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Author Topic: Bigger Idle jet holders on a 1776ccm with IDA`s ?  (Read 11290 times)
Felix/DFL
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« on: July 25, 2009, 21:06:29 pm »
Hi Guys,

I have a Problem with my 1776ccm running on IDA`s. I searched a bit through the forum and found some really good stuff that got my problem to the point.
The problem is the transition from idle to main circuit and that problem is not really Rpm addicted (that is one interesting point that Rasser found out, and I have that same phenomenon) but comes in very hard at cruising at about 3500rpm@110km/h.

Engine spec:
1776ccm, W125, 1,25:1 Rockers, 043 Heads ported and opened with orig. 35,5x32 valves,CR 10,5; 1 1/2 header with glaspack

The reading of my lamda meter drops to Lambda=0,7(A/F=10,3) and the car starts to (don`t know how to say it in english) spot-delay.So it really drives shit at those rich spots...
I have read that most people go for an 110-115 idle jet holder on 2ltr+ engines.
So could it be that a bigger jet holder size will solve my problem? I wanted to hear an other thinking before drilling maybe someone solved this problem with a bigger jet holder on such a tiny engine  Wink
Tested jetting with many combinations as F11,F7, 125-140 main, idle 65-70 (the car ran way smoother with the 65) but the problem was everytime the same...

Jetting is: 37 Vents, F7, 3rd hole, 55 idle, 130 Main, 160 Aircorrection  and orig. 120 idle jet holders.
I have jetted the engine with a lambdameter and have good readings from 0,85-0,95 to 7000 U/min.

Maybe the Problem could even be from the 3rd progression hole I drilled? To much fuel at a bit throttle open...
So this time more thinking before I drill Roll Eyes
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Rick Meredith
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« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2009, 21:16:01 pm »
I ran much smaller Venturis on my 1776 to get it to respond well I think I was running like 34mm but it was so many years ago.
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lawrence
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« Reply #2 on: July 25, 2009, 21:16:49 pm »
I would try a 180 or 200 air corrector and also try a smaller idle jet holder, but not at the same time Grin so you can see which change makes the biggest difference.
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Felix/DFL
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« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2009, 21:35:34 pm »
Smaller venturis are on the list but have to be made as there is nothing to buy as I know.
Anyway the engines runs pretty strong and good with all that stuff but has that anoying hole at transition...I overhelmed that hole at the trips before cause I ran 4000rpm+  at the Autobahn  Wink

I tryed bigger air-correction 175,180,200,220. The 160 work perfect. With the bigger air-jets the engine tended to lean out at high revs.

My thinking is that the bigger jet holder will mix more air at high idle speed (3000-3500) so it doesn`t run to fat at those flat spots...
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speedwell
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« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2009, 22:22:41 pm »
 Wink
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stealth67vw
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« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2009, 01:26:38 am »
Quote from: Felix/DFL on July 25, 2009, 21:06:29 pm
Hi Guys,

I have a Problem with my 1776ccm running on IDA`s. I searched a bit through the forum and found some really good stuff that got my problem to the point.
The problem is the transition from idle to main circuit and that problem is not really Rpm addicted (that is one interesting point that Rasser found out, and I have that same phenomenon) but comes in very hard at cruising at about 3500rpm@110km/h.

Engine spec:
1776ccm, W125, 1,25:1 Rockers, 043 Heads ported and opened with orig. 35,5x32 valves,CR 10,5; 1 1/2 header with glaspack

The reading of my lamda meter drops to Lambda=0,7(A/F=10,3) and the car starts to (don`t know how to say it in english) spot-delay.So it really drives shit at those rich spots...
I have read that most people go for an 110-115 idle jet holder on 2ltr+ engines.
So could it be that a bigger jet holder size will solve my problem? I wanted to hear an other thinking before drilling maybe someone solved this problem with a bigger jet holder on such a tiny engine  Wink
Tested jetting with many combinations as F11,F7, 125-140 main, idle 65-70 (the car ran way smoother with the 65) but the problem was everytime the same...

Jetting is: 37 Vents, F7, 3rd hole, 55 idle, 130 Main, 160 Aircorrection  and orig. 120 idle jet holders.
I have jetted the engine with a lambdameter and have good readings from 0,85-0,95 to 7000 U/min.

Maybe the Problem could even be from the 3rd progression hole I drilled? To much fuel at a bit throttle open...
So this time more thinking before I drill Roll Eyes
Boy, that is my 1776 combo to a tee except 40 x 35.5 valves and 1 5/8 header. I tried 34mm vents with no change to the transition. My jetting was 135 main, 180 air, 55 idle, 120 holder, F7 e-tubes and 37 vents. Ratto and Jerry Young (Buggy House)tried jetting out the stumble but it still remained and I just tolerated it. I wish I would have tried the 110 or 115 idle holder. I think a bigger holder would only perpetuate the problem.
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John Bates
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« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2009, 09:10:14 am »
Given that you have the 3rd hole drilled, my advice is try a 115 jet holder. Keep your original 120 holders, buy four spare ones (size 60 or 100) and then drill them.
Floats height is ok? When you drilled the 3rd hole, did you keep the same pattern as in the original Weber IDAs (the late ones that came with 3rd hole from factory)? I don't know if that is very important, but I remember reading that a wrong pattern could lead to some problems...  Embarrassed
Finally, I'd keep the 37mm venturis.
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Bruce
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« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2009, 17:40:18 pm »
Quote from: Felix/DFL on July 25, 2009, 21:06:29 pm
Engine spec:
1776ccm, W125, 1,25:1 Rockers, 043 Heads ported and opened with orig. 35,5x32 valves,CR 10,5; 1 1/2 header with glaspack

Tested jetting with many combinations as F11,F7, 125-140 main, idle 65-70 (the car ran way smoother with the 65) but the problem was everytime the same...

Jetting is: 37 Vents, F7, 3rd hole, 55 idle, 130 Main, 160 Aircorrection  and orig. 120 idle jet holders.
Time to try a 60?

BTW, you should change the 1.25 rockers for some stock 1.1 rockers.  The bigger rockers won't make any more hp with your tiny valves, all they'll do is beat up your valvetrain.
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Tom G.
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« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2009, 22:40:19 pm »
Quote from: Felix/DFL on July 25, 2009, 21:35:34 pm
Smaller venturis are on the list but have to be made as there is nothing to buy as I know.
Anyway the engines runs pretty strong and good with all that stuff but has that anoying hole at transition...I overhelmed that hole at the trips before cause I ran 4000rpm+  at the Autobahn  Wink

I tryed bigger air-correction 175,180,200,220. The 160 work perfect. With the bigger air-jets the engine tended to lean out at high revs.

My thinking is that the bigger jet holder will mix more air at high idle speed (3000-3500) so it doesn`t run to fat at those flat spots...

Hi Felix

My Idas run now on my 2litre std-heads(35,5x32) engine after a lot of research with 34 vents , 3rd progression hole, 145Main,170Air, 55 Idle, 110 idle jet holder....Very smooth know...8,5-9l fuel on 100km (100km/h trip)....Mallory Hyfire ignition...0,8-0,9 afr all the way...

I have get my 34mm vents (50$ 4 pieces) from here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/A-PAIR-OF-CHOKES-MAIN-VENTURIS-WEBER-48-IDA_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZQ7c293Q3a1Q7c294Q3a30QQ_trksidZp4634Q2ec0Q2em14Q2el1262QQhashZitem4142aacd4bQQitemZ280291364171QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

Good luck...
Bye
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stealth67vw
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« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2009, 03:17:53 am »
Quote from: Tom G. on July 26, 2009, 22:40:19 pm
Quote from: Felix/DFL on July 25, 2009, 21:35:34 pm
Smaller venturis are on the list but have to be made as there is nothing to buy as I know.
Anyway the engines runs pretty strong and good with all that stuff but has that anoying hole at transition...I overhelmed that hole at the trips before cause I ran 4000rpm+  at the Autobahn  Wink

I tryed bigger air-correction 175,180,200,220. The 160 work perfect. With the bigger air-jets the engine tended to lean out at high revs.

My thinking is that the bigger jet holder will mix more air at high idle speed (3000-3500) so it doesn`t run to fat at those flat spots...

Hi Felix

My Idas run now on my 2litre std-heads(35,5x32) engine after a lot of research with 34 vents , 3rd progression hole, 145Main,170Air, 55 Idle, 110 idle jet holder....Very smooth know...8,5-9l fuel on 100km (100km/h trip)....Mallory Hyfire ignition...0,8-0,9 afr all the way...

I have get my 34mm vents (50$ 4 pieces) from here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/A-PAIR-OF-CHOKES-MAIN-VENTURIS-WEBER-48-IDA_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZQ7c293Q3a1Q7c294Q3a30QQ_trksidZp4634Q2ec0Q2em14Q2el1262QQhashZitem4142aacd4bQQitemZ280291364171QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

Good luck...
Bye

Beware, I bought some 40mm vents from them 3 months ago and they came in with a .006" oversize outside dimension. They would happily exchange them but I'm a machinist and spent 15 minutes turning them down. It would have taken me 5 times as long plus waiting another week to exchange them so I just turned them down myself.
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John Bates
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Tom G.
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« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2009, 08:25:02 am »
Quote from: stealth67vw on July 27, 2009, 03:17:53 am
Quote from: Tom G. on July 26, 2009, 22:40:19 pm
Quote from: Felix/DFL on July 25, 2009, 21:35:34 pm
Smaller venturis are on the list but have to be made as there is nothing to buy as I know.
Anyway the engines runs pretty strong and good with all that stuff but has that anoying hole at transition...I overhelmed that hole at the trips before cause I ran 4000rpm+  at the Autobahn  Wink

I tryed bigger air-correction 175,180,200,220. The 160 work perfect. With the bigger air-jets the engine tended to lean out at high revs.

My thinking is that the bigger jet holder will mix more air at high idle speed (3000-3500) so it doesn`t run to fat at those flat spots...

Hi Felix

My Idas run now on my 2litre std-heads(35,5x32) engine after a lot of research with 34 vents , 3rd progression hole, 145Main,170Air, 55 Idle, 110 idle jet holder....Very smooth know...8,5-9l fuel on 100km (100km/h trip)....Mallory Hyfire ignition...0,8-0,9 afr all the way...

I have get my 34mm vents (50$ 4 pieces) from here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/A-PAIR-OF-CHOKES-MAIN-VENTURIS-WEBER-48-IDA_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZQ7c293Q3a1Q7c294Q3a30QQ_trksidZp4634Q2ec0Q2em14Q2el1262QQhashZitem4142aacd4bQQitemZ280291364171QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

Good luck...
Bye

Beware, I bought some 40mm vents from them 3 months ago and they came in with a .006" oversize outside dimension. They would happily exchange them but I'm a machinist and spent 15 minutes turning them down. It would have taken me 5 times as long plus waiting another week to exchange them so I just turned them down myself.


my vents had great fitting..:-) no modification was needed..
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Bruce
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« Reply #11 on: July 27, 2009, 09:46:58 am »
Quote from: stealth67vw on July 27, 2009, 03:17:53 am
.....but I'm a machinist .....

Huh? 
I'm not a machinist, but I still made my own venturis.
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Felix/DFL
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« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2009, 11:49:49 am »
Hi everyone,

thank you all for that good and helpfull comments!

First I will try 110 jet holders than 115. The 60 idle is even on the list as it drives not so smooth as with the 65.
When I tryed some combos I will report what happened.

@Spedwell: Boy is that a dirty engine.From who is it???  Cheesy

@ John B: 40x35,5 + 1 5/8 header would be my dream 1776! The heads restrict the motor a lot.Now it`s running mid 15`s those parts will definetly let it in then 14`s.But 2,2l is on it`s way so no big changes on that one.

@ Bruce: I first drove the 1,1:1 rockers and now steped up with the 1,25:1 just to test what happens as they were laying around. And there is a differnce how the engines reaches 7000rpm.With the 1,25 it reaches it way faster.Only the response under 2000prm is a little bit badder but who carres. I think it depends on the max rev you have in sight.Up to 6000rpm everything pretty is simmilar...

Another cool test would be to mount the 1,25er only at the Exhaust valves.But it`s really time robbing to set side play when changing rockers...
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stealth67vw
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« Reply #13 on: July 28, 2009, 00:06:02 am »
Quote from: Bruce on July 27, 2009, 09:46:58 am
Quote from: stealth67vw on July 27, 2009, 03:17:53 am
.....but I'm a machinist .....

Huh? 
I'm not a machinist, but I still made my own venturis.
Good for you, you want a cookie?  Grin Not everybody has access to a lathe or turning experience. I was merely mentioned that my set came in over sized and I had the lathe and the know how to turn them down. I didn't have the time or an available lathe at the time I bought them.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2009, 00:08:29 am by stealth67vw » Logged
John Bates
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Jim Ratto
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« Reply #14 on: July 28, 2009, 00:23:23 am »
My opinion: the 55 idles are too small. How many turns out are you needing to turn out mixtures to get a smooth even idle?
it sounds backwards, but I have seen it many times on smaller-cc engines with big carbs. The carbs get such a weak vacuum signal in the metering circuits, that it takes a larger jet for the carbs to "feel" what the motor wants. Now be clear, it isn't that the engine "wants more" when carbs are shut (idle), it is when you open all 4 48mm butterflies and all that is above are 4 big 37mm tunnels. That's a good setup for 3000-7000rpm, but on a smaller cc engine, you need to make up for it. John Rayburn and Sarge turned me onto adjusting sizing of idle air holder and it did wonders for my car's transition.... with only 2 prog holes. I was @ 120 and went 110. But bigger cc's, more vacuum, etc... different ball game.
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Bruce
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« Reply #15 on: July 28, 2009, 04:16:05 am »
Quote from: Felix/DFL on July 27, 2009, 11:49:49 am
......   I first drove the 1,1:1 rockers and now steped up with the 1,25:1 just to test what happens as they were laying around. And there is a differnce how the engines reaches 7000rpm.  With the 1,25 it reaches it way faster.  Only the response under 2000prm is a little bit badder but who carres.  I think it depends on the max rev you have in sight.  Up to 6000rpm everything pretty is simmilar....
This sounds a lot like you are lofting the valve/lifter.  It's kinda like floating the valve.  The valve gets thrown open for more duration than the cam has.

Every valve has a lift value where it reaches peak flow.  Lifting it more does not result in more flow.  The amount of lift depends on the diameter of the valve.  IOW, a 42mm valve when lifted from .500 to .550 will flow more at .550".  But a stock 35mm valve will not flow more at .550 than at .500.

The flow limit of a stock valve is not even near the lift of a 1.1:1 rocker (.460").  Opening it to .523" (with 1.25s) only stresses the valve train more.
Putting 1.25 rockers (W-125 cam) on a 32 mm stock exh valve is even more pointless.
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Jim Ratto
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« Reply #16 on: July 28, 2009, 16:13:22 pm »
for 35.5mm intake, about .435" is about practical limit. Wonder why 110 Engle works well with stock heads?
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Tom G.
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« Reply #17 on: July 29, 2009, 08:52:30 am »
Hey Guys..

A lot of guys undervalue the performance potential of STD valve heads Grin Grin

Stock Valves are working with 48 IDAs really well in my car (1955ccm, 35,5x32 valves, 48IDAss 34vents....9,5s 1/8 mile, 15,5s 1/4 mile)

Here little video me and a 30HP Vespa motorcycle....I had no chance and my clutch was slipping in the 3rd gear, but who cares.... Grin Grin

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/wEgI5aHJEdA" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/wEgI5aHJEdA</a>

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/8li8oBn64WM" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/8li8oBn64WM</a> (1:16min)

I drive with a german cam with a very wide performance range (2000-6500). These cam doesnt stresse so much the valve train because of the rounder cam ramps...


Bye
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Felix/DFL
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« Reply #18 on: July 30, 2009, 12:24:48 pm »
Quote from: Bruce on July 28, 2009, 04:16:05 am
Quote from: Felix/DFL on July 27, 2009, 11:49:49 am
......   I first drove the 1,1:1 rockers and now steped up with the 1,25:1 just to test what happens as they were laying around. And there is a differnce how the engines reaches 7000rpm.  With the 1,25 it reaches it way faster.  Only the response under 2000prm is a little bit badder but who carres.  I think it depends on the max rev you have in sight.  Up to 6000rpm everything pretty is simmilar....
This sounds a lot like you are lofting the valve/lifter.  It's kinda like floating the valve.  The valve gets thrown open for more duration than the cam has.

Every valve has a lift value where it reaches peak flow.  Lifting it more does not result in more flow.  The amount of lift depends on the diameter of the valve.  IOW, a 42mm valve when lifted from .500 to .550 will flow more at .550".  But a stock 35mm valve will not flow more at .550 than at .500.

The flow limit of a stock valve is not even near the lift of a 1.1:1 rocker (.460").  Opening it to .523" (with 1.25s) only stresses the valve train more.
Putting 1.25 rockers (W-125 cam) on a 32 mm stock exh valve is even more pointless.

Hi Bruce,

thank ya for the advice and that good thougts but I want to test and see what the 1/4 times say. If the valves were already lifting apart that would result even more lift and the power would drop.
I drove that 1776 before with a W120 1,1 and 1,25 rockers.The 1,25 made better results. Never had a valvetrain stress problem. Tha heads, valves and seats are hardly modified so I think not comparable with normal 35,5 valves.

I know that formular of calculating the valve lift but as it comes to VW`s sometimes the calculating doesn`t get the best. Look at the 48 carbs on a 2 liter, if you look what the books say it`s way to large...
Track or dyno would tell.

The flowbench tests are a good instrument to look what happens at static points but don`t tell the 100% truth when it comes to dynamic flow.Sadly I have never worked on a flowbench that would be fun! Could you make a test where 7000U/min are reproduced that is much capacity that is pulled by the piston...Is so much flow possible on a flow bench?

I have got myself a 1,1 drill and will modify my jet holders next time wrenching.Plan is to close the existing hole and drill a hole next to it.
But I am a bit curious if it really helps as it will mix less air to the idle jets.But again the street will tell Wink

Best Greetings!
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deano
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« Reply #19 on: July 30, 2009, 16:26:15 pm »
130 main jet sounds too small to me. For years, I ran a 1700cc with 37mm venturis, 9.0, Engle 110, 40x32, 1-1/2, and used a 140 main.... When I then installed a 78mm crank (with better heads), I bumped the mains to 145s...
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Rasser
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« Reply #20 on: August 01, 2009, 23:10:18 pm »
Just to get this right....  the mixture gets rich at about 3500 rpm (transistion from idle to main circuit), and starts to run bad because it gets way to much fuel, right?

I too had/have this problem.
Things I found that created this problem or made it worse was:
-Making your idle jet holder smaller
-3. progression hole.

What I did to help this problem was to close the 3. progression hole.

Allthough my mixture still gets a little to rich in the transistion, then it is much better than it was before with the 3. progression hole.
If I didn´t have an AFR meter then I would never have known that it was rich, because it feels as though it runs perfect - good throttle response etc. etc.
The rich spot is only noticeable at an interval of 10-15km/h  (115-130km/h), and will only show at steady cruising speed. I tried to run without the main jets to try and get a feel of when and how the mains kicked in and when the idles leaned out, this was very helpfull in the understanding. You can clearly see the mains kicking in to strong when it is still running on the idle circuit (this is offcourse with the all the jets in ;-)). I will have to make a few testruns with bigger main air jets to see if I can get it spot on (smaller vacuum signal on the main circuit).


I run 55/90  and 130/180 F11, 90 or 100 idlejet holders were what I needed to help a dead spot when slooooowly accelerating with the engine running below 2000 rpm (90 worked best, and really gave a strong signal to the idle circut when cruising at low rpms). But making the idle jet holder smaller increases the mixture in the transistion.

Try closing the 3. progression hole!
« Last Edit: August 01, 2009, 23:21:15 pm by Rasser » Logged
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Felix/DFL
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« Reply #21 on: August 02, 2009, 15:47:40 pm »
Hi !
Thank ya for that good advices! I will close the 3rd progression hole and see what happens. Then play with the idle jet holder.So you other young IDA guys TEST before you drill !!!  Roll Eyes

@Deano: Yep, you are right that main jet is to small. I now drive to jet setups...

One for steady Autobahn cruising:
Idle=60,main=125,Air=175. The problem of transition is still present but not so worse. But you can`t pull hard from a light as the engine leans out to Lambda=1,1 - 1,2.

One for track: Idle=65,main=140,Air=130. That setup gave me a new best 1/4 mile ET at the weekend...
15,105sec@139,81km/h, 60ft= 2,1sec, 1/8 mile= 9,572sec (Street tires)

I tested around with some setups (15,3sec - high 15,2sec) and looking at my Lamdameter at 3rd gear (I am so slow I have that time  Wink ) it was always around Lambda=1-1. So I went richer on main (15,2sec) and than 15,1 with the 130 air-jet.
The 1,25 rockers do there work very well. The first and best times with IDA`s & 1,1 rockers this year were a high 15,6sec. Only sad thing is that the valvetrain sounds a bit rougher now but no problems till yet.
The BIG Problem with those 2 jet-setups is that when you drive around with Autobahnsetting and somebody wants to play at the lights you have to let him go.I had that situatuion yesterday when I went back from a 1/8 track. At a light a Audi Q7/3.0 TDI pulled hard. At first I let him way behind me but as the engine leaned out so heavy I heared the first pings so back from the gas and he flew away... Angry That needs to change!

@Rasser: How did you close the 3rd hole? From the throttle side ? With Epoxy, or metal out of the tube?

Let the good times roll,
Felix
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Bruce
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« Reply #22 on: August 02, 2009, 17:23:18 pm »
Quote from: Felix/DFL on August 02, 2009, 15:47:40 pm
Only sad thing is that the valvetrain sounds a bit rougher now but no problems till yet.
When you break your valve springs, replace them with new ones.  You will notice the car going slower with new springs, until they go soft like your existing springs.
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Rasser
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« Reply #23 on: August 02, 2009, 20:34:39 pm »
Yes I used 2 component "metal" epoxy.

Great bonding on the aluminium and resistent too gasoline.  No problems!

I stuffed it in from the throttle bore, and held something against it from the other side (removed the access screw to the transistion holes).
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Rasser
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« Reply #24 on: August 02, 2009, 22:43:04 pm »

Oh and one more thing... When you have closed the 3. progression hole, you will probably see your mixture getting a bit richer at lower rpm and then lean out some when you get to 3500 rpm (the rpm where you had your rich spot earlier, eventhough it sounds a bit high in rpm to be so much affected by the idle circuit?!). Reason for this I guess is because when you had opened your throttle a little, and you had maybe 2 progression holes beneath the throttle plate, then you still had 1 hole above the plate. When the idle mixture is then beeing sucked down through the idle circuit channels, towards the progression holes, then the vacuum below the throttle plate also sucks some air in from the progression hole(s) that are above the throttle plate. When closing this 3. hole, then all the vacuum is pulling the mixture from ONLY the idle mixture channels.
At least that´s my best guess - I saw the mixture change like this when I closed the 3. hole.

It takes some really carefull and steady driving to see exactly what is happening with the mixture when you change - throttleposition/rpm/speed.
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1955 type1
1966 type2 13w deluxe
Felix/DFL
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« Reply #25 on: September 01, 2009, 11:57:08 am »
So I closed the 3rd hole and the problem was mainly solved.
But on that test-drive an other problem occured...

The valve holders "keys" failed away and the spring came lose. Valve was then stoped by the piston...
I had pretty luck cause only the valve and the valvesupport in the head is damaged. So it`s fixable...

Good point: More time now to build that 2,2l
Bad Point: Dragday only as a viewer...

So the shimed harder single springs aren`t that good for extensive rev`s with that W125 & 1,25er Rockers...

Hmmmh...

I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat:I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat: I will listen to Bruce. Repeat:
« Last Edit: September 02, 2009, 08:39:13 am by Felix/DFL » Logged
Diederick/DVK
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« Reply #26 on: September 01, 2009, 12:09:34 pm »
looks like you got lucky there!
but too bad the notch won't be there in bitburg...
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Diederick
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Jim Ratto
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« Reply #27 on: September 01, 2009, 18:50:10 pm »
make sure when spring and retainer is assembled that the two halves of keepers do not touch one another. If they do grind them a bit so they do not. This will help save keepers and slow the wear on grooves on valves.

sincerely,
Jim R.
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