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rick m
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« on: February 03, 2013, 17:30:23 pm » |
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Another piece of a Bay Bus motor we found destroyed was the brass distributor drive gear. I have never personally seen this happen and wondered if anyone on the lounge has seen this happen. Would be interested in knowing what you may have determined as the root cause. To appreciate this, look at a stock brass gear and compare to my picture.
Rick M
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Rick Mortensen
Driving Hot VWs since 1970
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Erlend / bug66
Global Moderator
Hero Member
Posts: 955
SCC Event
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« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2013, 17:35:29 pm » |
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If the distributor drive is not seated, and you turn the engine, this could happen.
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The '67:
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Not yet..
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deano
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« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2013, 17:43:53 pm » |
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Non-German gears do this on a regular basis. VERY common these days.
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Hot VWs Magazine Window Washer
Anglia Obsolete Guru
'67 Heaven
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Type1/DVK
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« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2013, 17:57:10 pm » |
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 From your other topic.. no full flow and those pieces flying around? think this is what happend. |
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DDD#8 - 14.74sec @ 1776cc - Member of: DVK ~ Der Vollgas Kreuzers - www.ultimatevw.nl - and racing engines |
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Cheesepanzer
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« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2013, 18:03:14 pm » |
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seen it with improper amount of shims. Also seen one completely distroyed when the wrong drive great was installed (40hp into a 1600).  |
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62 Beetle (street/strip build)
63 Type 2 Single Cab
Cornpanzers
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TexasTom
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« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2013, 18:16:16 pm » |
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Happened to me on a 2054 build a few years ago ... I ONLY use German distributor drive gears now!
The gear I had used that did the damage had 2 slots cut in it to mate with the distributor; manufacturer unknown ... Beware!
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Work, work, WORK!
Modesty accepted here ...
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richie
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« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2013, 18:19:20 pm » |
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Rick was it a newer case? with stock style fuel pump,seen it to many times and its not only with repo gears,with that wear the timing would have been moving around alot which would contribute to the piston damage
cheers richie
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Cars are supposed to be driven, not just talked about!!! Good parts might be expensive but good advice is priceless  |
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rick m
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« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2013, 18:41:17 pm » |
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Thanks everyone. This is a friend of a friend I am just giving a hand. The owner bought a long block and put all the top end pieces on it himself. He is not an experienced engine builder and I think he just did not pay attention to a few critical things when adding his parts to the motor. I feel the timing issues did affect the motor running hot as well. The miraculous thing is that this even ran before we took it apart.
RM
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Rick Mortensen
Driving Hot VWs since 1970
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65bug
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« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2013, 19:04:43 pm » |
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Rick,
I know I have the one I purchased for my last motor build. I happened to show it to Tim down at Berg and he told me DO NOT USE THAT GEAR! He went on to explain that the gear was made with too soft of a material. I purchased a gear from them and never had a problem!
I know I still have that grenade in it's box in the garage.......HA! If anyone is really interested in the brand I will dig it up....
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rick m
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« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2013, 20:43:42 pm » |
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Richie...
It was a brand new case, crank, rods, pistons, heads, everything. He got it from one of the wholesale distribution houses. It actually had some decent parts inside but the distributor drive gear is obviously not one of the good parts.
I have a pretty good stash of NOS parts for my own use.... but what specific brand of brass gear is everyone running now where the hardness is good? Sounds like I may need to just call up the BERGS. Not worth ruining a motor over the least costly part inside of it.
Rick M
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Rick Mortensen
Driving Hot VWs since 1970
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65bug
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« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2013, 20:46:14 pm » |
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Rick,
Yessir! I would phone Berg tomorrow and get the exact data. The Scat Lube a lobe lifters and Scat Killer Bee fan got my motor. Luckily I caught it early and it did not do any damage.....
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richie
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« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2013, 22:10:47 pm » |
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Richie...
It was a brand new case, crank, rods, pistons, heads, everything. He got it from one of the wholesale distribution houses. It actually had some decent parts inside but the distributor drive gear is obviously not one of the good parts.
I have a pretty good stash of NOS parts for my own use.... but what specific brand of brass gear is everyone running now where the hardness is good? Sounds like I may need to just call up the BERGS. Not worth ruining a motor over the least costly part inside of it.
Rick M
There is a problem with some new cases were the fuel pump mounting area and holes in the case arent quite correct,the bakerlite fuel pump spacer doesnt fit flat is the giveaway,anyway the fuel pump push rod sits to far out on the dizzy drive lobe and it can cause problems with everything in that area,just something to look for cheers richie |
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Cars are supposed to be driven, not just talked about!!! Good parts might be expensive but good advice is priceless |
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rick m
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« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2013, 07:03:05 am » |
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Thanks Richie....we will be checking everything out when we reassemble it. It is the first time I encountered anything related to the brass gear going away.
RM
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Rick Mortensen
Driving Hot VWs since 1970
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Jon
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Posts: 3214
12,3@174km/t at Gardermoen 2008
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« Reply #13 on: February 04, 2013, 17:26:55 pm » |
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I had a engine eat up a cheep gear... I'm sure my magneto helped it failing.
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Grumpy old men have signatures like this.
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Nico86
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« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2013, 14:39:30 pm » |
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How to know if you get a German drive gear when you buy a new one? I've bought what they call "crankshaft mounting kit" (I don't remember if that's the Bugpack or the CB kit I have) but nothing mentions where the drive gear has been made  |
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« Last Edit: February 06, 2013, 14:50:07 pm by Nico86 »
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Nico86
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« Reply #15 on: February 06, 2013, 14:48:01 pm » |
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deano
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« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2013, 15:12:55 pm » |
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I would be almost affaid of what is now commonly sold new over the counter. That's why I go to the better known engine builders and swap meets looking for vintage quality. Can you even get a brand new German-made brass timing gear any longer?
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Hot VWs Magazine Window Washer
Anglia Obsolete Guru
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65bug
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« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2013, 15:31:10 pm » |
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Not sure. But it amazes me how many people will readily put Chinese junk in their motors. I have a huge box with just German nuts bolt's and wavy lock washers. I learned my lesson and never again. I would take used German over new chinese............
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Nico86
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« Reply #18 on: February 06, 2013, 22:26:57 pm » |
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I took a look and the crankshaft mounting kit I've got mentions nothing, it's just a blank plastic bag.
What about the distributor drive pinion/shaft? Could it cause problems as well? The new ones only seem to be either Empi-branded ones, or VW-OEM but Mexican/Brazilian made.
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« Last Edit: February 06, 2013, 22:30:47 pm by Nico86 »
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modnrod
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« Reply #19 on: February 07, 2013, 03:51:20 am » |
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Remember the good old days when Brazil OEM was passed over for German? As opposed to now, when OEM Mexico/Brazil is actively searched for? |
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Nico86
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« Reply #20 on: February 09, 2013, 14:17:43 pm » |
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rick m
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« Reply #21 on: February 13, 2013, 01:14:48 am » |
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We are using a good old stock german brass gear that is perfect. Not going to chance an aftermarket on the rebuild.
RM
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Rick Mortensen
Driving Hot VWs since 1970
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TexasTom
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« Reply #22 on: February 13, 2013, 01:50:12 am » |
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What about the drive gear, Rick?
Got a good one?
TxT
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Work, work, WORK!
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65bug
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« Reply #23 on: February 13, 2013, 15:46:14 pm » |
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Did he say German?  |
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rick m
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« Reply #24 on: February 20, 2013, 02:00:39 am » |
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Have good drive gears too!
RM
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Rick Mortensen
Driving Hot VWs since 1970
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