The Cal-look Lounge

48IDA’s new or used Italian what are the differences and what are the problems to look for on the old ones? What you buy? ???

I just went through this procedure. What I found was finding a good set of unmolested Italian IDAs was difficult. (And expensive.) A lot of them have been modified, beat up, hacked up, missing parts etc. Then once you get them you have to have them rebuilt, rejeted etc. Unless you just have to have the Italian IDAs, I would go with a new set. There is no difference in performance and you know they have not been beat to death. If you do go after a used set, check the throttle shafts to make sure they are tight. Make sure all the parts are there. And that none of the screws/brass have been cross threaded. Then get prepared to send them off and pay about half of what you bought them for to get them rebuilt and jetted.

--louis

Dont know what to do as the new and old ones are about the same money and everyone seems to go on about Italian IDAs

thank for the coments Louis

I've been told the same thing Ron , as much as I want a pair of Italians' 8) ,it makes far more sense it would appear to get a pair of new one's  :-\

I have no personal experience with the new ones, but I know I wouldnt swap my Italians for a set that speaka spanish ;)
One thing I dont like about the new ones is the color of the casting.... its way off from the Italian versions.

 though I may treat my self to a pair for xmas before the dollar starts dropping off.  8)

 

Ron why do you want to buy some old shit just get some new one's. :D

we're all suckers for old shit .............



















thats why we drive old vws  ;)

Yeah, having said all that, I went out and bought a pair of Italian ones too.   ;)  But I talked to several people who deal with them on a daily basis and their opinion was, unless you just want them to say "Made in Italy" there is no performance reason to buy a used set. And the initial cost may be the same, but you also have to factor in repairs to the cost on the old ones. Last time I checked, Art T. charged around $300 - $400 in labor alone to rebuild a set. (Fortunately, mine were already rebuilt which is the only reason I bought them.)


--louis

Original Italian IDAs are just like having genuine BRMs... It's all about the kudos 8)
Sure, they can be beat to death (and cost a fortune), but having the real deal on your car makes it just that little bit special.
Genuine all the way!

Oi, Keeno, get back in that shed!

You've a car to finish!

;)

Amen" ;D

Who says you have to pay someone to rebuild it? Buy a rebuild kit and do it yourself, its a carburetor not rocket surgery ;)

Couple of things I would watch out for if you try to find some used ones...

water/moisture damage, which on the carb bodies, will show up as a white fuzz. On the jet stack it will appear as a dry greenish fuzz. If the damage is left to spread, it can erode the carb bodies away. Water down the jet cavities and into the float chamber is the worst.

Jets that don't seat correctly are a problem, caused by gorilla-fisted tuners and/or the moisture damage mentioned above. The jet stacks should seat firmly with a minute amount of effort when screwing into carb bodies. If the jet stacks seem to bind up as you screw them in, or seem to never seat, or seat "softly" then rest assured there is a problem in the jet cavity.

twisted throttle shafts can be checked with a feeler gauge. Make sure butterfly to throat clearance is the same on both throats. set idle speed screw so a .006" gauge drags between closest throat and plate, then check the other one.

Some carbs I have heard of are sold with whored-out jet stacks and/or needle valves. What I mean, is it seems like some sellers sweep up the weirdest jet combos, emulsion tubes, needle valves etc, in order to sell the carbs "complete." If you have to replace every jet, tube, holder, etc....then you might as well find a bare set.

Funny drillings, hogged out float bowls, aftermarket stuff would all tend to make me look elsewhere too. If you need to buy new needle valves, I would HIGHLY suggest using only original Weber ones, not aftermarket ones.

good luck,
Jim

now that every one is getting IDA's - must be a over flow of IDF's out there - not to change the thread - but looking for 44's or 48's  IDF's - in good shape of course

Actually I think a bunch of IDAs are coming on the market due to the turbo craze. Guess some people think they are upgrading when they go from IDAs to a hair dryer.  ::)

--louis

drop me a line in the spring once i've got my ida's sorted out , may have a pair of 44idf's up for grabs

Sorry, but I have to disagree with you.  Your comparison to BRMs is rediculous.  There's a HUGE difference between a heavyweight Aluminum fake BRM and the Mg real one.
The new Weber IDAs are GENUINE WEBER.

Anyone considering buying used carbs should not buy any carb used in an offroad application, or from a car with an open engine.  Sand and dirt destroys carbs real fast

There is a huge difference between a genuine IDA and a Spanish or other remake. Put them side by side and check out the difference in quality of casting. The new ones look rough in comparison. "Made in Italy" means quaility. All of the Weber carbs built outside of Italy do not come close to the quality and precision of the orginators. Pull out the jets on a new 'Weber ICT' or IDF and you will see a great diference between the acuracy of machining, especially recently. I fitted a brand new set of ICTs to a Fastback last week and could not get the thing to run any sense. It ran lean and then ran rich all of a sudden. Pulled the carbs apart and found that every single jet drilling hole had been done a ham-fisted chimp with a square drill bit. Never seen such poor quality work in a carburettor, ever. Had to pull the carbs and send them back to the supplier. Junk >:(
Oh, and don't get me stared on those Chinese Empi HPMX pieces of junk. Fitted two sets and they were both junk. Porous float bowls, amongst other quality control issues. Won't ever fit a set again.

Italy all the way.

Just go for Jenvey
 :P
simplicity all the way :)

Well Matt what side of the bed did you get out of. ;D ;D ;D ;D

I have worked on both old Italian and new Weber IDAs, and the difference in quality of manufacture is minimal.  Your examples of flaws in IDFs or ICTs is irrelevant to the discussion.  Those are crap carbs.  The new IDAs are not.
Just MO based on working on both.

You guys are right... I am bitching. ;D
Just had a bad week with crap quality carbs and lost out on a day's pay as a result  >:(
Smiling again now though ;)

yeah just get one off those old shit holley's with a turbo no end of shit ah  boom boom! :P ;D

Yes you got me there thanks mate. ;D

But that Holley is still better than your FI. :P

Thanks for the advice guys.
Currently looking at a few options and will let you know how I get on.

rocket ron, good luck with your project. Here is another site you can get "opinions" from.... I lurk here, just to see what these 48IDA guys are up to:

http://www.gt40s.com/forum/gt40-tech-engines-induction-exhaust/

also, I know Mazda RX7 guys are using 48's... so you can check around with them for carbs for sale and/or their opinion of the New vs the Old.

have fun,
Jim

Cheers Jim some real cool stuff on there. I love the IDA injection setups  :o :o :o


I'll let you know how I get on.

Hi, i am Italian.....so i bought a pair of old made in Bologna 48 Ida's. NOw i need a lot of spare parts like pumps rods and screws and so on....who can i contact, could you write me any links to ask for?
many thanks.

there is a huge difference between a genuine IDA and a Spanish or other remake. Put them side by side and check out the difference in quality of casting. The new ones look rough in comparison. "Made in Italy" means quaility. All of the Weber carbs built outside of Italy do not come close to the quality and precision of the orginators. Pull out the jets on a new 'Weber ICT' or IDF and you will see a great diference between the acuracy of machining, especially recently. I fitted a brand new set of ICTs to a Fastback last week and could not get the thing to run any sense. It ran lean and then ran rich all of a sudden. Pulled the carbs apart and found that every single jet drilling hole had been done a ham-fisted chimp with a square drill bit. Never seen such poor quality work in a carburettor, ever. Had to pull the carbs and send them back to the supplier. Junk >:(
Oh, and don't get me stared on those Chinese Empi HPMX pieces of junk. Fitted two sets and they were both junk. Porous float bowls, amongst other quality control issues. Won't ever fit a set again.

Italy all the way.
[/quote]

My mum had a FIAT 127 and that was made in Italy, it was fucking shit!

kindest regards

Andy

 :D

My mum had a FIAT 127 and that was made in Italy, it was fucking shit!

kindest regards

Andy
[/quote]your not wrong there fella 127's are shit. ;D ;D ;D

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D................

Do you know how that would compare with Seat 127?  :P

No such thing as a SEAT 127, I think you're referring to my delightful SEAT IBIZA of a 1990 vintage, aint no pile of filthy Italian scrap, it's a low mileage pile of Spanish scrap, but it's 900cc of mayhem, all mine and paid for in full  ;)