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Author Topic: RIP Der Renn Kafer cup - Photos or stories  (Read 31738 times)
Zach Gomulka
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Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining.


« Reply #30 on: December 24, 2011, 23:52:05 pm »

In response to Jeff68's comment that in the beginning the cars were true street cars is not accurate.

Not all, but many were. Those were good times, even for a spectator like myself.
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Born in the '80s, stuck in the '70s.
bugnut68
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« Reply #31 on: December 25, 2011, 00:04:28 am »

It sucks the class went away, but I've often thought people have unfairly put the blame on Shawn Geers and his beautiful example of the extreme end of what the DRKC could be. The reality is, unless a class is set up with hard-lined rules outlining elements that demand streetability the envelope will always be pushed... especially where heads up racing is concerned.  I think the participation will always ebb and flo irregardless of the rules, at least from my observation. 

But let's face it, VW racing is not exactly a sport with much potential for radical growth, overall, for lots of racing.  This isn't a pessimistic view, but just my honest opinion.  I feel like the golden era has passed, but the sport will always be preserved simply out of the love of the car itself. 
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Mike Lawless
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« Reply #32 on: December 25, 2011, 00:28:34 am »

When we first got involved, our car WAS streetable. 10-1 compression, running mid 13s. But, like everyone, we wanted to do as well as we possibly could, so we upped our game to the level that the top players were at. I'd say that first year, you are correct in that a lot of the cars were streetable. Allen's, Scott's, Troy's, Jiimy's and Larry Mck's among others were street cars. That soon changed. Some stayed streetable, and tried to do as well as they could, eventually becoming discouraged. After the first couple of years, it got to the point to where there was one, maybe two dominant cars.

I always thought it could be revived with a good set of rules. The CLC goes a long way but still allows barely streetable combos in. DOT tires and a 30 mile cruise  would go a long way toward making it so a larger cross section of cars could be competitive.

The major complaint that was most often heard was that a person didn't stand a chance at winning or even placing, so why bother. Unfortunately, strict rules also keeps some away. When rules discussions come about, most want rules that favor their own particular combo. Strict rules also puts a lot of responsibility on the shoulders of the class organizers who need to enforce them. No easy answers for sure.
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Winner, 2009 Bakersfield March Meet
2006 PRA Super Gas Champion
2002-2003 DRKC Champion
http://www.lawlessdesigns.com
John Palmer
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« Reply #33 on: December 25, 2011, 00:37:22 am »

It sucks the class went away, but I've often thought people have unfairly put the blame on Shawn Geers and his beautiful example of the extreme end of what the DRKC could be. The reality is, unless a class is set up with hard-lined rules outlining elements that demand streetability the envelope will always be pushed... especially where heads up racing is concerned.  I think the participation will always ebb and flo irregardless of the rules, at least from my observation. 

But let's face it, VW racing is not exactly a sport with much potential for radical growth, overall, for lots of racing.  This isn't a pessimistic view, but just my honest opinion.  I feel like the golden era has passed, but the sport will always be preserved simply out of the love of the car itself. 

DRKC was doomed long before Shawn built his "bench mark" car.  

Basically, you had race cars, and show cars, and some nice street cars that all competed in the early days.  I define the early days as when the 21 cars showed up for Phoenix BOR.  The thing Mike quickly figured out was it was the best "combined car" that would come out as the winner.  There might have been a nicer show car, or a quicker race car, but The Lawless's car was always at or near the top in points in BOTH show and go and therefore scored the most points.

I don't look at DRKC as a bad thing.  It got a lot of people off their butts and building cars.  We had a lot of fun, and made a lot of friends.  If you look at the names today in P/M, S/C, S/G, P/E, many started, or like The Palmer's did "re-started" because of DRKC.

I don't think it's the promoter's that built the class, it was the grass roots interest of a group of guys with a like interest.    
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Zach Gomulka
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Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining.


« Reply #34 on: December 25, 2011, 03:15:30 am »

The rules can remain simple. Supplied pump fuel for all racers.

Discuss Smiley
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TexasTom
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12.58@106, 7.89@89 Texas Motorplex 10/18/09


« Reply #35 on: December 25, 2011, 03:46:54 am »

Zach!
That'd work right up until the first guy pulled in with 1 quart reservoirs mounted as fuel bowl extensions.
 Wink

I can relate a bit ... I found myself with a soured mood when people started changing out their street tires for slicks at the Unlimited Street South race.
My view was it should be street legal and remain that way until someone wins the last race.
It's fine though, I ran a clean race and that's all that mattered to me.
Would've liked having a chance to someday run with the DRKC though.
Over n Out
TxT
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too old for this
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« Reply #36 on: December 26, 2011, 00:19:50 am »

Just a little update on Bill Frost's oval second in line in the photo at Phoenix.... still doing the renn kaafer job in the U.K. gone through a lot of changes,fresh 2276,pro comp box,saw axles,new interior,now running mid 13's(would be a lot quicker without the pussy launches,but I can't afford to break it Shocked driven on the street all the time,I love this car,couple pics for whoever might remember it.















 
« Last Edit: December 26, 2011, 00:32:31 am by too old for this » Logged

JG54
mg
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« Reply #37 on: December 26, 2011, 02:18:52 am »

Just a little update on Bill Frost's oval second in line in the photo at Phoenix....  
car looks great.  Cool
way back...at PHX Frost's car was a stunning surprise to me, it looked NEW.
Damon won, he drove his equally detailed car harder, at that time everyone was gunning for Damon.  Wink
PHX pit area, Flying Tomato surrounded by 20 something race/show bugs.  Cool
I like to race more than detail, so I had better be fast.  Grin
PHX shots by ?...  Cool
at least no one was eliminated.  Wink




« Last Edit: December 26, 2011, 03:54:01 am by mg » Logged
John Palmer
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Posts: 65


« Reply #38 on: December 26, 2011, 03:13:18 am »

Another DRKC FIRST in the photo of Mike and Troy racing at Phoenix, is that these two cars had the first two DRKC "Bolt-in" roll bars built at RLR.

Troy's was the first , built, but in mild steel, and Mike "upgraded" his to chrome moly.  Ron built Troy's exactly like my sample, but tweaked (improved) the original bar shape to make it easier to bend the hoop with less angles.  It seems like I see this bar design in every serious street bug in So. Cal now. 
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2manytoys
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Posts: 395



« Reply #39 on: December 26, 2011, 03:58:34 am »

Maybe in the new year a cross between the DRKC and the CLC will emerge. Great idea, the morph from the original intentions and what it became led to it's end.  I would love to see a class similar thrive in 2012.
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Patrick Friel -..2manytoys, not enough time or money
bilboa2
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« Reply #40 on: December 26, 2011, 06:26:05 am »

I really like the seats, door panels on the greenheart oval car. breather reservoir cool too. Green heart cars are cool...bill
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OC1967vw
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Posts: 139


« Reply #41 on: December 26, 2011, 08:30:07 am »

Maybe in the new year a cross between the DRKC and the CLC will emerge. Great idea, the morph from the original intentions and what it became led to it's end.  I would love to see a class similar thrive in 2012.

-86mm limit-crank size
-94mm limit-cylinder bore
-normal aspiration only
-no turbos
-no fuel injection
-no nos
-48mm limit-carb bore:single barrel per cylinder
-44mm limit-carb venturi per barrel

-stock case stud pattern
-44mm intake valve limit

-30 mile cruise-up/back
-no slicks-race or dot
-treaded conventional street tires only
-pump gas purchased on cruise day-tank sealed
-front/rear bumpers-full-as factory installed
-front license plate
-current state registration and proof of insurance for current year

-3 ET brackets: 12.00-12.99/13.00-13.99/14.00-up
-1 overall top eliminator

-steel fenders
-steel hood/decklid
-bumpers optional-race day only
-passenger seat optional-race day only
-stinger optional-race day only
-fan belt optional-race day only

real vintage street racing 1969
pick your street track: Nabiscos or Kimberly-Clark
« Last Edit: December 26, 2011, 20:38:41 pm by OC1967vw » Logged
too old for this
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« Reply #42 on: December 26, 2011, 17:05:31 pm »

I really like the seats, door panels on the greenheart oval car. breather reservoir cool too. Green heart cars are cool...bill
appreciate that,both for the car....and the club Smiley
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JG54
OC1967vw
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« Reply #43 on: December 26, 2011, 17:52:24 pm »

Your ATF was the car Buddy Hale built.

Man, those were the days. They may not have been running deep 11's or 10's, but they were true blue street cars. I remember everyone was excited about building a car for DRKC!


exactly. Zach, you hit it on the head
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John Palmer
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« Reply #44 on: December 26, 2011, 19:28:46 pm »

No Rules, No Judges, it's too hard to find somebody that wants to run it!  Street tires would save the transmissions. 

Just run a "dial-In" elimination, and then a "Spectator vote", and call the "top points" car for the day the Top Eliminator Winner!

Seems to me that if there really was any interest in this type of class then there would be 10 to 15 cars still running the BOR class now, but I don't see it.
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OC1967vw
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« Reply #45 on: December 26, 2011, 20:43:23 pm »

No Rules, No Judges, it's too hard to find somebody that wants to run it!  Street tires would save the transmissions. 

Just run a "dial-In" elimination, and then a "Spectator vote", and call the "top points" car for the day the Top Eliminator Winner!

Seems to me that if there really was any interest in this type of class then there would be 10 to 15 cars still running the BOR class now, but I don't see it.


Both good points, John. Peoples choice judging during set period of time on race day morning.  Bracket racing/dial in time like the days of old at old Irwindale, Lions, Ontario, and OCIR.
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58vw
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« Reply #46 on: December 27, 2011, 05:26:47 am »

agree Grin
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So.Cal.Life
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« Reply #47 on: December 27, 2011, 23:29:18 pm »

   Simplicity = More fun = More participation .....
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Gary Justus
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« Reply #48 on: December 27, 2011, 23:38:32 pm »

   Simplicity = More fun = More participation .....
Perfect! ~ I said it then.
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WCB Hitler's Hot Rod
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« Reply #49 on: December 28, 2011, 03:53:30 am »

DRKC ain't shit without super squishy pistons......stir'n the pot.   Shocked
« Last Edit: December 29, 2011, 01:04:03 am by WCB Cal-look FOCKER » Logged

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58vw
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« Reply #50 on: December 29, 2011, 06:18:33 am »

thats funny...another class that would be cool to see again
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OC1967vw
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« Reply #51 on: December 31, 2011, 06:53:17 am »

thats funny...another class that would be cool to see again



havent been on for several days. Played with a set of simple rules that reflects just my opinion of what the class would look like for us old timer enthusiasts. The bottom line is to keep it simple. For those of us who remember, it will bring great memories of saturday night street racing behind kimberly-clark and cruising whittier blvd. will post next week.
happy new year
« Last Edit: December 31, 2011, 06:55:55 am by OC1967vw » Logged
Dan Ahrendt
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« Reply #52 on: October 10, 2012, 23:31:36 pm »

DRKC my favorite racing series was so great ...but off

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rick m
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Driving Hot VWs for 44 Years Strong!


« Reply #53 on: October 11, 2012, 02:30:02 am »

Mike,

I remember those days! Love your Ghia. In fact, I went to Eric Vaughn on your recommendation to have my late FUCHS narrowed from 6" to 4 1/2" for my chop top street car.  I enjoyed the simplicity of the class and all that participated in the first one we held at Phoenix. Miss seeing everyone for so long!  The good thing is I got my Diabetes under control and take no insulin anymore...after 10 years.

Rick Mortensen
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Rick Mortensen
Driving Hot VWs since 1970
Fritter
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« Reply #54 on: October 11, 2012, 02:42:44 am »

I loved the DRKC.  It and DKP inspired MANY cars to be built, and kept hot rodded VW enthusiasm alive.   Grin
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Mike F.
'64 Indigo Blue sunroof Bug
Rick Meredith
DKK
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« Reply #55 on: October 11, 2012, 03:44:57 am »

DRKC was a great concept but unfortunately, when you get egos on the line... things get competitive.

The cars became something that was too much race car to drive everyday and too much show car to be drag raced.

It would be neat to see something similar but more limited so the cars would be more all-around street cars.

I know DRKC participants that either quit because they didn't want to make their car into a race car or because they took their car to that next level, no longer could enjoy them and wound up selling them.

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67 Beetle - The Deuce Roadster of Cal Look
Troy Palmer
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« Reply #56 on: October 11, 2012, 03:46:11 am »

First DRKC was at LA County Race Way in 1999!
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draven898
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« Reply #57 on: October 11, 2012, 05:14:41 am »

since i live in las vegas and was showing up on race day how would you enforce the 30 mile cruise rule ? just asking  Smiley
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Dan Ahrendt
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« Reply #58 on: October 11, 2012, 06:08:28 am »

Thanks for sharing the good old times. There was at the time a official rulebook ?
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volkskris
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« Reply #59 on: October 11, 2012, 12:58:26 pm »

since i live in las vegas and was showing up on race day how would you enforce the 30 mile cruise rule ? just asking  Smiley
quite simple. you do the cruise from the dragstrip back to the dragstrip with the whole group. some unanounced checkpoints will make shure nobody cheats.
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