The Cal-look Lounge

hi...
best welded and balanced fan is SCAT, BERG, BUGPACK.... OR others...
tnx....

buy only OEM or original German welded and balanced fan. Aftermarket fans are cheesy.

I bought mine from Racin Jason, CLF Forum member. Here is his ad (http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=715967).

tnx 181... but the fan are balanced???

yes, balanced and ready to bolt on. I only gave it slight coat of color to prevent surface rust.

mmmmmmmmmmmm...  :o
new? 50$ or 100$
which to choose....????? ???

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/search.php?submit=yes&keywords=weld+fan&type=text&stype=all&username=&yearfrom=&yearto=&pricefrom=&priceto=&model%5B%5D=&section%5B%5D=&wanted=show&zip=&zipdist=0&state%5B%5D=&usaregion=&country=&sort=date&sort_order=DESC&submitButton=Search

i did the same.....its the best option.

Berg and Bugpack use OEM fans. I've read the Scat fans can expand if subjected to high rpm making it impossible to remove the fan from the shroud. There is a whole thread about this on the CLF.

Scat did have a problem,they changed there supplier now to use genuine welded fans,but for me its still Bergs,but whoever you use,make sure its a proper german fan,not just OEM ;)

cheers richie,uk

I use Bugpack Killer B

And then has to be cut out of the fan housing  >:(

(http://i340.photobucket.com/albums/o340/jimbo2109/IMG_0632.jpg?t=1248794075)

I bought a replacement from One On One and hammered the fuck out of it with no problems  ;D

As a side note...A serpentine pulley system allows no belt slippage and can destroy ANY welded fan when operating at high rpms. The stock v-belt design will slip eliminating this potential problem.

....soooo..... there is no kit containing both the welded fan AND a serpentine belt setup? WTF? ;D

Berg.

Berg

--louis

hi guys, what, in your experience, what makes the Berg better than, say Bugpack's? Both are made from OE VW fans.

I can't speak for the others, but I am just biased.  I prefer Berg over just about anyone else.  JMO

Berg... haven't broken one yet.
(http://www.glenn-ring.com/engine/images/155_5594.jpg)
(http://www.glenn-ring.com/engine/images/155_5595.jpg)

Berg for sure. Berg uses OEM fans, they inspect every fan for welding, the ones that fail, gets shipped back. Rich, the balancer at Bergs is very good on what he does, has been doing them for years, plus crank ass. Berg's is all I use with no problems.

Ted

I talked to Tim at Bergs the Other Day about the Fans Of Course there out of them ???  But he Told me they use Factory VW of Brazil fans then they Tig Weld,straighten, and Balance them. they sell for $100.64  said they might get some in this week I think BugPack Killer B is the same damm thing

They do sell quik, that has to tell you something. When you have one guy that welds them then one guy that straighten and balances them, you know there done right, and you know Berg's, they are very picky on what goes out the door.

Rick is right...unfortunately any fan will explode with the serpentine system. I run the Bugpack Killer Bee (and it has seen quite a few boost pulls) on the street and remove my belt on the track, just as insurance.

I have the Bugpack fan. They start with VW Brazil fans straight out of the VW box. It is"tig welded on 2 opposing points to ensure stability while allowing for flexibility at high RPM then precision balanced for smoother operation" It must work because I've never seen one come apart using a standard V groove pulley. It also appears to be painted flat black.

(http://www.jcwhitney.com/wcsstore/jcwhitney/images/imagecache/G_10827G_CL_1.jpg)

i see single weld point...
Berg weld all.

scat weld & balanced fan is the same BERG? start to original vw BRAZIL?
racing experience with scat?

 

I haven't tried Bugpack's, so I can't really say anything about them. The Berg fan on top of AssHull's motor is top notch, though. There are a lot of fans being peddled out there that are only re-inforced half way like the one pictures above. Is that a Bugpack "welded" fan??

but this is a SCAT???

 ??? ???


http://www2.cip1.com/SearchResults.asp?Search=weld+fan

this option???
not very expensive how BERG but original VW brazil weld en balanced??
what do you think guyz???

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180389286075&_trksid=p2759.l1259

Yup it is/was a Scat fan, which is why I replied to the post saying about Scat fans expanding  ;)

 :o

but now SCAT use original VW made in brazil??
now the scat fan don't have the "hole"...

I have a normal one, not welded, on my 1776 ~130Hp, and it works fine,
so my question is:
Do you realy need one?

I don't think you do.  What do you guys think causes a fan to break?  My guess is vibration.  So, what causes the vibration?  Think about a loose flywheel on one end of a crankshaft... the pulley on the other end loosens from the harmonics sent through the crankshaft.  If you were to apply that theory to the alternator / generator, that would leave the pulley to question.  Now, lets say you don't have all ten shims either inside or outside the pulley.  The tightening nut could bottom on the shaft and allow the pulley to wobble at rpm sending harmonics down the shaft to the fan.  I've never owned a welded fan and I can assure you I've twisted up plenty of rpm over the years... but always with an OEM VW alternator pulley / fan and ten shims.  My $.02.

Fan bugpack did have a problem my old 1776 with 48 ida for 6500 rpm in 1/8 miles but I preferd fan berg 100 % for me no problem  ;)
(http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/3544/bleu66petard1.jpg) (http://img31.imageshack.us/i/bleu66petard1.jpg/)
(http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/8681/moteurcass.jpg) (http://img31.imageshack.us/i/moteurcass.jpg/)

I exploded a non welded fan in my 1600 many years ago and it sure made a mess.  Once you have one let go you will never go with a non welded fan.  Sil Modesti welded my first fan and I have used nothing but Bergs since.  I agree that it is important to ensure that the fan is tight and straight.  One thing I do is instead of the big wavy washer I use another one of the thick spacer washers and put blue loctite in the washer.  You may wonder why, but I have had the center of the fan eaten out from it working back and forth.  Since I switched from the wavy washer I have had no problem with that.  Steve Hollingsworth told me about using the thick washer on both sides of the fan.  He said that he could never get enough contact with the wavy washer to ensure it stayed tight.

Welded Fans are a must with the use of a 356 top pulley. Smaller top pulley = higher Fan RPM's

Berg fan on my 2110.  In my opinion it's cheap insurance against ruining your engine.  Even the least expensive performane engine build costs a decent amount of money, 1 to 2 thousand dollars at the least and I spent quite a bit more than that.  Why would you not spend some extra money on the part that is responsible for drawing in and blowing air over your engine to cool it and make sure you have the best that you can?  The fan is such a major part of the cooling system.  I don't think this is a good item to try and save money on. Also, the stock fan was never designed to be accelerated and spun at the RPM that a high performance VW engine can.  Just my opinion.

Today BERG inc. ship me a pack!
tnx all!!!

What is the proper way to install the fan using the hardware? 

Does it go in order the fan hub, then pulley spacer shims, then the large flat washer, the fan, the large wavy washer, and finally the nut?

I never understood if the pulley spacer shims went against the fan or underneath the big washer, then Don said he does not use the wavy washer at all.

I can never remember, so I always consult Bentley.

I put a large washer on the hub then the fan then another large (thick) washer then the nut.  You may need to put shims on to position the fan correctly within the shroud.  Usually it is not necessary though.  I also put blue loctite on the washers to ensure that the fan does not move on the hub.  It can be a pain to take off, but it does not come loose.  That way the washers and the fan pretty much become one with the hub.  I have had the fan center eaten out by it moving when I used the wavy washer.

Here's a fan layout pic out of an old Type I parts catalogue.  The book calls for six shims as opposed to "as required" for the generator pulley.  Once again, I feel the shims are the key to keeping things together and are there to move the fan in or out of the housing.  Whether they be under or on top of the fan, the thickness of the stack should be kept.

Hey Sarge, get back to work ;D I bet some impatient yuppie is at your counter right now while you're in back scanning dusty old catalogs

 ::) sigh.....  "So,um how much are your $3.00 parts??"   :'( 

 ;D

Sarge, Do you run a Standard size crank pulley as well? as i was gonna use a Berg power pulley with a welded fan but not so sure that i need to now?

Any advice is very helpfull

Cheers

I'm running a stock diameter Berg Equalizer with an OEM alternator pulley.  The fan is a 131-119-031 OEM piece in a "round style" early 40hp shroud with 356 / 912 Porsche oil cooler.  I ran a power pulley in my '63 years ago with a stock OEM fan and beat the snot out of it with no problems.  Have fun! ;)

"oh, I've got a helmet"

If you're in the UK I understand that One on One do the best ones..... ;)

http://www.vwoneonone.co.uk/ (http://www.vwoneonone.co.uk/)

Any discussion on the "stock size" Berg pulley actually being slightly larger than OEM VW, and the affect this has on our fans?  I like the cooling benefit, but...?

That's what I run, and it fitted first time (unlike the Scat one) and I've had no problems  ;)