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Small powerhouses and old school
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Topic: Small powerhouses and old school (Read 663303 times)
Gabetion2000
Newbie
Posts: 25
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #240 on:
February 15, 2008, 04:10:30 am »
Hello everybody,
I am a first time poster in the cal look lounge. And I have to say that this forum is awesome. Especially this thread. I have alway been
interested in mouse motors ,and planned on building one in the future. Awesome info guys. Keep it up.
Gabe Scott
Ventura,CA
USA
Logged
A and G's Racing
73 Super
BeetleBug
Hero Member
Posts: 2836
Snabba grabben...
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #241 on:
February 15, 2008, 09:01:45 am »
Quote from: Gabetion2000 on February 15, 2008, 04:10:30 am
Hello everybody,
I am a first time poster in the cal look lounge. And I have to say that this forum is awesome. Especially this thread. I have alway been
interested in mouse motors ,and planned on building one in the future. Awesome info guys. Keep it up.
Gabe Scott
Ventura,CA
USA
Hi Gabe and welcome to The Lounge! Don`t forget to keep the rest of us in the loop when you start building your mouse engine.
Best rgs
BeetleBug
Logged
10.41 - 100ci - 1641ccm - 400hp
Jon
Administrator
Hero Member
Posts: 3214
12,3@174km/t at Gardermoen 2008
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #242 on:
February 15, 2008, 09:44:18 am »
Quote from: Johannes Persson on February 13, 2008, 10:38:22 am
When you have decided the closing point chose duration so the intake valve does not hit the piston at tdc including the depth of your valve pockets.
Could you explain this for us dummies, Johannes?
Logged
Grumpy old men have signatures like this.
Johannes Persson
Jr. Member
Posts: 67
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #243 on:
February 15, 2008, 12:08:50 pm »
Hello there,
JHU, I ment that you should open the intake valve early because you want as much flow available as possible when the piston accelerates down(more flow area under the curve), but there are mekanical limitations you have to deal with(valve hitting piston).
I decided to cloce the intake valve 57deg abdc @ 0,05", then the fk45 became a good choise together with 1,55:1 rockers.
I am close to 6mm lift @ tdc so the valvepockets are pritty deep.
Maybe I am not clear enought ,please let me know.
Regads
Johannes
Logged
Jon
Administrator
Hero Member
Posts: 3214
12,3@174km/t at Gardermoen 2008
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #244 on:
February 15, 2008, 12:39:20 pm »
That helped quite a bit, thanks.
Logged
Grumpy old men have signatures like this.
Eddie DVK
Hero Member
Posts: 866
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #245 on:
February 15, 2008, 17:09:50 pm »
Damn I speechless and that doesn t happen that often.
Very very cool and that with stock parts appart from the pistons..
......
Where can I bring mine 1600............
Logged
Regards Edgar
" Type 4, it is a completely different engine. You have to drive one to understand! "
Jim Ratto
Hero Member
Posts: 7121
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #246 on:
February 15, 2008, 17:34:58 pm »
Quote from: Gabetion2000 on February 15, 2008, 04:10:30 am
Hello everybody,
I am a first time poster in the cal look lounge. And I have to say that this forum is awesome. Especially this thread. I have alway been
interested in mouse motors ,and planned on building one in the future. Awesome info guys. Keep it up.
Gabe Scott
Ventura,CA
USA
Wow... a neighbor...I'm in Simi.
Logged
Peter Shattock
Sr. Member
Posts: 353
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #247 on:
February 18, 2008, 22:35:49 pm »
Johannes,
As suggested on here many times already great effort with the motor, and some really interesting insight, but best of all, it’s great to see someone actually doing it, rather than just talking about it.
I was wondering what fuel you were using as I see you will be running the motor on the street with the CR set at 12.3:1, also how do you find the cooling with such a high CR on the street?
Thanks again for you part in a great thread
Peter
Logged
The fastest beetle in the village
Johannes Persson
Jr. Member
Posts: 67
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #248 on:
February 19, 2008, 09:10:33 am »
Hi Peter,
Good to hear that you like the project.
I use our best pump gas "V-Power" from Shell gas stations, Shell says 99 octane.
When you are using a smaller diameter piston the heat transfer thrue the piston rings to the cylinder are better than with a bigger piston.
The area of a circle increases by the square, the circumference does not, that is why a smaller piston can use higher CR.
I always use the cooling fan from a 1303 bug then you need a really good oil cooler with electrical fan and all your cooling tins has to fit to 100%, no leakage.
Regards
Johannes
Logged
Harry/FDK
Hero Member
Posts: 3613
Every Rule Was Made To Break, Even Callook...
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #249 on:
February 19, 2008, 17:48:43 pm »
Fantastic Project Johannes, Youre a hard working artist !
BTW, maybe you have seen the Topic: Drilling Your Heads (Cooling Fins), by me dummy. Do You have experimented with this ? Or maybe share your thoughts ?
Thanks,
Harry
«
Last Edit: February 19, 2008, 17:52:14 pm by FDK/Hurry
»
Logged
Done ? Not Yet.
sonic
Full Member
Posts: 177
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #250 on:
February 22, 2008, 18:40:35 pm »
Its nearly unbeliveble Johannes
Could sombody go there to witness this , longlivity and torque must be hurting , live in Baastad from time to time ,
like to visit ...
Its more effective than a 1000 RR bike , like whatch that..
Reg
Erich.
"lot more than impressed"...
«
Last Edit: February 22, 2008, 18:42:42 pm by sonic
»
Logged
speedwell
Hero Member
Posts: 14701
the archivist
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #251 on:
February 22, 2008, 22:07:46 pm »
how does it cost for a similar motor
just simple question
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http://speedwell55.skynetblogs.be/
oldspeed 61 standard empi/speedwell
Lee.C
Hero Member
Posts: 6458
I might be an Idiot but I'm not an Arsehole!
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #252 on:
February 23, 2008, 02:38:28 am »
Yeah Johannes lets have a rough idea of hours/cost involved
I would
REALLY
like to know how many hours went into those heads
Logged
You either "Get It" or you don't......
Johannes Persson
Jr. Member
Posts: 67
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #253 on:
February 26, 2008, 08:26:47 am »
Hi there,
I will soon post a list with the parts used in the "Mouse Motor" and prices.
Monkiboy, I have spent between 40 to 50 hours on the heads from start to finish including flow tests and welding.
Regards
Johannes
Logged
Type1/DVK
Sr. Member
Posts: 315
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #254 on:
February 26, 2008, 09:48:56 am »
looking forward to it! (and many others i think
) a whole week in the heads
Logged
DDD#8 - 14.74sec @ 1776cc - Member of: DVK ~ Der Vollgas Kreuzers -
www.ultimatevw.nl
- and racing engines
Udo
Hero Member
Posts: 2077
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #255 on:
February 26, 2008, 18:44:41 pm »
Quote from: Johannes Persson on February 26, 2008, 08:26:47 am
Hi there,
I will soon post a list with the parts used in the "Mouse Motor" and prices.
Monkiboy, I have spent between 40 to 50 hours on the heads from start to finish including flow tests and welding.
Regards
Johannes
Hi Johannes
For German street use i would relocate the spark plugs .
Udo
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www.Udobeckertuning.de
Johannes Persson
Jr. Member
Posts: 67
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #256 on:
February 26, 2008, 22:32:13 pm »
Hello,
Here is the parts list.
Most of the parts are from CB performance but some from CSP in Germany, CSP in Sweden and JPM.
IDA carb kit 1099,95
Heads 043 bare pair 211,9
CB Ti valves 503,6
OTEVA 75 valve springs 185
JPM ti retainer 173
JPM rockers 1046
Push rods 49,95
Push rod tubes 167 CSP
Cam 104
Lifters 22,95
Cam gears Magnum 172 CSP
Bearings 39,85
Oil pump 27,95
Pump cover full flow 28
JE pistons 1206
Cylinder kit 165
Fuel pump block off 4,95
009 dist 109,95
Compufire 63,95
Cables 27,95
Valve covers 12,95
Clips 5,95
Gasket kit 9,95
Oil sealing flywheel 3,95
Clutch disc 29,95
Pressure plate Kennedy 180mm 179
Flywheel bolt 56
Deep sump 105
Lash caps 12,95
Pully 18,95
Pully bolt 4,95
Cyl studs 119
Header S&S 1 5/8 332
Old engine 155
Total parts 6454 USD.
Hopefully I did not forget too many parts.
The time I spent on the total build is aprox 100 hours(night hours).
Regards
Johannes
Logged
Jim Ratto
Hero Member
Posts: 7121
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #257 on:
February 26, 2008, 22:36:22 pm »
Nice of you to take the time to come up and share the list... thanks Johannes
off topic, I am sorry, but could you read my thread in Cal Look section about Porsche valve timing characteristics, powerband, etc?
here it is:
http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php?topic=4395.0
Thank you
Logged
richie
Hero Member
Posts: 5624
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #258 on:
February 27, 2008, 05:48:43 am »
Quote from: Johannes Persson on February 26, 2008, 22:32:13 pm
Hello,
Here is the parts list.
Most of the parts are from CB performance but some from CSP in Germany, CSP in Sweden and JPM.
IDA carb kit 1099,95
Heads 043 bare pair 211,9
CB Ti valves 503,6
OTEVA 75 valve springs 185
JPM ti retainer 173
JPM rockers 1046
Push rods 49,95
Push rod tubes 167 CSP
Cam 104
Lifters 22,95
Cam gears Magnum 172 CSP
Bearings 39,85
Oil pump 27,95
Pump cover full flow 28
JE pistons 1206
Cylinder kit 165
Fuel pump block off 4,95
009 dist 109,95
Compufire 63,95
Cables 27,95
Valve covers 12,95
Clips 5,95
Gasket kit 9,95
Oil sealing flywheel 3,95
Clutch disc 29,95
Pressure plate Kennedy 180mm 179
Flywheel bolt 56
Deep sump 105
Lash caps 12,95
Pully 18,95
Pully bolt 4,95
Cyl studs 119
Header S&S 1 5/8 332
Old engine 155
Total parts 6454 USD.
Hopefully I did not forget too many parts.
The time I spent on the total build is aprox 100 hours(night hours).
Regards
Johannes
Wow,there some pricey parts in there for a little 1600
Johannes which lifters did you use at only 22.95? cheers richie,uk
Logged
Cars are supposed to be driven, not just talked about!!!
Good parts might be expensive but good advice is priceless
Johannes Persson
Jr. Member
Posts: 67
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #259 on:
February 27, 2008, 15:49:00 pm »
Hi Richie,
The lifters are std VW part # 1512 at CB.
Regards
Johannes
Logged
Udo
Hero Member
Posts: 2077
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #260 on:
February 28, 2008, 20:31:28 pm »
Quote from: Jim Ratto on February 26, 2008, 22:36:22 pm
Nice of you to take the time to come up and share the list... thanks Johannes
off topic, I am sorry, but could you read my thread in Cal Look section about Porsche valve timing characteristics, powerband, etc?
here it is:
http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php?topic=4395.0
Thank you
2,0 ltr and 185 hp is the same we had on our last Käfercup circuit engiens . They worked good and the whole race season without problems
Udo
Logged
www.Udobeckertuning.de
n2o
Full Member
Posts: 137
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #261 on:
February 29, 2008, 15:39:50 pm »
Quote from: richie,uk on February 27, 2008, 05:48:43 am
Quote from: Johannes Persson on February 26, 2008, 22:32:13 pm
Hello,
Here is the parts list.
Most of the parts are from CB performance but some from CSP in Germany, CSP in Sweden and JPM.
IDA carb kit 1099,95
Heads 043 bare pair 211,9
CB Ti valves 503,6
OTEVA 75 valve springs 185
JPM ti retainer 173
JPM rockers 1046
Push rods 49,95
Push rod tubes 167 CSP
Cam 104
Lifters 22,95
Cam gears Magnum 172 CSP
Bearings 39,85
Oil pump 27,95
Pump cover full flow 28
JE pistons 1206
Cylinder kit 165
Fuel pump block off 4,95
009 dist 109,95
Compufire 63,95
Cables 27,95
Valve covers 12,95
Clips 5,95
Gasket kit 9,95
Oil sealing flywheel 3,95
Clutch disc 29,95
Pressure plate Kennedy 180mm 179
Flywheel bolt 56
Deep sump 105
Lash caps 12,95
Pully 18,95
Pully bolt 4,95
Cyl studs 119
Header S&S 1 5/8 332
Old engine 155
Total parts 6454 USD.
Hopefully I did not forget too many parts.
The time I spent on the total build is aprox 100 hours(night hours).
Regards
Johannes
Wow,there some pricey parts in there for a little 1600
Johannes which lifters did you use at only 22.95? cheers richie,uk
Are lifters normaly expencive?
In my engines I use STD lifters (made in mexico), and when used with easy cams (nice ramp open/close) like my fk-98, I do not feel the need for anything else. (BTW its a race engine, maybe street engines need other types of lifter)
Logged
9.88 @ 134.25 mph
Jon
Administrator
Hero Member
Posts: 3214
12,3@174km/t at Gardermoen 2008
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #262 on:
March 03, 2008, 09:32:18 am »
Thats exactly it n2o, with K800's you don't need to gamble on lifters, sticking to VW's own.... so am I, until I learn
And a race engine has it easy compared to a street engine...
CHECK out the mouse in the house!!
http://www.griebel.blogspot.com/
Logged
Grumpy old men have signatures like this.
Diederick/DVK
Hero Member
Posts: 3692
They're never done till they're sold
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #263 on:
March 04, 2008, 00:44:28 am »
how about web cams? i read you can't use std lifters with those...
Logged
Diederick
-
Proud member of:
DVK ~
Der Vollgas Kreuzers
Harry/FDK
Hero Member
Posts: 3613
Every Rule Was Made To Break, Even Callook...
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #264 on:
March 05, 2008, 16:39:51 pm »
Webcam with SLR treated Lube-A-Lobes works absolutely perfect for me. (Aircooled.net)
Logged
Done ? Not Yet.
BeetleBug
Hero Member
Posts: 2836
Snabba grabben...
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #265 on:
March 06, 2008, 09:09:27 am »
Quote from: 67-indeed/DVK on March 04, 2008, 00:44:28 am
how about web cams? i read you can't use std lifters with those...
Why not?
Logged
10.41 - 100ci - 1641ccm - 400hp
Diederick/DVK
Hero Member
Posts: 3692
They're never done till they're sold
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #266 on:
March 06, 2008, 17:20:51 pm »
no idea, that's why i'm asking.
lately i've come to a conclusion that stock lifters aren't that bad after all
Logged
Diederick
-
Proud member of:
DVK ~
Der Vollgas Kreuzers
BeetleBug
Hero Member
Posts: 2836
Snabba grabben...
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #267 on:
March 06, 2008, 22:38:32 pm »
As long as you have enough spring pressure I do think every lifter is good enough. To little and every lifter would pit - no matter what.
Best rgs
BB
Logged
10.41 - 100ci - 1641ccm - 400hp
71CALRIPPER
Hero Member
Posts: 1530
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #268 on:
March 07, 2008, 10:38:25 am »
Having just read this thread while eating my cereal at work , i have a massive grin on my face.
Well done guys !!!
Logged
n2o
Full Member
Posts: 137
Re: Small powerhouses and old school
«
Reply #269 on:
March 07, 2008, 20:30:10 pm »
Quote from: 54caldub on March 07, 2008, 10:38:25 am
Having just read this thread while eating my cereal at work , i have a massive grin on my face.
Well done guys !!!
That must have been a big bowl of cereal..
Logged
9.88 @ 134.25 mph
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