Sway-a-Way vs Empi Heavy Duty Axles

[aussie]

Heard different things about both these axles and now confused over which brand would be the best. From what I understand they are now both made in China. Always thought the SAW's would be the go but have been told that the quality has been suffering of late. 

Recommendations + experiences welcome. Axles will be used on street/strip car.

Cheers, Ian

[Hotrodvw]

I was at the same cross roads, and stuck with my stock german OEM axles.  I've heard from many that they'll endure quite a bit, as long as the wheel hop is kept minimal.  Roll the dice!!!  I wasn't going to spend the $$$$$ for China garbage.

[Donny B.]

I have SAW axles in my car and I will replace them the next time the tranny is out of the car.  My car is a street car and I have had issues with the spades gauling and cracking the fulcrum plates.  I will have a set of stock German axles shot peened and polished.  The SAW axles may be OK for drag racing where you don't put a lot of miles on them, but I wouldn't recommend them for the street unless you drive like a drag racer and don't put on a lot of miles.

[Jason Foster]

  I have a 2007 set of SAW axles in my car and knock on wood no probs.  My buddy Daniel S/G car had 2006 sway aways for about 3 seasons and we broke one last season. Due to multiple horror stories of current SAW axles and the suggestion from Jim Koforski to use the EMPI ones that's whats in the car now and again Knock on wood they are holding strong.

[aussie]

I have SAW axles in my car and I will replace them the next time the tranny is out of the car.  My car is a street car and I have had issues with the spades gauling and cracking the fulcrum plates.  I will have a set of stock German axles shot peened and polished.  The SAW axles may be OK for drag racing where you don't put a lot of miles on them, but I wouldn't recommend them for the street unless you drive like a drag racer and don't put on a lot of miles.

When roughly did you purchase the SAW's? Not sure when they first started having the problems. Have you considered EMPI ones instead of spending the $'s on stockers?

[aussie]

  I have a 2007 set of SAW axles in my car and knock on wood no probs.  My buddy Daniel S/G car had 2006 sway aways for about 3 seasons and we broke one last season. Due to multiple horror stories of current SAW axles and the suggestion from Jim Koforski to use the EMPI ones that's whats in the car now and again Knock on wood they are holding strong.

Interesting..... how come Jim preferes the EMPI's? Are they better made/better material?

[Donny B.]

When roughly did you purchase the SAW's? Not sure when they first started having the problems. Have you considered EMPI ones instead of spending the $'s on stockers?

I bought them around 1998 or so.  The issues have been there for a while.

[richie]

1st bad batch from sway a way were dated 99 on the ends,they seemed ok for a while after that,then returned to there poor quality again a couple fo years ago,the 1st batch of Empis I saw last year had other issues as well,some were not even true/straight,
I saw one set set up in a lathe and they wobbled like crazy,measuring 0.100+[2.5mm+] out in the middle   They seem better now but they still  break to easily

cheers richie,uk
 

[aussie]

1st bad batch from sway a way were dated 99 on the ends,they seemed ok for a while after that,then returned to there poor quality again a couple fo years ago,the 1st batch of Empis I saw last year had other issues as well,some were not even true/straight,
I saw one set set up in a lathe and they wobbled like crazy,measuring 0.100+[2.5mm+] out in the middle   They seem better now but they still  break to easily

cheers richie,uk
 

Does not sound good Are there any other alternatives??? Back to stock and hope they last a while?

[Martin]

1st bad batch from sway a way were dated 99 on the ends,they seemed ok for a while after that,then returned to there poor quality again a couple fo years ago,the 1st batch of Empis I saw last year had other issues as well,some were not even true/straight,
I saw one set set up in a lathe and they wobbled like crazy,measuring 0.100+[2.5mm+] out in the middle   They seem better now but they still  break to easily

cheers richie,uk
 

2.5mm out! ! nothing like a bit of quality control then!

[bugnut68]

1st bad batch from sway a way were dated 99 on the ends,they seemed ok for a while after that,then returned to there poor quality again a couple fo years ago,the 1st batch of Empis I saw last year had other issues as well,some were not even true/straight,
I saw one set set up in a lathe and they wobbled like crazy,measuring 0.100+[2.5mm+] out in the middle   They seem better now but they still  break to easily

cheers richie,uk
 

Sounds like typical EMPI...lol.

[Udo]

1st bad batch from sway a way were dated 99 on the ends,they seemed ok for a while after that,then returned to there poor quality again a couple fo years ago,the 1st batch of Empis I saw last year had other issues as well,some were not even true/straight,
I saw one set set up in a lathe and they wobbled like crazy,measuring 0.100+[2.5mm+] out in the middle   They seem better now but they still  break to easily

cheers richie,uk
 

Does not sound good Are there any other alternatives??? Back to stock and hope they last a while?

the best alternative are the one made in Finnland . More expensive but good quality

Udo

[stealth67vw]

1st bad batch from sway a way were dated 99 on the ends,they seemed ok for a while after that,then returned to there poor quality again a couple fo years ago,the 1st batch of Empis I saw last year had other issues as well,some were not even true/straight,
I saw one set set up in a lathe and they wobbled like crazy,measuring 0.100+[2.5mm+] out in the middle   They seem better now but they still  break to easily

cheers richie,uk
 

Does not sound good Are there any other alternatives??? Back to stock and hope they last a while?

the best alternative are the one made in Finnland . More expensive but good quality

Udo

Karpiola info@kuplapaja.com

[aussie]

1st bad batch from sway a way were dated 99 on the ends,they seemed ok for a while after that,then returned to there poor quality again a couple fo years ago,the 1st batch of Empis I saw last year had other issues as well,some were not even true/straight,
I saw one set set up in a lathe and they wobbled like crazy,measuring 0.100+[2.5mm+] out in the middle   They seem better now but they still  break to easily

cheers richie,uk
 

Does not sound good Are there any other alternatives??? Back to stock and hope they last a while?

the best alternative are the one made in Finnland . More expensive but good quality

Udo

Have you got any details of these?
Cheers, Ian

[stealth67vw]

1st bad batch from sway a way were dated 99 on the ends,they seemed ok for a while after that,then returned to there poor quality again a couple fo years ago,the 1st batch of Empis I saw last year had other issues as well,some were not even true/straight,
I saw one set set up in a lathe and they wobbled like crazy,measuring 0.100+[2.5mm+] out in the middle   They seem better now but they still  break to easily

cheers richie,uk
 

Does not sound good Are there any other alternatives??? Back to stock and hope they last a while?

the best alternative are the one made in Finnland . More expensive but good quality

Udo

Have you got any details of these?
Cheers, Ian

See my post above. They are about $785 US dollars and supposedly have a lifetime warranty. Karpiola axles info@kuplapaja.com

[Jason Foster]

  I have a 2007 set of SAW axles in my car and knock on wood no probs.  My buddy Daniel S/G car had 2006 sway aways for about 3 seasons and we broke one last season. Due to multiple horror stories of current SAW axles and the suggestion from Jim Koforski to use the EMPI ones that's whats in the car now and again Knock on wood they are holding strong.

Interesting..... how come Jim preferes the EMPI's? Are they better made/better material?

  Not so much he prefers them just not much alternative. What Richie states is interesting... wish I hadn't read it actually. The set I have seen were not checked for trueness and are on a 200 hp or so S/G car. They have about roughly 30 or more passes by now.
  As for my SAW axles they see plenty of street miles from sometimes mild to flogging the snot out of it. Probably well over 10,000 miles and geez maybe 50 60 passes. It is what it is I'd say though either choice would be better than stock axles.

[Rasser]

I have SAW axles in my car and I will replace them the next time the tranny is out of the car.  My car is a street car and I have had issues with the spades gauling and cracking the fulcrum plates.  I will have a set of stock German axles shot peened and polished.  The SAW axles may be OK for drag racing where you don't put a lot of miles on them, but I wouldn't recommend them for the street unless you drive like a drag racer and don't put on a lot of miles.

Your problem could also be the superdiff that doesn´t allow enough oil to get to the axle ends/spades. I am going to change my super diff. to a org. vw diff. because of this. I could not drive on the highway for more than 100-150km before the axles/spades started to "knock". I stopped the car, took a 5 minute break, and could then drive 100km again before the problem appeared again. My superdiff. HAS the extra oiling holes drilled, and they are drilled in the right direction. Rear height is stock height (or very close).

[Donny B.]

Probably well over 10,000 miles

I know that sounds like a lot to most people, but try 40,000 miles.  Stock axles show virtually no wear at that point but my SAW axles were having serious issues.  I want something that lasts like stock.

[Jason Foster]

  I hear ya. I'm just wild guessing at the 10,000 range, I never zeroed my speedo when car was built I've driven it since April 2007. Anyway another you mentioned axle spade knocking I've never experienced that either now I've driven maybe 80 to 100 miles one way at most and possibly you drive further?  I also have a super diff and stock rear height. For my self I figure if I had stock axles they would end up broken so if my SAW axles end up breaking someday I'd replace with empi's unless by then a decent priced alternative came around. I figure the empi's gotta last longer than stocks would the way I drive it at least.

[Torben Alstrup]

I have SAW axles in my car and I will replace them the next time the tranny is out of the car.  My car is a street car and I have had issues with the spades gauling and cracking the fulcrum plates.  I will have a set of stock German axles shot peened and polished.  The SAW axles may be OK for drag racing where you don't put a lot of miles on them, but I wouldn't recommend them for the street unless you drive like a drag racer and don't put on a lot of miles.

Your problem could also be the superdiff that doesn´t allow enough oil to get to the axle ends/spades. I am going to change my super diff. to a org. vw diff. because of this. I could not drive on the highway for more than 100-150km before the axles/spades started to "knock". I stopped the car, took a 5 minute break, and could then drive 100km again before the problem appeared again. My superdiff. HAS the extra oiling holes drilled, and they are drilled in the right direction. Rear height is stock height (or very close).

I have experienced exactly what Rasser described on a pro street transmission about three years ago. Only it occoured after about 75 km. of constant driving. We couldnt figure out what caused it at the time, so we finally took the axles (SAW) out and polished the spades so that we got 0,08 mm more slack between the fullcrum plates and the spade. That seemed to solve the problem. At least I have not heard from the guy since.
That said, I do think that the super diffs we get nowadays are lacking QC to some extend. Because I have in my shop a Rancho pro Street (About 2½ years old but only about 1500 miles on it) that suddenly began to make noises. It turns out that the right side end gear has worn itself into the "cylinder" it sits in, to an extend that it was impossible to save the diff. I am NOT a transmission guy at all, so I can not give an explanation to how this happened. But lack of oil in the right places sounds like something in the right direction.
T

[Rasser]

I have SAW axles in my car and I will replace them the next time the tranny is out of the car.  My car is a street car and I have had issues with the spades gauling and cracking the fulcrum plates.  I will have a set of stock German axles shot peened and polished.  The SAW axles may be OK for drag racing where you don't put a lot of miles on them, but I wouldn't recommend them for the street unless you drive like a drag racer and don't put on a lot of miles.

Your problem could also be the superdiff that doesn´t allow enough oil to get to the axle ends/spades. I am going to change my super diff. to a org. vw diff. because of this. I could not drive on the highway for more than 100-150km before the axles/spades started to "knock". I stopped the car, took a 5 minute break, and could then drive 100km again before the problem appeared again. My superdiff. HAS the extra oiling holes drilled, and they are drilled in the right direction. Rear height is stock height (or very close).

I have experienced exactly what Rasser described on a pro street transmission about three years ago. Only it occoured after about 75 km. of constant driving. We couldnt figure out what caused it at the time, so we finally took the axles (SAW) out and polished the spades so that we got 0,08 mm more slack between the fullcrum plates and the spade. That seemed to solve the problem. At least I have not heard from the guy since.
That said, I do think that the super diffs we get nowadays are lacking QC to some extend. Because I have in my shop a Rancho pro Street (About 2½ years old but only about 1500 miles on it) that suddenly began to make noises. It turns out that the right side end gear has worn itself into the "cylinder" it sits in, to an extend that it was impossible to save the diff. I am NOT a transmission guy at all, so I can not give an explanation to how this happened. But lack of oil in the right places sounds like something in the right direction.
T

Sidegear "burned/melted" into the differential housing  =   Badass one wheel burnouts!!!

My superdiff. is a old CB Performance casting. The metal is extremely soft compared to original differentials.

[speed7]

After tearing up my stock mexican axles and gearbox at DDD, I'm mounting SAW on my new Rancho box .
Should I have to polish the Spade ends or ? ....
Thanks
Marc