Gas Burners, tubes or not??

[sambaboy]

i have just got a set of genuine gas burners & im fitting 145 & 205 tyres. im a bit confused about the whole inner tube situation??

just wondering how many people on here are running genuine fuchs or gas burners without inner tubes & what your views are?

is it really that dangerous?

[Rocket Ron]

I've always run tubes, 145 n a 5-6 " rim is not really the best combo

they  are usually £5- 10 per tube and well worth the investment for piece of mind IMO 

[sambaboy]

icheers ron.
is it just a standard 15" tube i need?

[2manytoys]

I have run wiith and without tubes on the real deal fuchs. The Fuch is a tube type rim, but there are some rubber valve stems that will work, although I suggest tubes. On Fuchs, it is the shape of the stem area the make it difficult.

[GASBNR]

I run tubes in mine. My understanding is you
have to due to not having a safety lip.

[Sam K]

I've been told that you need to run tubes in early fuchs since they don't have a safety bead, but I've been using mine without tubes for about ten years without any problems. I have 5.5's and 6's with 175/55's and 205/65's.

[Rocket Ron]

icheers ron.
is it just a standard 15" tube i need?

15 " but they come in various sizes / widths

[Chris W]

I have the same set up exactly, no tubes and no problems.

[sambaboy]

thanks for the replies guys. you can see why its confusing now, some say you have to run tubes & some say you dont. im still in 2 minds.

i want it to be as safe as poss as the car will be driven at fairly high speeds!

 

[Zach Gomulka]

Did Porsche use tubes on the lightest wheel the factory made? I doubt it. I'd go without.

[madfrog]

If i may , the problem is not only should I run tube or not but which tires am I using with tube or not.

The modern "tubeless" tires name is confusing because they are in fact equiped with a tube that cover the inner part of the tire.

The tube or the tube part of tubeless are made of the same  material called "butyl" and the problem if you put a tube in a tubeless tire

is that the two "butyl" surfaces are rubbing together and can wear very very quickly (ten time quicker from the tests conducted)

I didn't know that in the 70's when the "tubeless" tires came out and used tube with "tubeless" tires without problems

but it is not what the tire manufacturers recommend.

Michelin is selling a special tube to use in conjunction with  "tubeless" type tires, makiing the process safe if a little more expensive.

You can of course  use a tube with a tube type tire without problem


madfrog

[GASBNR]

I run tubes in mine. My understanding is you
have to due to not having a safety lip.

here in Australia they will not fit tyres without
tubes without the safety lip I just learnt.
Fair point with tyre sizes Porsche didn't fit
145's to the gasburner I'm guessing

safety first IMO

[Rocket Ron]

For £20 is it not worth the extra piece of mind

30 + year old wheels and the incorrect size tires dont add up to the best combination IMO.

porsche may not have run them but they weren't running the wrong size tires on there rims. I take it you have a street car , would the extra weight make any difference ?

It not a big deal if you feel comfortable running without then do it , it probably ok.

just my 2c

[Zach Gomulka]

I take it you have a street car , would the extra weight make any difference ?

                                               

Then get repro wheels. And as a bonus, you get safety beads (not to mention quite a few extra quid in your pocket).

[sambaboy]

they are for my street & occasional strip oval. im using firestone f560 145's & bridgestone dueller 205/70's.

im quite happy to use tubes, just wondered what other people thought about it.

sounds like tubes are the safest option.

[Lightning]

Haven't even thought about this. Just put the tires onto the burners and drove away. Been doing that for the last 5 years and app. 25' km without any trouble. But I use 185/65 tires both front and rear, prefer driveability over looks.

[Bruce]

here in Australia they will not fit tyres without
tubes without the safety lip ........

Then the tyre guys downunder don't understand the purpose of safety bead humps.  Those humps have nothing to do with tubeless tyres, it's a separate design feature that Chevrolet invented in the mid 50s, but purposely did not patent as a gift to the automotive world.
For some strange reason, VW didn't want to use it right away.  In 1957, VW went to tubless tyres, but without safety bead humps.  For 10 years, VW manufactured MILLIONS of cars this way.  They waited until 1967 before they added the humps.
The only purpose of the humps is to help keep the bead of the tyre on the rim when the tyre loses all it's air.  If you get a blowout at speed, the car will be safer as you coast to the side of the road if the tyre's beads stay on the rim.

[48IDA66]

I got tubes as well on mine...

[flatfire]

Interesting. The only downside to tubes in theory, would be they allow a substandard tyre to survive undetected untill catastrophic failure occurs.

Just thinking out the box

[Bruce]

One downside to using tubes is the unnecessary addition of weight to one of the lightest, strongest wheels you could put on your VW.

[alex d]

back in the day (check the blue bentleys) VW didn't recommend running radials without tubes.....that being said I've run plenty of radials without tubes in different kinds of non-safety rims without any problem (besides the occasional leaking wheel)

[Jon]

here in Australia they will not fit tyres without
tubes without the safety lip ........

Then the tyre guys downunder don't understand the purpose of safety bead humps.  Those humps have nothing to do with tubeless tyres, it's a separate design feature that Chevrolet invented in the mid 50s, but purposely did not patent as a gift to the automotive world.
For some strange reason, VW didn't want to use it right away.  In 1957, VW went to tubless tyres, but without safety bead humps.  For 10 years, VW manufactured MILLIONS of cars this way.  They waited until 1967 before they added the humps.
The only purpose of the humps is to help keep the bead of the tyre on the rim when the tyre loses all it's air.  If you get a blowout at speed, the car will be safer as you coast to the side of the road if the tyre's beads stay on the rim.

Thanks for great info Bruce!

[Straight Time]

Can you run tubes on the strip ? I have oem Gasburners and hope to have the odd run on the drag strip. What would happen if the tyre grips well and the rim spins within the tyre ?

[Bruce]

back in the day (check the blue bentleys) VW didn't recommend running radials without tubes.....

Those would be tube type radial tyres.  I don't think you can buy tube type radials anymore.

[Bruce]

What would happen if the tyre grips well and the rim spins within the tyre ?

I have seen the effect of this.  The tube spins with the tyre.  The valve stem doesn't like this.....

[K-Roc]

What you need to do is drill about six or seven 1/8 holes into the side of your Gasburners then use sheet metal screws and screw the rim to the tire bead... this will help it from spinning on the rim.....

[madfrog]

back in the day (check the blue bentleys) VW didn't recommend running radials without tubes.....

Those would be tube type radial tyres.  I don't think you can buy tube type radials anymore.

Michelin  still carry a lot of those tube type radials in their vintage tyres range 

madfrog

[alex d]

VW recommended tubes even with tubeless radials

back in the day (check the blue bentleys) VW didn't recommend running radials without tubes.....

Those would be tube type radial tyres.  I don't think you can buy tube type radials anymore.

[nigelg65]

Can't see the problem, just run tubes.

[Bruce]

What are you tube guys afraid of?  What problem do you think tubes solve?

Plenty of guys have run original Mahle wheels without tubes to prove there's no problem doing so. Same for early Fuchs.

The tube is just another part that can fail.  If it's not there, it can't fail.