The Cal-look Lounge

 Hi Guys..

 I was thinking about the possibilities of building a stout budget engine using std rods.
 Do you guys have any idea about the "abuse" stock rods can handle?
 How many revs/HP's or what size crank would be the limit for those rods...

 Thanks, Jordy ;)

Good question I too would like some more info on this  :)

They are very overbuilt! I believe Mark H saying that you can give them up to about 170hp with no problems. Just make sure they are balanced well.

 And for $ 35,- for a set of rebuild/rebushed they're not expensive at all...

 Is it possible/recommended to use ARP 2k bolts with stock rods?

yes it is jordy, i have the feeling you've been reading my mind  ;)
our ideas are pretty similar  :)

 Well my tight budget got me thinking. Why pay $214,- if a set of $35,- will do the same trick...
 The same with lifters if $32,- Mahles are okay for now, why pay a $110,- for CB lightweights...

 The only parts I'm really doubting about are the heads...
 I think a pair of nice heads and 1.4 rockers is money well spent...


 Yes it is, and it's recommended to do so...

Rimco super rods used to be a deal.  Now they are $175 plus a core charge of $20.

quite a change from rebalanced and rebushed stock VW rods, don't you think Luke.  ;)
how come rimco is expensive as well these days?

 That's $160,- dollars more than a set of std rods from Serrano's...

 I'm asking this because I think that I'm wasting my money if I buy H-beams for say $214,- for use in a 1914cc weekend warrior..
 I think the money saved ($180,-) will be better spent on a set of Steve Tims stage 2 heads...

 

We run a 78mm crank with the berg 191s rods wich are vw rods, stroke relieved .they handle a lot of rpm abuse around 7500rpm for year now without any problem.We ran 13-14" on the 1/4 miles with the engine(2074cc) and a stock gear box in a fully bodied car.Sometimes better use good vw original parts vs no name low price hi po ones if not needed ;)!!

The rod bolts have gotten really expensive.  Even with stock bolts, VW rods are an excellent choice for budget builds.

even if budget builds are build to go fast?  ;) ::)

I bought RIMCO's Super Rods for my 2110.  They come with bolts by SPS.  I have no reservations about using them.

Stock rods are fine on a 78 stroke. I have used them over 9000 rpm with no problems. Stock Porsche rods would be another story....

yea bill learn the hard way on the porsche rod stuff luckely his crank was saveble and thoese magic heads  ;) . an engine i had years ago that i sold to a freind had vw 191s and he had gone thure the lights at 9200. many many times.  i still belive in the vw rod defenetly a strong rod indeed. and thats with the stock bolts i call them the elephant bolts. its the febi bolts that are junk.

post it here not to start a whole new topic

can stock rods be used with a 84mm crank? i have bought the crank and the rods came with it. all balanced it seems, but i will redo that, because it has no pulley.

do i need to consider other rods? what brand and what lenght?

thanks

are stock rods forged? who sells new replacement bolts for them?

Back when I started racing my old '67 we were running stock, prepped rods on a 78 welded stroker.
Combo worked great for multiple races and many runs. I had to say goodbye to them testing one day at 8600rpm shifting into 3rd :'(
Definitely no problem suing them again some time on a street motor under 8K ;)
Just my opinion ...

It doesn't matter how they are made, they are DAMN strong!

The original old ones are forged . Do some polishing on them if you want to do and they are strong enough for your engine

Udo

I used the Rimco Super Rods on my 350hp Turbo Engine with no problem.

Yup, I remember Dave & Judy telling me that if I couldn't afford Carrillo's run Rimco Super Rods. Dave swore by them. It's all in the bolts…

 ???  ???    :)

we use Udo rods for three saisons now on rally use without problems

Also  motors that realise stock rods work fine even at 7500 and up.

Carefull total assembly and balancing is the way.

Andreas

i think also weight saving concern when it come to H beam. plan to run aluminum rods  and JE pistons for my circuit race bug.

 These are a nice alternative at $ 118.00,                 Mike

http://revmasterautomotive.com/?p=77

Looks like steel from china  >:(

 Hey UDO,
            They are CM, Dave Kawell had looked at a set and really liked them also.   The crankshafts are real nice also, I have 2 of them  ( 86 stroke type 4 centers, one flange the other wedgemated)    I would prefer buying products made in North Carolina but I am limited to whats available as far as origin.   Mike

nevermind the rods   ;D

anybody noticed the heads on that revmaster website?

the 049s


looks interesting   plus i like the 12mm 3/4 plug reach


anybody got experiences on these?

what bolts you suggest to go with the stock rods?

thinking of using the stock rods on my CB 78.4 crank for a turbo motor. either that or a set of H beams 5.4 or 5.5

For turbo use i think pauter rods are better  :)

Udo

I think i posted that picture here in another thread , this is what i do with original rods when using at higher rpm's . But only recommend for N/A engines

Udo

udo, those rods look really nice.
but how does polishing help at higher RPMs?
or am i missing something?

A polished surface is more resistant to prevent a crack from starting to develop. So its a strength-adding measure and with more rpm you need stronger parts.
Polishing is also a 'by-product' when you remove a little bit of material for weight saving purposes as I see it: might as well polish it a bit more and add a little strength by doing so  ;)
Shot peening would be even more effective in strengthening the surface structure imo, but shotpeening is a dying-out craftmanship is my impression and could be even more expensive because of that.

Those look just perfect Udo!
Would using ARP bolts on these make them even more high-rpm suited or are the stock bolts not the limitation on these?

thanks for the explanation, walter  ;)
my rimco super rods have been shotpeened. i'm not using them though as i stuck with my stock rods.

It doesn't really add strength, it takes away weakness.

I ran stock balanced set of rods in a 1750cc that ran my 57 into the 13's back in 83', I drove the car everyday to work at Hughes Aircraft in Fullerton and all over So Cal for a long time. That motor saw 7200 rpm everyday I drove it. It had major welded ported heads with 48's, 69mm counter weighted crank, Engle VZ73 cam, autocraft 1:4 rockers and Dave Folts trans 4:12 R&P with 1.21 fourth. I have had motors a lot bigger and more hp but that was my favorite. I still have the rods sitting on a shelf, can't get myself to throw them away they served me so well. I built a 1776 last year and upgraded almost everything except the rods, just rebuilt stockers balanced.

Stock rods will handle many many cycles over 9000  RPM and high compressions too. It depends on the stroke and the weight of the pistons,pins etc. The Stock rods with stock 11.0 bolts that Chris talked about with over 1 lb removed off the set are still running today!