The Cal-look Lounge

Hi Folks,

I have heared that KS bearings are better than the mahle one`s.Is that true or myth?
Is there anyone who had some problems with the Mahle bearings. Are the measures incorrect?

KS bearings are harder to get, the most sellers advertise Mahle.

Thanks,
Felix

This is what Jim told me some time ago.

http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php/topic,7444.0.html

Here in the Netherlands I'm even having a hard time finding Mahle bearings, the usually sell Sintermetal??

I believe that Mahle mains have the oiling groove on the OD, and Kolbenschmidt mains have the oiling path on the ID. I never used Mahles thou.. I have a set of German kolbenschmidt bearings going to my 2276.

I had problems with flywheel side Mahle bearing. It had 0.1mm endplay to the case and I did not notice it when I assemled the engine. After 50km of driving I took the engine out, flywheel off and I could rotate the bearing with my fingers. I replaced all bearings with Kolbenschmidt and no problems anymore. I will propably never use Mahle's again if I have a choice.

Didn´t you notice this when setting crankshaft endplay ?  or did you set it at 0,1mm and then obviously had NO endplay between crankshaft/bearing but instead endplay between bearing/case ?

I set the endplay at 0,15mm, so the crankshaft roteted like it should and I really didn't know there was endplay between bearing and case. I measured the Kolbensmidt endplay before installing the flywheel and it was tight to the case.

I prefer KS...  :D

I now could compare Mahle and KS bearings, as I didn`t get any KS bearings...

You are 100% correct about the oiling path!
The oil channel on the mahle bearings is a bit smaller and on the outside.
The oil only exits on 2 spots where the max. preasure due the piston works happens.

BUT which concept is better? Full oil circle inside(KS) or yust two spots (Mahle)?

Any thoughts on this difference?
Left: KS         Right: Mahle

The oil channel on the inside is much better for the case . I personly only use KS bearings .

udo

hallo,

is there somebody who used those Sintermetal bearings?
i bought new bearings for my 2110 and it are Sintermetals.
any good?

henk!!!

can post some pics of those sintermetal bearings?

I use the KS, but with lack of them here in the states with the steel back, I've went to the Silverlights, they have the steel back, not a bad bearing. The silverlights cam bearings do suck.

Ted

bought some KS some time ago, thinking they had the good oil path...
well they were the same like my old mahle bearings  :'(
so not all KS are good
used them anyway

Also had some problems with KS they were the wrong size. Stock sized on the box but they did not fit on the the crank and measured out to almost 0.20mm to small!

x2

My 2c. KS bearings were really grate for long time... unfortunately the quality f them is worse and worse. It started with mixed sizes of bearings in one box (quite often in a box of 0.5x0.25x21 you could get center main in STD or all bearings totally different than it was on the box). And it wasn't 1 box of 10 it was let’s say 3 of 10...
At the moment new KS bearings are carp... with light center (split) main bearing. Even CB started to sell genuine STD heavy center main bearings separately. I heard from my machine shop (they are in business for over 35 years and always worked on KS) that KS doesn’t do bearings any more, they make offers for factories – the cheapest wins – I hope it’s not true.
I did my last engine on Silver line (which is, as they say, factory VW bearings for 1.6i Mexico engines). They are really nice but have to be careful with setting end play.
Mahle bearings I used to use are ok, quality is all the time the same, no mixed sizes of bearings etc...

Sintermetal... total carp... good maybe for (shity - made cheep and just "to be") 1200 engines.

If someone has old KS lets say 6 years and older (the older the better) he've got a real treasure.

Sintermetals are crap - I had to deburr them because I couldn't put them on crank ::)

HI Actually
YOu almost ask the seller if ther are trimetal (backed steeled ) or not! ;)
In most case the actual set from KS or Malhe are comming with very light main central  bearing ...I can't even tell you how much  they can last on a stock engine!!
Most of the bearing from the suppliers are sh..T!
This is a real problem for us and for most of all the VW scene!
We just received someheavy  glyco ones in std/std
performance from our aircooled engine still grow every year but now the bearing quaility really don't follow that! what a shame..
JR

here is a picture af the bearings.
i'm not gonna use them,they look like cheesy aluminium.

henk!!!

i got a set of those also, but no chance for a pic yet. 

they come in rather big white, red and blue box?  think it says Made in Europe or something on the box

What have you experienced with setting endplay?

I prefer the KSs as well and try to keep a stash away. All bearings should be checked regardless of brand.

With those silverline I ended with quite a big end play. Had to use really thick shims (don't remember but I think I used something around 1,1mm shims total to get about 0,15mm end play (I use dial gauge instead filler gauge).
After run in and checking the end play finally ended up with around 0,96ish mm of shims to get 0,13-0,15mm endplay.
The engine cases halves were machined on sealing surface and than everything remachined (cam, crank, oil pump, crank seal, etc... to its diameters), but I don't think it has something to do with the end play. I got another 2 engines with silverline bearings and will see if it will be the same (one will be machined as the one I mentioned and another will be genuine alycase).

I remember that Udo has good experiences with Silverline's, i've orderd a set to and the ''look'' really nice, let see if it's up to any good. (have to build yet)

Yes they look very nice, the center main is heavy as it should be. At the moment my No.1 on the market.

i bought a new set last week of KS.
the probleme with these are now that the bearing on the side of the flywheel does not fit the case.
the "U-profile" of the bearing is to small,looks like it has to been machined out a bit to fit.
has anybody had this or done this before?
the sintermetal looks like crap but they did fit much better.

henk!!!

Clemex bearing also have the steel back center main as well.

enny body have experince whit the clemex bearing?
is the oil groove in the back of the bearing or is on cranksahaft side?

The clemex bearing have the oil groove on the inside. The finish is not as good as the Sliver Line. Will posted photos later as I'm out at the mo.  :)

Clemex has also nice camshaft bearings, don't know about the crank versions.. Don't use Sintermetal.

Clemex
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b115/gold65turbo/IMG_0394.jpg)

Sliver Line
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b115/gold65turbo/IMG_0395.jpg)

Can someone tell me if Sintermetal are ok to use for con-rod bearings? What should be the problems compared to other bearings if the size is ok? Different material?

feels like paper those main bearings.. Don't know about con-rod's but i would guess they be the same. I would not use the brand in any way. Mahle KS Clemex Silverline all good about those.

There weren't available. I have silverline main, mahle camshaft and sintermetal con-rod.

Go with Clevite's for your rods, you won't be disapointed.

http://www.drdracingheads.com/xcart/Rod-Bearings.html for example...

i can send you a set of KS or Mahles.

PS: nice engine project you have again ViNcE! keep it up

can somebody tell me how big the bearing on the flywheel side should be between the "U" on a STD. bearing?
the KS bearing i have now measures between 21,85 and 21,90.
is this normal or a bit to small,as they don't fit in my case.

henk!!!

measure your case, it should be around a round number like 22.00 or 21.00.

If you have the bearing and the case they should have a snug fit, and for me the best way to test it is by rotating the bearing until it hits its dowelpin hole. *click* should it say (haha difficult to explain)

The bearing could be 21.97 and the case 22.00 that's fine. But not a whole tenth off! bearing should have some ''kapspanning'' as it is said in dutch.

Measure your case, machine the bearing to it.

Had that same problem with KS. Throwed them away :)

Clemex bearings are the OE bearing for Mexico. They are identical to the OE bearings(production #'s and manufacturing) that were around about a year ago. They are steel backed on the center main and seem to hold up well. 

Sounds like you got the KS bearings that do not fit. all where in a shorter and higher box than the older ones

Udo

hallo,

yes,looks like it just my luck again.
i had them machined down a bit and now they fit perfect.
i just hope they last for some time,if i read al this i start to get scared of bearings whitout steel backings.

henk!!!