The Cal-look Lounge

This thread is for us who like the new features of FT and wish to share experiences.

My hope next is to find out more on the practical experience of inclination/wheelie Control feature.
Sensor options needed and experience.

Ja det finns tele  :)
/// Micke

Hi Frallan,

i started to work on the wheeliecontrol...
Fueltech says to use ridehight sensors but I use damper travel sensors on the front and rear.
So when i recoginze a wheelie i started to Retard ignition. But it was just a first try.

on my new car I Need to get experience first to start working on this again ;)

Cheers,
Basti

This is one of the sharings/news I hope to hear about about from you Christiano.
 ;D

Hey guys!

For the wheelie control, I spent some time testing some CHEAP options, b/c I didn't want to pay $500 on a freaking Racepak ride height sensor, which is what they use in the US.
So I thought we could use one of the distance sensors we have in the robots I build to play with my son and guess what: the thing f* works!

Of course you have to know how to use the function and configure the sensor, so that's why only a couple guys here in BR (which happens to be friends of mine :) ) are successfully using them, even though I have wrote an article for a performance magazine explaining (not in details) how to use the sensor.

The sensor is a SHARP infrared sensor (GP2Y0A02YK) and it's a bit tricky to calibrate its values. You have to attach it to the car in its final position, and then lift the front of the car, inch by inch, check the sensor reading and start building your calibration table for that sensor.

One thing to notice about this sensor is that it isn't a linear sensor and it's reading table might give you wrong values if the sensor is too close to the ground. My experience with this sensor tells me to fix the sensor at a distance of at least 7" from the ground and then you can start your table from there.

So when building your calibration table, the lowest height it'll have is 7". Then you lift the front until you have the sensor at 8" from the ground, you check the reading in V and add an entry of xV - X" in the table and you'll keep doing it until you feel you have a good table.
Keep in mind the max reading for this sensor is a distance of 150cm and that's not a straight reading anymore as soon as you lift the front b/c the sensor isn't pointing straight to the ground anymore. You'll be measuring the height in a straight line, but the max reach of the sensor will still be measured in an angled way. :)

After that, when you check the FT display it'll be showing 7" (or whatever is your first calibration value) of reading with the car at ride height.
I like to make it read 0, so I just go to the sensor offset and adjust it to 0 my reading by setting the offset type to "after conversion" and putting the inverse of my first value in the table. So if the first value is 7, my offset is -7, which will give me a reading of 0 at ride height. :)

I'm attaching the draft of the article published on that magazine. It's in Portuguese but you can easily throw it in google translator and get the main idea behind the words :)

(I know. I wrote too much :) )

[attachment=1]Cool!

For me, I will put the sensor up front on a 7 meter long dragster.
Should work even if I have to make a small support frame to get it up in the air as you describe.
Portugese, no problem.
I can take on me to translate and share here.

Translated a bit roughly and attached the Pictures.
Nice write up Christiano!  Molto Obrigado!

[attachment=1]

8 USD from China and under 20 USD over the counter in local store here in Sweden.
Once again, really appreciated information.
Test report will come this summer.[attachment=2]

Glad to help!

Keep posting your experiences/questions and I'll write some comments whenever I can :)

That's awesome! Not running FT here, but the sensor will be super useful. Thanks!

I got a chance to test this sensor yesterday, had some other issues so no decent passes but did learn the front of car is nearly 3inches higher at about 120mph than at standstill/normal  :o This is the Old cab so no aero stuff at all

cheers Richie

No wonder your car is so quick Ritchie, your reducing friction as you go!
 ;D

Doesn't do much for steering input though :o

use one of those sensors for the wall.   :D

E90 BMW’s with xneons have a unit (box with an input arm attached to suspension)attached in the front wheel well to the suspension components to raise or lower the headlights depending on suspension position, wonder if that could be a cheap and easy option.?

Lots of Cadillacs and a few Lincoln's here in the states also have ride height sensors, used to help control air bag suspension systems. I may grab a few and implement them next winter.

 :D   That actually really got me thinking if it was possible to impliment :o

use one of those sensors for the wall.   :D
[/quote]

 :D   That actually really got me thinking if it was possible to impliment :o
[/quote]

"The Wall"  ???

Please translate to an old Viking. I do not get it.....

 :D   That actually really got me thinking if it was possible to impliment :o
[/quote]

"The Wall"  ???

Please translate to an old Viking. I do not get it.....
[/quote]

So it reads sideways and/or forwards so cuts power if you are about to hit the wall like they do in the vacuum cleaners they are fitted to!!!!!!  :o ;D


https://www.dyson.co.uk/content/dyson/gb/en/products/vacuum-cleaners/robot-vacuums/dyson-360-eye/dyson-360-eye-nickel-blue.html?istCompanyId=4a4

THAT is interesting!

I just ordered 2 units from at about USD 12 each.
One more and then I have one for the height and then a left end right mounted up front at the Wheels, would be a nice safety device.
I like your thinking guys!

This is when the "Oh shit" ignition cut activates, as you can see it kills it completely and pass is done but will save your ass if its all going wrong  ;) :o ;D

Thanks!  This is good stuff. Appreciated that you take your time to share.

 :)  No problem, as you can see cut doesn't need to be this long duration but this was only 2nd pass with it on so I am still figuring it out

cheers Richie

A bit late b/c I'm in a rush trying get my car together and rebuilding my son's jr dragster and a friends car :)

For those who have FT500/FT600, an update was released a month ago (3.40).

https://www.fueltech.net/blogs/articles/new-ft500-ft500lite-and-ft600-update-1

Among the bunch of new things, there are 2 I think you guys would like to hear about.


1 - Improved 2step strategy.
2 - Active traction control


I'll pick one of them that might not be so intuitive as the other.
So today I'm gonna talk about the Improved 2step strategy.

Sometimes using a huge turbo becomes a pain when it's about making it spool when staging the car.
There are a few tricks to help to achieve this (and Richie has tried some of them on the old Cabrio with success), but there's something even better now and that no other EMS has done up to now.

Usually, when setting up your 2step strategy you define a target RPM and a target Ignition Timing (usually below 0 to have it really retarded to help on the turbo spool).
Some engines like it, some not.
When you retard your ignition too much, some engines may not respond well to this.
They may take longer to rev or bog when releasing the 2step button due to the engine not being able to get the cylinders ready for launch quick enough after a nice amount of ignition retard due to fuel soaked spark plugs or any other reason.
Also, keep the engine on an ignition cut limiter for too long is hard on valves and valve seats.

With that in mind and, of course, always looking to help people improve their setup, there's a new feature associated to the 2step function.
Additionally to the well known options, you can now decide if you want have your 2step by ignition cut (standard mode) , ignition retard (new mode) or both.

So let's say you already have your 2step configure to 5000rpm and -5 as your ignition timing during the 2step, but your engine still struggles to build boost of the line.
Usually you'd increase the ignition retard, bump up the RPM target, try change your fuel table or even enable the 3step function.
Now you have an easier way of fixing this problem.

In the 2step config screen, you now have a "Ignition retard" checkbox.
When you click it, an new field will be enabled. That's the "Ignition Retard Applied" field.
Here you can define a lower ignition timing other than your usual one (-5). You can put any number you think would help you spooling your turbo.
Usually you'll see extremely low numbers on this field, such as -30 or -40 and I'll explain you why.

Let's say you enabled the "Ignition retard" function and set you "Ignition Retard Applied" to -40.
As soon as you enable this new option, additionally to the standard 2step strategy, you'll have an ignition timing up to that new ignition timing applied to RANDOM cylinders.
So you may have Cylinder #1 showing -5 as ignition timing (which is your base timing on your 2step config), Cylinder #2 showing -15, Cylinder #3 showing -8 and Cylinder #4 showing -40.

What does this mean?
This means that:

• You'll have more retard applied than the standard -5 you have set for your 2step timingl
• Since you have a huge ignition retard being applied to random cylinders instead of a huge retard being applied to all of them, you'll still be able to rev up your engine on the starting line and it's easier for the engine to be ready for launch after the 2step is released
• For the same reason mentioned above, your engine will operate much smoother b/c you'll have fewer ignition cuts since high timing retard itself will hold the engine revs, but not as much as if the timing retard was applied to all the cylinders at the same time
• And finally: you'll make boost much quicker!

From here, since this bigger timing retard is applied to random cylinders, helping us spool our turbo faster than usual and still keep our engine responsive, we can make a few other changes to keep our engine healthy and happy
You can now:

• Use a not so low ignition timing in your fixed ignition timing setting, allowing your to reach out to your target RPM quicker than when you have a too low of an ignition timing
• Try LOWER your target RPM, since your turbo is going to spool faster b/c of the huge retard applied to the random cylinders instead of b/c of the high RPM+ignition cut
• Try make more boost at the same target RPM or at a lower target RPM

I helped a friend of mine test this feature on his drag car (the one I'm helping rebuild) back on May and he made a nice video showing how it works. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOxEUXyPpRY
It's in portuguese, but you can enable the youtube auto-generated subtitles just to have an idea of what he's saying, which is almost everything I said here.

Now go there test this new feature and let me know the results and send me a message in case you have any doubts :)

Nicely written and well explained my friend!

I have the update on the new Beetle allready and will maybe try it next Weekend ;)

Cheers,
Basti

THANKS a LOT for this sharing!

Obrigado!

Frallan

Here is a video of a TT V8 manual fairlady using that 2step feature.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BlN4V2sjaaG/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link (https://www.instagram.com/p/BlN4V2sjaaG/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link)

Thanks Basti!
Great to hear you have the latest version and is going to test it.
When do you plan to race the car again?


You're welcome Frallan!


Please let me know if you guys would like me to produce some more texts about anything in specific!

Hi Chris

have updated to latest version as well but not tried it yet, will see how that works out when I get a chance, we got 3 cars running Fueltech now and 3 more in the works & my plan is to switch New cabrio to it over the winter so the learning & testing once they are all running should get us some pretty good data in a short time 8)

cheers Richie

Great to hear!
Keep me posted... and you know how to find me whenever needed!

How can I change the language to english?  ???

[attachment=1]

Go to file top left then to bottom of tab that options, to options and its in there :)

Thank You Richie!  :)

Fueltech expert  8)

 :D   Nope, not yet anyway ;)   

The easiest way is to update the FT ( uppdate 4,25)
When you have downloaded it you will get 3 choices about languages Select English
/// Micke

Yes, thats right, but it was only for installing language. Not for program. It was my first download for FT.

If you do not choose the correct language you will get it in Spanish or Portuguese software You cannot change the language
/// Micke

I did choose English and still it was Portuguese.

But what Richie said at above, the options is there.

  Open file At the bottom you have options
Open it and you will find language and a little more value to be set
/// Micke

Hi all!

I have recently installed a GearController since I have a FT500 and it is not integrated. Have hooked it up to FT strain gauge shift knob and it works like a dream. A couple of settings to think about:
1. Sensitivity of the strain gauge i.e. how hard do you pull/push your knob when shifting - higher value if you are softer in shifting - I have mine at 1500 being kind of hard handed
2. Values to initiate the ignition cut i.e. together with the above - you want to have your values close to 0V and 5V when shifting (set sensitivity above) and then theses values I have set to 1V and 4V pulling/pushing respectively.
3. How long the ignition cut should be on each gear to securely get the next gear in. Set a value around 350 ms shift 1-2 and then a bit less on 2-3 and 3-4. Then test under full load and work your way backwards until you cannot get the next gear in - then move back a bit. In this way you will have the shortest amount of time of the ignition cut needed to shift.

After installing this I have of course zero clutch slip and do not lose any boost during shifting.

Johan

Good to see you're doing good with your setup!

One extra hint with regard to ignition-cut times.

Too long and you'll wear your pro-shit/dog engagement b/c there'll be no load in the trans and the engagement will be loose.
The ignition cut happens ONLY to allow you to DISENGAGE the gear, not to engage the next one. The ENGAGEMENT is something that your trans should be able to perform without an ignition cut.

So, how do you figure out what is the perfect timing without trial/error?
Check the image I attached.

As soon as you move the shifter and start applying the ignition cut, the RPM will drop.
As you can see on the image, the RPM drops and there's a point that I circled where it tries to come up, but it's then brought down again by the ignition cut.
This is the point where the next gear is finally engaged, but the extra ignition cut time won't allow your engine to rev up again. So any extra ignition cut time you have beyond that, is just killing your ET.

Knowing that, the best approach to give you the almost perfect ignition cut time would be: Identify when the cut starts, measure how long it takes until you see the next gear engaged and the rpm trying to go up again, add ~10-20ms to this time to have a margin of error/safety and go for a testing run.

Hope it helps :)

Let me know if you guys have any other questions

Christiano!
This is such great information - I'll check my logs tomorrow! Thanks!!
Johan

Glad to help!
Let me know if you found any room for improvements after checking your logs.


Also, let's try use this "pandemic-forced-break" to improve the cars and clear up any doubts you guys may have.
Send your questions and I'll do my best to reply them as soon as possible.

Doesn't matter if they're specific to Fueltech features or if it's some help to analyse some of your logs and improve your tuning. Just post them.
The more channels you have been logged, the better it is to identify what can be improved.

Glad to help you guys to improve your program.

Thanks

Wow Christiano!  You are really a nice and supportive guy! 
Well, it is obvious that you helped Johan Dryselius....and some of it paid off this last weekend!

Thanks!

Oh really?
Good to hear! Any video/info about it?

https://www.facebook.com/johan.dryselius/videos/10158604660003934

Even more insane - 6,06@186km/t - 9,51@225km/t. 1584cc, unported heads, 35,5x32 valves, 36 PSI! 😎

An incredible achievement!  FT500 and that special knobshiftercontraptionhocuspocus..... :-)

Nice!

Let's wait for him to confirm whether anything here on this topic helped on going faster!

That is a very professional and appreciated attitude.

or on instagram
on pprmicke
who is also a fueltech (ft600) user
/// Micke

Thanks!

Just started following you on instagram.

There are a few other tricks with the GearController, for both the integrated or standalone versions, to help you not to kill the engine that much when shifting and keep the boost line almost flat.
I'll talk about it later  ;D

Super Nice
 /// Micke

Hey all,

So, back to the ignition cut when flat-shifting.

How about a boostline like the below one.

[attachment=3]

Good uh?
Notice it's almost flat as I mentioned on a previous post and this isn't only b/c of the ignition cut time.
It's also about the TIMING AND CUT PERCENTAGE you apply.

You want to get out with the least amount of cut % and with an ignition timing reduction that keeps your engine happy, so that you won't have your boost dropping too much when shifting.
How do you achieve that?

For users with gear controller integrated to the Fueltech (FT600 and newer)

All you have to do is to configure how much ignition cut and ignition timing reduction you want to apply.
For that you just need go to the "Powershift (gear change ignition cut)" and play with the values.
Notice that for the log I sent above, I have a really low ignition cut % and timing.
The engine/trans combo allowed me to run this low of ignition cut and timing and the result is that almost-flat boost line.

[attachment=4]

For users with the external GearController module, it's a bit tricky b/c you can't configure things so easily like on the newer FT modules.

The standalone GearController, when you shift gears, will actually send a 2-step signal to the FT box (remember you had to wire the 2step wire to the module?).
Yep. That's exactly what you're thinking. The standalone GearController will actually activate the 2step to promote the ignition cut/timing retard.
Now that we know it, we have to play with the 2step configuration to make it work similarly to the newer FT modules.
How do we access the 2step advanced configs?

Go to the "Advanced Map Options" and switch "RPM settings" to "Custom"
[attachment=1]

Now go back to the 2step config menu and you'll see the following options enabled
[attachment=2]

Remember the post that I made some time ago about the "Advanced 2step strategy" where you can apply a ridiculous low ignition timing on your 2step?
Now it'll come handy :)

Since this is a 2step signal hitting the Fueltech module from the external GearController, you can try reducing the ignition cut on 2step value and use a ridiculous low timing on the "high resolution ignition retard".
So when trying to build boost of the line, you'll try apply a low ignition cut % and have the timing retard locking the launch RPM where it should be AND when the GearController sends the 2step signal during the shifting, this same strategy will be applied, so you'll also have a low ignition timing/cut when shifting.

There's a catch and this is regardless this strategy I'm talking about: When you use the external GearController, you have to make sure that your RPM when shifting won't drop BELOW your (2step RPM target)-(StartCompensation X RPM before).
If you get your RPM BELOW this value the igntion cut/retard won't happen b/c, as I said before, the external GearController is actually sending a 2step signal to the FT module.
I've seen people breaking transmissions b/c of that and when they didn't break the trans, they'd wear out the pro-rings. And this usually happens when doing the 1-2 shifting, which is where the RPM drops the most.

Hope it helps someone to improve their program

Nice one Christiano ;)
I guess not many can follow ;)

Cheers,
Basti

Christiano!

Thanks for sharing - I had all the facts from a friend in Brazil and applied it and also I was aware of the standalone (as I have) GearController using the 2 - step cut and the need staying above the 2 - step RPM. What I didn't know was 'Go to the "Advanced Map Options" and switch "RPM settings" to "Custom"' - I'll sure check in on this.
Thanks again!
Johan

No problem.

Even here in Brazil 99% of the people running the standalone gear controller don't know that they can do it b/c this isn't something you find in the instructions an even when it's in the instructions people over here don't pay much attention to it.
Plus, the custom RPM description says "not recommended", which makes most people to stay way from using it :)

You just need to stop a bit and think about the big picture, how things work and are tied together and then you'll find a different way of doing things  :)

Thanks

Christiano!

Before the last race I added a high resolution ignition retard to the 2 step: -35. Now that I have added the "Advanced", what does the "Maximum Levels" & "Above limiter RPM.." mean?

Johan

Hi Christiano,

I'm assuming all this information isn't really meant for synchros?

That's correct. This won't work with synchro trans.



"Maximum level" is the % of ignition cut or timing retard (depends on the menu you're changing that will happen).
So if you have 90% as the maximum level for the ignition cut, 90% of the ignition events will be dropped in order to promote the ignition cut.

"Above limiter RPM" is like a progression threshold you allow for that event to happen.
So, let's say you have your 2step RPM set to 6000rpm and an "above limiter"  set to 150rpm.
Once you hit the 6krpm mark, the ignition cut/retard will be proportionally applied until you hit 6150rpm, where the maximum cut/retard that you configured will be applied.

So, as I mentioned on that post that I made (last year I guess?), what we want to have is the high resolution retard applying enough retard so we don't have to use that much of the ignition cut, so we keep the engine "awake and ready to go" like we use to say over here.

For those of you that were using the 2step without the high resolution retard and now migrated to the high resolution retard, if you compare both logs, especially the "Ignition Cut - 2step"  channel, you'll see how your engine became less dependent on ignition cuts during the 2step.

If you want me to take a look into one of your logs, just PM me and I'll give you my email.

Thanks

Christiano!

Thanks so much for the clarification! Now I have the pieces I need. Will do some minor changes for next year. The car is now going into "winter service and updates".

You still racing over there - maybe you can race all year?

Johan

We're not having actual races b/c of the pandemic, only private testing sessions.
But yeah. It's basically all year racing. We just have a break on the last 2 weeks of December and beginning of Jan.

I'm not racing, just working on some cars.
Hopefully next year I'll have to handle the problem of racing my car again and still work on other cars :)

Christiano!

Once again - thanks for all advice - I'm sure there will be more questions as test-n-tune starts in April. FT and the GearController is such an asset to racing and easy to work with/tune. Amazing stuff! Stay great! I'm on FB if you want contact there!

Johan

I did add you on facebook a couple days ago  :)

Pinheiro?
:)

Yep

By the way, your 6.0 video came up today on my time line for some reason and I noticed that when you are spooling your turbo it spends quite some time in an intermediate RPM before actually hitting the 2step limiter.
This usually happens for 2 main reasons: too much fuel or too much ignition retard (I'd bet on the latter).

If you want to discuss, just send me a PM.
:)

Christiano!
Nicely spotted and I have thought the same after all your input above, as I realized it 'got stuck' in the middle. I will definitely back off on the retard and try it from there. The car is down for maintenance now but it is on my 'to do' list!
Thanks for sharing!
Johan

Yeah. There's a few ways of doing it, like

• Reduce the retard of the fixed ignition timing on 2step
• Enable an ignition map on 2step and tweak the timing table based on what your engine likes
• Work with the actual ignition map in a pre-2step range that helps your to spool your turbo when going to the lights. So when you flat out the turbo is already spooling and it'll make it easier to hit the target boost

Among other options :)

Thanks!

Johan

So how's everyone doing this year?
Has anyone started the testing sessions yet?

Hi Christiano,

i did a very small rollout but was stopped by bad waether.
Lets see how much racing will be allowed due to covid.

But i can say that there will be some nice fueltech updates soon ;)

Cheers,
Basti

My FT500 equipped dragster is on a long holdup. But should still be getting some attention and startup soon.
The latest car to get my attention is my circuit racer. It has a small Holley carburetor and two small SC. My brother scolds me for doing it that way, when the car/engine previously did have a DTA60 injection (that worked).
But that is me in a nutshell, constant change.
Back to FT and good sharing soon. Thanks for your support! Very appreciated!

In the end of May
Be the idea to test
/// M

Yep!
Electronic wastegate will be available in the next release!

Nice!
Just let me know if you need anything

Keep us posted!

And there it is!

https://www.fueltech.net/blogs/articles/new-update-4-6

and it works really nice ;)

Yep.
You car was one of the firsts to test it.
No we need to see it at the track  :evil:

will be out in june...if the race is allowed

You forgot two options: Spray it with nitrous. Not allowed BUT run a Screwcharger takes away all that "turbo spool up nonsens" :-)   ;)
Sorry, do not not take me for being too serious. I admire were we are today with the electronics in principle taking away any spool delay. 

My first contact with turbo was in 1976 when my brother bought me a Rajay (and hand carried it on the flight) in California for my 1960 MkII Jaguar and the Turbocharger book by Hugh McInnes. I was totally bitten! Few years later I saw Buddy Ingersoll race his Pinto and that convinced me further.
No, no electronics, whatsover.

I love engineering! NA/Turbo/Nitrous/SC and EFI!

https://bangshift.com/bangshift1320/pressurized-pony-a-close-up-look-at-buddy-ingersolls-pinto/
[attachment=1]

started with 4.61 no problem
Test next weekend
Web   https://solidsport.com/nitroz
/// Micke

Great!
Keep us posted!

Christiano
Today we have dyno tested Andreas J Na with Ft 500 and 4.61
Around 280> whp He will also test on 29/6
/// Micke

Hi all!
I'm at bit delayed with the 356 project due to a shoulder injury but the plan is to be out mid/end July. Done some mods to the engine so hopefully a bit more HP - will dyno before hitting the track. And yes - the electronic wastegate looks awesome!!
Johan

We were racing last weekend, had some gremlins after changing lots over winter but am getting there now, this semi final run is best pass since switch to Fueltech. Now just got to get 60ft back again to what it was running consistently last year and should see some 7s again ;D

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=2927789874109525

Richie!
I don't doubt for a second that you will be in the 7's next time out!
Johan

Not quite yet but very close  :o >:( ;D 

13mins on here is pass

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FZcKuBui68&t=830s


and here view from above


https://www.facebook.com/232842663605/posts/10160057956133606/

Next time  ;D

Hi All,

Just wanted to introduce myself. My name is Alex, and I am running an ft550 in my single cab tube chassis project.

Richie was been helping me get it running and tuned.

Last Friday was my first time at the track so still in the very early stages.

I have done a full build thread on Instagram @secondcomingsinglecab and on Facebook Second Coming Single Cab

Hi,
let me know if you need help on any side,
my setup is quite the same, also on gearbox ;)

Basti

[attachment=1]

Any tips on what I can do to rectify this?
I have disconnected the injector plugs, the connections outgoing from the FT500
I have reflashed to the new 4.73 update a couple of times.

The injectors are wired with direct 12 volts (fused) power and blue wires individually in primary and secondary connections.

I also have a strange white wire issue on the standard oil pressure (#4) incoming. Even tried to reconfigure and enable other free inputs instead of the standard number #4. No go.
Fuel pressure works well and if I switch the oil pressure sender to the fuel pressure wiring, it is OK. I can read oil pressure on the fuel pressure input wiring.
I measure 5 volt incoming, earth and then 2 volts on both oil and fuel pressure wiring. So they are identical.
By this I draw conclusion that wiring is OK but strangely enough I might have an internal FT 500 config issue.

Could the two issues of injectors and wire #4 incoming be related?

I also have TPS, engine temp, air temp, transmission oil temp and they are all fully OK.

Ideas? Inspiration what I can test more?

Hi!

Which injectors do you use? Do you running an Injector Peak and Hold driver?
What happens if you test the outputs?

Basti

Hello Basti!
I run 4 high impedance Siemens on blue wires #1-4 as primaries and 4 more as secondary on blue wires #5-8.
So no, no need for an extra driver unit. I hope

If I run the time based output test, (linked to my transbrake and 2 step) nothing changes on the injectors in output. They do not react.
The screen shows the correct ms as per the fuel map, but outputs are not activated.
but whatever I have asked the simulation to do in terms of MAP, rpm, temperatures, boost etc, does work.

It is wired like this for primary and the same for the secondary.

[attachment=1]

ok great.
If you go to output config under Sensors and Calibration you will find all seletced outputs.
There is a smal thunder sign next to it. Click it to do the output test. Then you will hear the Injector clicking
or you can test teh voltage on the injector connector to find the problem.

I hope this helps.

Basti

Ahhhh! YES!  I know that spark sign.
Thanks! will try that tonight.  I will report back immediately and also take some pictures, if there is a question mark.

From last few days
[attachment=1]
Table view of the wiring from few months back.
[attachment=2]

Nice build!

There's either something wrong with the outputs or with the wiring itself.

Grab a multimeter or a polarity test pen and check if you have a continuous signal from the pin in the ECU harness plug to the pin on the injector plug.
Also check if you really have power on the red wire that is used by the injector.

Usually we use the RPM activated output to activate the relays that will feed coils/injectors.
If that's the case, before running your tests, set the RPM to 0, save it back to the ECU and then try running your tests again.

Interesting!!!  So you are saying you do that for safety reason?
You set 50 rpm for example to activate my relays for ignition and injectors. If the engine stops, for any reason not being racing and maybe accident, the relays will drop and shut of before I can click them off manually? Is that the thinking?

Exactly :)

Also, some coils are very sensitive, like the ign1a smart coils and this will save you from trouble.
If you let them powered with no discharge for a while, they'll just blow up (been there, done that. on my son's jr dragster....)

OK!

5001100171  FT CDI coils for the FT spark. Not smart at all..... ;D

YEAHHHH!!!!
Injector success and a clear understanding of how I can test each output.
All 8 injectors react individually on clicking the "lightning" button.

What was wrong?  30 second to 2 minute delay on the relay and then it disconnected. TRICKY!  I bought it at Biltema. Same as buying electrical stuff at Harbor Freight. My mistake. I will replace all of them.
So a huge thanks for leading me the right way and simply finding it.

Now I could test my two boost activated outputs and noticed how they were inverted. i.e. always on with 12 V until activated when they dropped. Now fixed!

Next issue: Yeah, sorry.
Grey ignition output #1-4 will not react to the now famous lightning button. (or giving any output at cranking. I do get rpm on both the PC , Tachometer and on the oscilloscope. Now the scope and I are not friends yet, but that is next issue. Cherry Hall with 5 volt supply and 1 k pull up )
I have tried enabling the FTSpark multiple wiring option and also without. Does not matter. In any case, no reaction to the test buttons on any of the four grey outputs.

Any good ideas that I can test? 

[attachment=1]
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[attachment=3]

Oh.
You're using a MW box, not FT Spark.

Uncheck the FT Spark option, use the "falling edge" option instead.
Make sure the outputs are wired to the correct MW pins and that the MW box is properly powered and with no error.

I love it that the time difference seems to have no influence on your support. Nice!

Now I have tried both. FT Spark and not enabled.
Both with falling edge.
I get the impression that FT spark and MW are pretty much the same, if using multiple wired and not using the CAN communication.

I have also disconnected the MW and measured on the connector pins from FT #1-4 and seeing if I could get a zero ground trigger when clicking the lightning test button. No go.
Main power to the MW (four 12 v cables are activated) and holding without drop like the other relay.
The trigger (ignition on single red wire to the MW) is also checked and on.
But the issue does not likely come from the MW but signal in to the MW.

I have not tried to trigger one channel in to the MW by giving it a click to 0-ground. Maybe that could be a verification if I can get a spark from one channel in order to verify the MW?

That's correct.
FT won't know whether it's a sparkPro/smart coil/MW box on the other end.
It'll just send the activation signal through the ignition output and that's it.

FT Spark is a bit different, that's why you have the FTSpark checkbox instead.


That's interesting. Does it happen to ANY (not just 1-4) output that you try to test?
Don't connect them to the MW box, just try hit the test button for each and measure the result on the harness end.
I've seen cases where the ignition outputs got burnt for whatever reason and then we had to switch them to different outputs to make things work.

That's interesting. Does it happen to ANY (not just 1-4) output that you try to test?
Don't connect them to the MW box, just try hit the test button for each and measure the result on the harness end.
I've seen cases where the ignition outputs got burnt for whatever reason and then we had to switch them to different outputs to make things work.
[/quote]
I have not tested that. Will do so.

Now the unit is brand new from box. It is only that it has been lying on a shelf for some years.
But, who knows.....
Good idea. I will figure out if I can trigger other grey outputs.
The two yellow did work well.

If the outputs are burnt, it could have been b/c of a backfeed or some other issue.
I had a similar issue at the track once when my son's FT500 just wouldn't trigger the coil. Tried different gray outputs and nothing.
Ended up using a different FT500 box and things were back to normal.

If you have a polarity test pen/multimeter handy, you should be able to quickly test any of the gray outputs.
Or you can just use them to activate one of the injectors, or relays activated by ground, for example.
If they click, the outputs are working.

SAD!   ???

Output grey #1-4 gives a constant ground. Upon activating them with the lightning button, they pulse with 0.5-1 second interval.
Output grey #5-8 give a 680-690 ohm resistance to grund and upon clicking the button, I get ground activated.

In order to get this dragster to the last event in Sweden, if weather permits, I will put a MSD 7 and distributor fixed at 20 degrees.

Any idea if the FT500 can be repaired?
I will ask my sales rep here in Sweden too but it was 3 years ago I bought it.

I have to think a bit..... if I configure the engine as an eight cylinder, custom firing order 1432 xxxx or 1x4x3x2x. Maybe I could work around the missing 4 outputs?
Then configure the tach output simply on any other free output.

With constant ground /trigger on all inputs to the MW, sitting like that for some time, I do not like the thought what might have happened. GRRRRR

if 5-8 are working, you can use them.
No need to set crazy custom firing orders or anything like that :)
Change your RPM settings to advanced and it should allow you to move your ignition output to 5-8 outputs instead of 1-4

But yeah. Reach out to the dealer and see what they can do.
It can be repaired for sure, but it needs to be sent to the factory in Brazil.
So he will have to lend you a spare FT500 until yours is fixed or exchanged with a new one.

OK!

I will look in to that Christiano!

I probbaly know now, what has happened.
The unit was "new" but had been powered up and checked out by my sales person here in Sweden. USB and then 12 V red and black.
But no other cables connected.
He told me and was honest with this and price was accordingly lower than a new unit.
Not really relevant to my mistake but it influenced me thinking that it did have a map setup and all OK.

As I probably have missed to do the setup with the four outputs configured for FTSpark/MW as triggers, prior to power up and have connected it, once I power it up, they are grounded, until I do this setup configuration.
This has caused the MW to go in to four channel constant trigger.
The MW Pro Drag CDI unit should see trigger signals, not constant ground.
A 400/600 mj ProDrag ignition will not like that kind of treatment.
It has burnt and as it did that, most likely sent some power back in to my FT500 #1-4 outputs channels. Poof!
Two strikes in one.

So, if this is the case, I do not have a working four channel CDI, so the alternative is to source 4 pc smart coils....... or the MSD7 and MSD distributor. Last not being my preference.
Thanks for the fantastic support!  It really has helped me a lot!

That's the kind of thing that unfortunately happens sometimes...

But I gotta tell you... Depending on what you want to burn, go with IGN1A smart coils (fueltech smart coils are ign1a at the end of the day...) and go hard on dwell time.
Usually that's good enough even for some high boost applications.
If you still need more spark, go with the new FTSpark generation and the 750mj box.

There's a lot of thinkings about spark power and all, but the one I like is: more spark power=less ignition timing required=happier/freer revving engine.

My dragster is not so advanced and super high boost. 35-40 psi.
Fuel is methanol.
Most modern coils will do for me. I am even sure my MSD7 and the distributor even will do well for my simple application.

As for Advanced 3D ignition option, could it be that I do not have that on my older FT500?
[attachment=1]

Let me re-phrase it, I take for granted I do have it, but sitting at work and having a quick look in the manual and not having the ECU connected, I do not find it.

For either fuel/ignition 3D tables to come up, you have to go to you map options and change the fuel/ignition map types
Then it will try use your current map/compensation, interpolate them and create the 3D map

Sorry!
Help demands feedback as thank you:  My dragster starts.... barks....smells good!
I swapped the M&W for a MSD 7 AL complete with a MSD distributor.

But!  Soon to be solved too, it will not pick up revs due to low methanol fuel press.
I have a small 1 liter tank with gasoline, an electrical pump and a NOS solenoid.
This squirts gasoline in to my plenums as a prime with nozzles on each side.
It is not enough to get it to pick up more than 15-20 psi on the main fuel line.
So, I am going to retire this invention and put a "conventional" high pressure fuel pump to prime the fuel line, then shut down the electrical pump once the engine has stable pressure on the Hilborn.
Thank You Johan Haglund for sharing the details of your non return valves!!!

.....and Christiano, the FT500 works good.
I seem to have damaged 1-4 grey outputs and potentially something is corrupt with the #4 oil pressure input.
No other
Well, not the pressure sensor,  but with the trouble shooting done so far, it seems to be software.
The screen oil pressure is simply 0.
If I simply swap the fuel pressure plug over to the oil pressure, it show my oil pressure on the screen. (as fuel pressure)
Measuring the earth, the 5 volt and the signal input, it is identical to my fuel pressure, TPS and 5 volt to the intake air and engine temp sensors.

I also did some re-configuring on other white inputs and trying to get the oil pressure, no go. Dropped for now.

More sorting put of this next week.

Hi there,
I just stumbled upon this forum looking for some Timing Map advice for my VW run by my FT550.  Its a street car, but with the following.  I'm just looking for some advice on my map (attached).   Thank you in advance.[attachment=1]

1957 Beetle:

Engine:
94x76.3 2118cc
7.5:1
EFI - Fueltech FT550
CB wedge port 44x37.5
1.25 rocker
SLR XV294 cam
DubShop 48mm single intake
DubShop crank trigger
CB injection intakes 2"
550cc inj Bosch
A1 Turbo exhaust
AGP .48 5157B turbo
Water meth inj

You can send mail How can I send a MAP
/// Micke        vwpprmi@gmail.com

2000+ hp;

http://youtu.be/sb4tkakG374 (http://youtu.be/sb4tkakG374)


Best rgs
BB

at 7bar you can get a lot of powder
Yes, it's cool ;D
/// M

I think it is super cool that they choose our platform as a base for their engine. Flat 4. I think that says a bit about the potential.

Take care my friend

-BB.

And there we go again!

Time to break the piggy bank!

https://www.fueltech.net/pages/ft700

(https://i.shgcdn.com/aa289d39-5d43-47c7-be94-86f189262060/-/format/auto/-/preview/3000x3000/-/quality/lighter/)

Watched the release this morning.  They really have looked a long ways ahead and given themselves a lot of room to grow with this 700.

I would need way more car to make use of a VCU like that.  :)