The Cal-look Lounge

You guys think an FK-45 is too much for a 1914? Engine will be running some UD non-welded 40x35 heads, 1 5/8 exhaust, 44 IDFs, 8.5-9 CR, stock gears. This engine is more of a cruiser than a bruiser and will see some long distance driving in the Manx. My original plans were for a w120 but I happen to have a FK-45 already that I dont have a use for atm.

edit:

Here are the specs on the cam and a few others for comparison:

FK-45   295º   263º   0.401"   10.19   108º   
W-120   294º   253º   0.397"   10.08   108º   
W-125   301º   262º   0.418"   10.62   108º   
FK-8   298º   266º   0.382"    9.70   108º   

Its a little bigger than the w-120. The FK-8 has also been recommended.

Thanks,

--louis

After running the numbers I think the FK-45 is too big. It looks like the w-125 w/ stock ratio rockers might be the best choice.

--louis

Ask Jeff.

The K8 with 40 x 35 heads and big-ish carbs is a winner recipe for pump gas thrasher motor. I've driven a few 1914's with 125 cams and they didn't have the wall of power that the K8 motors did. No disrespect to 125, as it rates up top in my scale of favorite cams, but I think the K8 works better with the 69mm crank.
1835 w/ K8 and above combo is pretty visceral too. 1776 with the same can work, although, it's getting on the ragged edge.

I think the duration @ .050 shown for K8 is wrong. From memory, it's 258.
It would be my choice for what you're doing.

Your right its listed as 258 on the Engle web site. That just seems like a lot of cam for such a small motor. Thought it looks to be smaller than the w-125 if I am reading it right. If the motor makes 120 - 130 HP I will be happy.

Thanks,

--louis

put an engle 140 in it   ;D ;D ;D

Er, no thanks. I am trying to keep this engine from getting out of control.  ;)  Rotating assembly has been bought except the cam. Now I just need to sell a kidney so I can buy some carbs and those heads.

Thanks,

--louis

K8 to me is perfect cam for 1800-2000cc. For bigger motors, i.e. 2100cc+, it works well as a Bus cam.

K8 sure works well in Darrell Bomgarrs 2165.  It made 180 at the rear wheels and is very driveable!

Louis the fk45 does not seem big when the specs are compared between the cams you listed. They all read very similar to me. I say run the 45.

Thing is, the specs louis posted only show part of the picture. We see advertised duration and duration @ .050 but nothing in between. I ran the FK45, and with 1.4's it was too hard on my valvetrain. And, relative to other cams I have run, it didn't impress.

louis, if you're only after 130hp you could build a replica of the 1914 John Holleran built earlier that made 139 @ the wheels on Kadrons. Nothing magic in that motor.

Ask Jeff.

how adult

What were the specs on that motor? My main goals is to have an engine that will push the buggy to freeway speeds, 70 mph, for hours on end and be peppy to drive around town. It doesn't need to be the fastest car in the valley and if it never sees the low side of 15s, that's fine. I want it to be low compression, reliable, and smooth. I want to be able to drive it across town or across country without any fuss or having to replace valve springs every 10,000 miles. This is just a little pusher motor that is designed to get the Manx on the road as quickly as possible for the least amount of cost. It doesn't have to get 100,000 miles but I would like it to be reliable enough to drive to Baja or Resume Speed, North Dakota without any worries and keep up with modern traffic on the way. The engine I imagine falls some where in between a daily driver and the fire breathers we are most used to build around here. I am also trying to keep the cost down as I still have the '66 to build as well. Any input is appreciated.

Thanks,

--louis+

dude, a 1915 in a Manx is more than enough. Trust me. My friend had a stock cam, stock valve, Kadron motor in his buggy and it scared me ghost white. I know you're case is bored for 94mm, so you're stuck going with some derivative of 94 bore. Honestly, you don't need to go wild... you'll end up with a real handful with that short wheelbase and no weight. Make it all cc, no need to wind the crap out of the thing if you just want to cruise it.

I bet stock valved heads, Kadrons, and a mild cam would keep you smiling.
Ask Jeff.

That is what I am getting at, I don't think I need that much motor. So I am back to the w-120 or maybe even a w-110. Kads would help keep the costs down.

Thanks,

--louis

LOL I've been reading this all day thinking "that combo in a Manx in gonna be a HOOT."  Doesn't take much in those little cars.

Mark Herbert's stuff always ran good with Jeff's non welded heads and W120's and 125's.

Very true and louis says that he does not want to change springs every 10k miles. I imagine that my 1914, which is a moderate hot rod engine, would be crazy in a manx. John is right as well. Talk to the head porter, he will have a good opinion.

I was trying to find the material Mark wrote about his 1915 combo but it seems to have disappeared. I seem to remember he was a big fan of the w-120. I think that is what I have decided to go with. Thanks for all the input from everyone. Unless you build a lot of engines, there are so many variables its some times hard to make a decision. No wonder everyone runs around with cookie cutter engines these day.

Thanks,

--louis

Also had stuff run good with a FK46. ;D

I've read a lot's of things about 1915. It seemed to be the best engine for bucks you can build for now.

A french engine builder advice to use a webcam 218 with a 108LC, "cleaned" 041 semi heads with 8*1cr, kadrons with 34 vents and a merged exhaust to reach something like 120hp @ 5300rpm and lot's of torque from 2500 to the top.

A wilder combo is to use a w125 with ported and polished 044heads 40x35 valves 9*1 cr, dual 40 mm carbs with 34vents (Dellorto seems to be a good choice as their idle circuit is better than weber and don't get clogged so quickly), 41mm header. Power until 7.000rpm and good reliability.

Here are the specs on that cam. I have heard good things on that cam as well. The split duration seems to work well with smaller carbs.

218/119   280º   242º   0.455"   11.56   108º   Dual lobe; off-road competition; Class 1/2 1600
   276º   240º   0.422"   10.72   108º   Excellent torque!


Thanks,

--louis

The 218 and 218/119 are not the same cam. I think the dual lobe is good for an engine with stock heads, stock CR and small carb.

sorry to say this JF but i run a 218/119 and heads are not stock and CR is 8.5 carbs are 42DCNFs. the cam has a lot off potential and i know people running 1776's and 1914's with it and those people run high 14's and the engine is dead-reliable and can get you everywhere. from what i heard it might be a 'better' w110.

That's what I've understand about this cam.

And you are right, it's a better w110.

the 43 would be my pick with the low rated 1.4s. UD  

Here?  http://www.cal-look.com/tech_building_fast_reliable_engines1.shtml

One of my fav's.

I had not thought of that one.

FK-43   281º   250º   0.383"    9.83   108º   New cam

Looks like it would produce a lot of torque. Thanks for the input Jeff.


I could have swore there was more to that article than what is posted there. I thought he had a couple of recipes for engines posted some where.

--louis

I have not read that in a while; good stuff. Louis there are a couple pages. Scroll to the bottom and it says "continue" on the right.

(http://cacklinrose.files.wordpress.com/2009/08/homer-simpson-doh.jpg)

--louis

Anyway, here is the section on Mark H's 1914 recipe:

Here are some of my own motor combinations that have worked well for me. All cams listed are Engle brand. 1914cc, 94x69

This motor can be built with smaller cylinders but the low RPM torque will suffer slightly. 94 Cima pistons, 69 counterweighted crank, stock weight flywheel, stock rods. All balanced. 110 cam (285dur x .430lift) You can use 1.25 rockers if you want or a VZ25 cam with stock rockers. Solid shaft kit for rockers, thin-wall chromoly pushrods. 040 stock VW heads fully ported with reshaped and hemicut chambers, a competition valve job with dual springs. Compression ratio for bus, 7 to1 for bug 7.5 to 1. 1 1/2 " header with 2" turbo muffler. Dual Kadrons or 42 Webers or 36/40 Dellortos. 40 Webers can work but they need bigger 32to34 mm venturies. Also a single 36 Dellorto or a 40 Weber can work with an isolated runner manifold but they get bad mileage and they make your motor slower. 009 distributor and Bosch blue coil. This motor can be used with heater boxes if it is used mostly for around town driving. If you drive at sustained freeway speeds the heads will be cracked in no time. I really think heater boxes should only be used on an almost stock motor. This motor will make any VW a really fun car to drive. You will go from having a stock anemic slug to a car that has effortless power. This motor can also be revved fairly high and will make power well into the RPM range.


Looks like a good motor for what I want to do, minus the semi-hemi.

--louis

I did the exact same thing. Where are the other pages? Thought id help you out ;D That 1914 sounds like a ton of fun.

here is what mark ran on the black car when he was going round and round and round  ;D.some guy i think his name is denham did them.  40x37.5. before the cnc  ::) had landed .btw it was a partial hemi not fully blended to sealing serface. one of his neg deck engines.UD . 
 

Negative deck? ... interesting. Do the heads still have the step in the chambers, Jeff?
Love to hear/see more about this.

Thanks for sharing UD.

W120 is one of my all time favorite cams. love to use it in moderate street motors.

yes tom the step is still there i bored it origanaly for 96 power sleevs on his 94s. i think it was at least .060 sticking out the top of the cly. sorry to hijack your thread louis ill be good now .  ;). ud .

there's why I tell guys to call Jeff and get heads from him!

 8)

Whats a good hi-jack among friends. That's actually pretty cool. And your input is always welcome.

--louis

Yep, your the one that told me to call Jeff about doing my other heads and as soon as I get the money together I will be in touch about doing this set. I just bought a rebuilt tranny for the Manx so it will probably be next month.

Thanks,

--louis

This is the cam I decided to go with. Just ordered it a little while ago. Its a web cam grind that falls in between the 110  & 120 and is close to the VZ-25 grind.

163   284º   249º   0.422"   10.72   108º   Hot street; wide power band

Going to run 1.1 rockers. Now I need to decide on carbs. Kads, 36 Dells or 40 IDFs. I kind of want to do the Dells just to be a bit different but the kads are cheaper.

--louis

I like those numbers. I was going to suggest the Web 110 based on experience with that cam in a few motors, but not too sure how well it would run with 2 cyl per venturi (Kadron).  I think the 163 is one step milder than their 110? The 163 looks alot like the factory 912 / 356 Super 90 cam. Should give good throttle response and go 5500 or so. With that said I would use about a 32-34mm venturi if you run 2 2-throat carbs.

Its a little warmer than the 110 but not much. I am leaning towards the 2  2 barrel carbs. One of the reasons I decided to go ahead with the Manx and put the '66 on hold for a bit is to get some exp with building and tuning VW motors before I have to deal with the 2332 & IDAs. Plus not having a VW to drive is killing me and the '66 is at least a five year project. If the assembly of the 1914 goes well I am thinking of building the 2332 myself.

W-110   284º   247º   0.392"    9.96   108º

163   284º   249º   0.422"   10.72   108º   

VZ-25   286º   256º   0.429"   10.90   108º

Thanks for all the input guys.

--louis

No, I meant WEBCAM 110. Not Engle. Take a look @ Web 110. It's the biz in moderate street motors 1700-2000

256 @ .050, I think 286 adv, .435" @ valve (I run it with 1.25). In 2 liters, your mom can putt putt it around or scream it up to 6K.
In smaller cc, it shreds.

Ooh. Okay, that makes more sense.  :-[

--louis

no worries dude... happens all the time.  ;D

besides, on the eighth day God made Owsley.

put the REAL carbs on not them sgl throat piles of GOO.   soory but i cant stand an engine that idels like a FUELER. i like smooooooooth. UD .

What compression was he running and what header system.

Stay away from the FK40 series. They destroy things, - fast. FK8 is good in a 1914. If you want the 40 series, get one of Massive´s with a fatter lobe, or go all the way and buy a Raptor cam. Then you can run lightweight valve train and single Oteva Springs, - and turn 7500 without valvefloat, AND get more power at the same time.
The 218/119 is good in smaller engines or engines in general with dual sgl. barrel carbs as Kadrons. They idle at best when retarded 2 degress with Kads. Less valve train noise than the W110. With good flowing heads you need to run mild dual springs, or light valve train, because it will rev to just under 7k
Frankly I do not believe those huge HP #´s that came out with a former menthioned Kadron fed engine. 139 hp at the wheel equals at least 155 hp at the flywheel. for a race engine, sure, a street engine, Hmmmm.

T