklid and driver seat..
But I i haven´t decided how big or what type. On the 1641cc i have used the Holset H1E that orginaly where planed to come on the stroker engine...

I think a Holset Hx50 would be quite ok if we get E85 also here to Finland.

[Todi]

I just love that kit car! Good luck with your new project.

[Fredrik Grönlund]

Littel uppdate again.

Today we had a Vw dyno at mine and my friends dyno. Totaly we where 10 different cars. Everething from normaly aspirated to forced induction.

Hp range where from 17whp to 343whp.

During the day i tried to dyno my BB (beach buggy) again with methanol. Because i have been quite busy during the last week i haven´t been able to fine tune anything. But after some quick tuning i tried to take a dynoslip to see in which range a have the power. First and the last result where 343whp. I had in mind to test rise the boost but during the cooling my friend found out that my left tire was damaged. So no more dynotuning for me this seasion.

hp chart


And a video
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/96MwmpVARuU" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/96MwmpVARuU</a>


Here i have some pics from the event.




































 

[Todi]

It had been fun to be there! How many hk did the ragtop oval...

[Fredrik Grönlund]

It had been fun to be there! How many hk did the ragtop oval...

Clutch started to slip at 2500-3000rpm so we did not get any real numbers.

[mrmut]

My turbo projects! stock 1.3 AR engine turbo GT 15 of VW 1.9 tdi 105hp engine with boost 1bar(14,7psi)

[Fredrik Grönlund]

Nice budget built you have.
My own project has been untouched during this year because lack of time and interest. But i have some thoughts and ideas that i hope could rise the mas horsepower littlebit more..

[mrmut]

Nice budget built you have.
My own project has been untouched during this year because lack of time and interest. But i have some thoughts and ideas that i hope could rise the mas horsepower littlebit more..

For my next project I would go to higher RPM 7500-8000 this is my idea.
What is your idea of 1600 turbo. 

[Fredrik Grönlund]

Nice budget built you have.
My own project has been untouched during this year because lack of time and interest. But i have some thoughts and ideas that i hope could rise the mas horsepower littlebit more..

For my next project I would go to higher RPM 7500-8000 this is my idea.
What is your idea of 1600 turbo. 

Yes moore rpm and boost would be the best way to go.
I have made earlier some trials to get up the RPM for max horsepower but without greater success..(power at +7000rpm)
Or i was able to get up the the rpm but max power stayed on the same level...
parts that has been laying around has not been optimized for High rpm and the whole package should be moore built as a screamer..
I also noticed that with engine speed over 7000rpm with power i got problems with the valve train and oil system..
easy to fix but it costs money..
And 1600 build was only for fun from the beginning.. And as a learing project for coming engines..


But next 1600 engine could look something like

- 85.5-87mm pistons (depending what i will find)
- H-profile rods
- counter weighted 69mm crank
- Cylinder heads with 40mm intake and 36ex
- CR around 8-9 because we now have E85 available in finland to
- Camshaft would bee something like 050" 275-285deg...

Exhaust smooth and short as possible but this is quite difficult..
I have also planed to make a comparsion test between 4-1 and 4-2(-1) exhausts..

But as always lot of plans but to less time..

[mrmut]

- 85.5-87mm pistons (depending what i will find)
- H-profile rods
- counter weighted 69mm crank
- Cylinder heads with 40mm intake and 36ex
- CR around 8-9 because we now have E85 available in finland to
- Camshaft would bee something like 050" 275-285deg...

Exhaust smooth and short as possible but this is quite difficult..
I have also planed to make a comparsion test between 4-1 and 4-2(-1) exhausts..

But as always lot of plans but to less time..

Here's a +7000 engine rpm 392HP  ;)1641

http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php/topic,15843.0.html

[Fredrik Grönlund]

- 85.5-87mm pistons (depending what i will find)
- H-profile rods
- counter weighted 69mm crank
- Cylinder heads with 40mm intake and 36ex
- CR around 8-9 because we now have E85 available in finland to
- Camshaft would bee something like 050" 275-285deg...

Exhaust smooth and short as possible but this is quite difficult..
I have also planed to make a comparison test between 4-1 and 4-2(-1) exhausts..

But as always lot of plans but to less time..

Here's a +7000 engine rpm 392HP  ;)1641

http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php/topic,15843.0.html

Yes that's a nice budget engine also. Funny part was that both engines a quite similar in that difference that i had big valve heads (40/36) and not as wild camshaft..
Otherwise same with OEM crank etc etc

I made a methanol test with my 1641cc engine and i got 343whp..(with 15% trans losses that could be something like ~390 engine hp...) It would been nice to have E85 instead but it was not locally available back then...
 
Moore could have been taken out  believe if i had some bigger fuel pump and nozzles and moore tuning. I only tuned it for a "show off" in last years VW Dyno day and only good run ended up in broken tire on one side..

During last spring i promised to help out a friend to build a "sleeper" bug with 2332 engine with efi and turbo..
But it ended up with trans problems and best et  for the summer has only been 11.5s@195km/h..











<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/QCqAu5Xb8QM" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/QCqAu5Xb8QM</a>
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/DufoOqdzscI" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/DufoOqdzscI</a>
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a104/fgronlun/WaDD/kirppu_1.jpg

[mrmut]

This is very good and I'm delighted.
But to me in Macedonia is not possible to find free methanol in sales requires special permits.Аnd the E85 is not thinkable and the E85 is not conceivable , the most available is 96.8% Ethanol , they are a percentage of water does not prblem I can go and get 99.99% Ethanol.
If there is another secret to come up as methanol, so I do not know

[Fredrik Grönlund]

This is very good and I'm delighted.
But to me in Macedonia is not possible to find free methanol in sales requires special permits.Аnd the E85 is not thinkable and the E85 is not conceivable , the most available is 96.8% Ethanol , they are a percentage of water does not problem I can go and get 99.99% Ethanol.
If there is another secret to come up as methanol, so I do not know

A 1600 engine it is possible to come up to decent power with normal pump gas. For me it stoped on 262whp what should be in the range of 300 engine hp with normal pump gas (98E).
The green Oval bug i dynoed to 394whp with normal 98E but i think it should be possible to get about 30-40hp moore from it..
Lot of boost and enough with fuel then you have the simple recipe for powerfull engine

[jeff01]

I like your topic start because there are some similar lines with my project
Stock 1600 with grinded cam + turbo + Megasquirt + stock gearbox + 2bar of boost with pump fuel = few broken pistons but insane feeling when turbo comes to game
unfortunately I´ve not visited the dyno.


what were your speeds on quarter with heavier body and what´s the weight of it ?

thank you.

[prea356]

Hi, here is a videoclip of the car in action. Enjoy

http://cam67.1g.fi/kuvat/dragracing/2011/KAUHAJOKI_TEST_10.6/CIMG0976.WMV

[mrmut]

Hi, here is a videoclip of the car in action. Enjoy

http://cam67.1g.fi/kuvat/dragracing/2011/KAUHAJOKI_TEST_10.6/CIMG0976.WMV

Very fast .
I wonder how it is built engine      even if it is 1600 would I rejoiced more

[pep]

Hi, here is a videoclip of the car in action. Enjoy

http://cam67.1g.fi/kuvat/dragracing/2011/KAUHAJOKI_TEST_10.6/CIMG0976.WMV

Very fast .
I wonder how it is built engine      even if it is 1600 would I rejoiced more

It's very nice and fast car, but in that video there is not 1600cc turbo engine in that oval beetle There is something else in that car

1600cc engine is in the buggy...

[prea356]

The specs

During last spring i promised to help out a friend to build a "sleeper" bug with 2332 engine with efi and turbo..
But it ended up with trans problems and best et  for the summer has only been 11.5s@195km/h

[Fredrik Grönlund]

About the 2332
Spec is a quite normal Bolt togehter Stroker.

Cb 84mm crank
5.5" Rods
94mm AA piston set
CB Max Wedge heads
Camshaft 050"  ~280deg
CR 7.8

First it was dynoed with an Cheap Chinese Ebay turbo to plus 300whp but the turbo did not last for long before it destroyed itself.
When turbo was changed to an Holset power rise up to 394whp..

But i must say i love the car because in first and second gear it pulls like hell but in 3 gear and 4 it is totally cracy.. And remember it is not built for dragrace, it is suposed to be the weekend family with rear seat etc..

[jeff01]

And what did you expected ?? 100hp and pulls like any other car on street?  Deem it must pull harder than I could eaven think.  0,5hp per 1kg
What gearboxes do you use? how many have you broken of them and what to you think about 091 bu gearbox strenght?

I´m waiting for more stuff like pics/ specs and just a stories of your cars
Thank you.

[BeetleBug]

What gearboxes do you use? how many have you broken of them and what to you think about 091 bu gearbox strenght?

Let`s discuss gearboxes and high performance cars:

- Roland from Sweden, T1 gearbox and 9.xx
- CSP Ghia, 550hp and a T1 gearbox runing 8`s
- Hector Urias, another 8 sec car with a T1 gearbox
- 1641ccm - 394hp Swedish car 10.18 and a T1 gearbox with a superdiff
- Magnus from Sweden won the recent Tierp event (and that track is sticky!) with a 9.xx and a T1 gearbox.

I`m not saying that a T1 gearbox is stronger compared to others but I do believe it is better than most think. Give a T1 gearbox the right work enviroment and you can make it last. And not to forget, you get 2 fully built T1 gearboxes for the price of 1 Mendeola AND they fit in the car.

BB

[jeff01]

What gearboxes do you use? how many have you broken of them and what to you think about 091 bu gearbox strenght?

Let`s discuss gearboxes and high performance cars:

- Roland from Sweden, T1 gearbox and 9.xx
- CSP Ghia, 550hp and a T1 gearbox runing 8`s
- Hector Urias, another 8 sec car with a T1 gearbox
- 1641ccm - 394hp Swedish car 10.18 and a T1 gearbox with a superdiff
- Magnus from Sweden won the recent Tierp event (and that track is sticky!) with a 9.xx and a T1 gearbox.

I`m not saying that a T1 gearbox is stronger compared to others but I do believe it is better than most think. Give a T1 gearbox the right work enviroment and you can make it last. And not to forget, you get 2 fully built T1 gearboxes for the price of 1 Mendeola AND they fit in the car.

BB

I don´t want to ruin another persons thread but I still answer.

Thanks for good information. Before reading that I wouldn´t beleve that somebody could use stock gearbox in 9s car and eaven faster. How many passes rebuilt gearbox lives in 10s car? 12s car? ~1,3s  60 foot?
My goal is street car and I can´t afford rebuilding gearbox every month. I´m looking for 091 and they cost 100-200 eur  if you can find some here in estonia.

I broke the gear fork once and diff with high boost launch so I´m not sayng that gears are weak. Maybe I should break my 3 stock gearboxes before installing something stronger   

[Fredrik Grönlund]

I´m totaly green regarding transsmissions. In the beachbuggy a totaly STD trans hold for one summer... But its a quite light car also..

First  destroyed trans in oval bug where geared t1 with "rhino" case and superdiff. And other where also a geared  t1 trans but with economy dogring modification.
First where destroyed because of wheel hop and other one because of bad clutch tuning..
But there are a "quality" trans waiting to be mounted. It should have  Real dogring internals (SF pyörä) etc etc. Should be good for 10s passes..

About other projects at the moment..I have been quite lazy during last couple of months but there are some smaller engine projects ongoing..
Theese are just simple atmo engines to understand basic things building a engine that gives the power on higher rpm..
My vakeup was the simple calculations that JPM presented here on Lounge and now i also have the Pipemax program to easyly calculate headers etc...

In common we have small but a very interesting VW sceene here in vasa. One example is that Last year we had first VW dyno day (in vasa) and most powerfull "stroker" engine where in the range of 160-170 WHP..
One year later the max power output has rise already to 195whp..

What it comes to blown engines we have turbo/compressor engines between 180-390whp and now when we have got the magic E85 fuel there are moore to come...

[mrmut]

- Roland from Sweden, T1 gearbox and 9.xx
- CSP Ghia, 550hp and a T1 gearbox runing 8`s
- Hector Urias, another 8 sec car with a T1 gearbox
- 1641ccm - 394hp Swedish car 10.18 and a T1 gearbox with a superdiff
- Magnus from Sweden won the recent Tierp event (and that track is sticky!) with a 9.xx and a T1 gearbox.

I`m not saying that a T1 gearbox is stronger compared to others but I do believe it is better than most think. Give a T1 gearbox the right work enviroment and you can make it last. And not to forget, you get 2 fully built T1 gearboxes for the price of 1 Mendeola AND they fit in the car.

BB

T1 gearbox of bus or bug , I found myself immediately gearbox of T2 - 4 speed , and currently have , and currently have in 1303s АМ gearbox IRS.
Is it better to auth T2 gearbox 

[Fredrik Grönlund]

It has went awhile since last update.
There has not been any bigger updates with any of the turbo projects that I'm involved in
But something i have been able to do. One long time target has been to build ow cylinder head flowbench and i have been collecting info vacuum cleaner engines now for couple of years.

When i went to flow cylinderheads that i had made some basic prep on i was triggered again to build my own.
Then one Friday i called a friend if he had some plans for the evening, he answered no so i asked if he wants to drink some bear and build a flowbench.. Why not and here is the result.







First it was planed to make a orifice flowbench but when i discussed with flowbench owners i decided to change the design for a Pitot metering pipe. Benefit with pitot benches are that they are more flexible and have wider flow capability.







As usual the plan was to make as much by myself but with the software i had to ask help from dataprogramming expert. Thanks to internet it is possible to find calculating formulas so he had "only" to make the code...
Software is programmed so that i can measure the flow with any suction and it corrects it directly to 28" of water. This helps alot because no calculating is needed and i se directly if the flow decreases with higher suction etc.

Totally i have about 7000W of suction power i it is possible to measure up to ~300cfm with 28". With lower suction it is possible to measure flow up to 500cfm before i go over the measuring range of the sensors.

Vac motors


Bench 95% ready


Bench where then calibrated by calibration plates that are non standard but widely used by one of the best cylinderhead makers in Sweden and Finland.

Now after couple of weeks playing with the flowbench i must admit that this art to grind powerful cylinderheads is not as easy as it was before the flowbench.

Most difficult ones has been the original type VW intakes channels. It is quite easy to achieve flows up to 160-10 cfm but then everything gets moore difficult.
At the moment i´am helping a friend with his Street Eliminator heads. Best result sofar has been without any intake about 178cfm (44mm intake valve). With a shorty intake that extends the intake channel it flow about 190cfm but decreases alot when suction is increases. Also the flowspeed meter gives very different flowspeeds in the lower and upper part of the intake opening.

What i have come up with is that i have lot of turbulence on the inner radius. Then i have a totally dead spot where the air is not flowing at all..

Does anyone have good hints and tricks with street eliminator heads so i would get up the flow up to 200cfm. Has anyone else noticed this turbulence just before the valve stem and inner radius?

Some pictures of the heads.



Dummy intake extension made of a old intake. This where heavily grinded so i could easily play with modelling compund to fins out shapes and sizes.