Newer Wheel (4 Stud) Guru's

[Greg Ward]

Hi there,
I'm new to here, but been around since the first days of the old CLF in the 90's.

I need some input to a new car I'm putting together for Hillclimb next year.

I've got a big set of Disc brakes (4 wheel) to put on, not an aftermarket, but a local set, and I need some standard (late model or otherwise) wheels, preferably Alloy, to make sure 1, the brakes fit in, 2, they are less than the 14kg per wheel! that my current 15x7" steel wheels weigh.

Any guru's that can telll me some sort of stock "other" alloy car wheel will fit under a stock steel bodied, steel standard guards/fenders, 69-70 model Beetle?
I can't remember what my offset/backspace is at the moment with the steel wheels, but some intuition into a BMW, Jetta, I don't know wheel, that just bolts on 4 stud, would be fantastic.

I can go over and try it from a wreckers here in Australia and see if it works.

Don't want to go 5, because I can then change between Steel stock look for driving to the track, and Alloy aftermarket to save 20-30kg for the actual race.

Any input welcome.

Thanks,

Greg

[Neil Davies]

As far as I know, the only other car with 4x130 pattern is the rear engined Skoda, but they were only 13". If it were me, I'd go for Porsche 5x130. That'll allow you to use steel spare wheels off a 944/911 as the road wheels and your alloys with race tyres for the track. Much larger choice in wheels in Porsche pattern.

Your other option is some custom made wheels - Image wheels in the UK will make split rims in pretty much any size you want.

[71CALRIPPER]

4 studd CMS or erco style in any ofset you need the street weight will be strong enough for hard corners.

[benssp]

how about a set of 2 litre alloys?

4 stud, 6.5kg each, clear front and rear discs and have a good offset

[Zach Gomulka]

Good to see you here Greg! I always appreciated your input on the "other" forum But I can totally understand why you left...

Will these brakes fit in a 15" wheel? Or do you need to go larger? Rule of thumb is the rotor needs to be about 4" smaller than the rim diameter, but I'm sure you already knew that.
Your current wheels are 7" wide all around? And you want to stay with that width, I assume? The only thing that immediately comes to mind is the ATS wheel... I believe they are avaliable in a 15x7


Only other option I can think of is to have a set of 914 Mahle/Pedrini/2L Fuchs wheels widened to the appropriate width, but I doubt that will be cheap.
I wouldn't trust a CMS wheel to survive a hillclimb...

[Bruce]

...... the street weight will be strong enough for hard corners.

That's doubtful.  You should see Greg's car in action.

[Rennsurfer]

Haven't seen those ATS wheels in awhile. Very cool. Greg, none of the Porsche 914 alloy wheels will suffice?

[alex d]

can't you drill your hubs so you have 4x130 and 5x130 at the same time? this way you could use your steel wheels and a set of Fuchs, wich are light and available in many sizes (with decent backspacing)

[javabug]

For Greg's car he's gonna need to have studs, so the multi-pattern drums won't work in this case.

[71CALRIPPER]

...... the street weight will be strong enough for hard corners.

That's doubtful.  You should see Greg's car in action.

that bad

[Greg Ward]

G'Day guys,
Thanks for all the input so far, sorry, just after I posted this I had to make a quick work trip to Singapore, sneaking it in before Christmas,    so I just got back today.

There's a lot of other good points here, but I'll have to clarify a few, and then maybe that will help narrow down some choices for me.
First, Mike is right, I have to go studs, so it's an either/or, I can't have both 4 and 5 options.

Bruce reads my mind, because one reason I've never looked at a lot of aftermarket alloys because I'm not comfortable I won't break them, some of the tracks I race are public roads and not a beautiful smooth tarmac, plus some G-Force generation is really evident, so I've always worried about snapping out a centre, maybe not possible, but...









Hi Zach, a friend of mine is supplying the setup, so I will need to check dimensions, but I think a 15 x 7" alloy should clear, I think it won't work even with a 15 x 7" Steel at the rear now because of handbrake etc... Those ATS wheels are not bad at all, any links there?

I like the ideas of some 6.5kg alloys, and up for suggestions of the 914 etc ones, any pics of these and some backspace specs?

Some rules of thumb that have to be supplied, is that because this is a certain class of racing, I cannot have split rims in any way, so that rules all that out.
They cannot be larger than 15" or wider than 7" because of the rules, and the size tyre I must use.

Here are some pics of the brake setup.












Any other input most welcome.

First race is Feb 15th, so I've got a lot to do!




Greg

[javabug]

Hi Greg.  Are you looking at only OEM wheels, or quality aftermarket will work?  Only other thing I can think of would be a Panasport, Compomotive, or maybe Rota as far as quality aftermarket goes.  They're pricey (except Rota), but light! 

[Greg Ward]

Hey Mike,
Anything that fits within the specified rules.

The price is one thing, but, in all seriousness, I've always bought the best I can afford, rather than replacing something shitty 5 times, so, that is not that much of an issue.
I'm not going to buy a gold rose, when one from the garden is all I need, but I would rather buy something once that is what I want. Aftermarket, is fine so long as it complies, and is of a good enough quality, and the other reason is I drive to the track, I've never trailered my car to an event, even 2000 miles away, but I've used the wheels/tyes that I've driven on to the event, so to make sure I have some chance of competing, I now need to drive on one set, and take another with the lighter alloys.

Funny thing is, I hope to actually take these other 4 wheels with tyres, on a trailer behind my racecar, but the trailer will be the engine bay of a Beetle....

Greg

[qubek]

ATS Classics are good wheels IMO and they were and are used often in road races, rallies etc.
I think the only version you can buy new is 5,5x15 ET 25 (or something around that) http://atsmotorsport.de/ats/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=17&Itemid=27  CSP had them, but even those may be no longer available. They used to be made in various sizes, my girlfriend has them in 5,5x15 ET 34 or 36, I have seen ones that were 7 inches wide and heard that 9s and wider existed. They may not be the lightest wheels available (although I don't think they are heavy. I never checked that) but for sure they are strong. 

[alex d]

if price is not the main consideration I'd have some 3 piece wheels custom made, for example these:

http://www.braid.es/braidwheels/desmontables/s1ENG.htm

or these

http://www.braid.es/competicion/desmontables/catdesmonteng.htm


they are quality wheels, light and strong, used by many rally, circuit and off road teams

[Zach Gomulka]

Panasport is a terrific idea! My boss has those in 15x7 on his Merkur XR4Ti (Ford Sierra). I know they can be made in special bolt patterns and possibly different offsets. Well made, relatively light, and good looking.

[Nico86]

That's cool !