Wedgemating and dowel pins

[Jon]

I separated my wedgemating for the first time yesterday, and that was a tight fit. Demello knows their stuff apparently. But I would like to get to grips with what's involved in redoing dowel pins for a super thight fit. How do you do it RIGHT on a stock crank, and how do you do it on a crank already done. I have read what Berg says about the issue and he sells a fine kit, but I think the step from stock (8mm) to 11/32" seems a bit big just to make "sure"?  Is vw's stock tolerances good enough for a 200hp engine combined with slicks and horns in the forehead??
Could I just have made dowelpins in a slightly lager size and have a reamer ground....  what do you think? 

[Ole]

...just couldn't resist... 



I'm not an engine builder, but IMHO it should work with the slightly larger pins, if you got the right tools. Sure you really need to redo the dowels?

Saludos,
Ole

[Jon]

No, I dont think so, they look fine, even if they are a bit short. With the wedge mating and all, this should stay on...
I will no matter what swap out the pins I have for some longe ones... I dont like the look of those I got...

What crank make is that??

[Ole]

Hey Jon,

No, I dont think so, they look fine, even if they are a bit short. With the wedge mating and all, this should stay on...

... never change a winning team!

What crank make is that??

As far as I know it's an early Scat. The later versions have 6 screws/dowels. Maybe sombody can chime in who knows for sure? It has 82mm lift and Porsche journals. It came with the Panther's engine.



Saludos,
Ole

[Jon]

Well this team has never done much winning 
But you have a point... the guys that did it knew what they were doing...

Have any one out there have anything to say against, or, for the usage of a split rear thrust bearing?
In conjunction with three shims it would save me from pulling apart the wedge again anytime soon... A wedge like this is said to deteriorate every time you pull it apart...

Thanks
Jon Hroar

[Berger]

Hi Jonny!

In my opinion the lenght of the pins is as important as the fit. You also have to remember, when the pins start moving, the steel around needs some place to go....on a stock crank the steel will expand (just look at my stroker crank from 2005), but on a wedgemate crank there is no room for the steel to expand.....
I have new 11/32 and 23/64 pins at home if You need 

Berger

[Roman]

Have any one out there have anything to say against, or, for the usage of a split rear thrust bearing?

Thanks
Jon Hroar

For the usage: It is a little tricky to get a non split bearing over a flange!   
Against: The three shims on an non flanged crank slow down the speed of the flywheel aganist the bearing. You can actually burn the bearing instantly if you try to start the enginge with the clutch pedal down and there is no oil pressure.

[Jon]

Hello Roman,
Who said anything about a flange? 

I thought about using a split bearing for my wedgemated crank/flywheel.. and install it with the shims and all. But I have later talked with our friend JPM and we came to the conclusion that I didn't really need one.

Best regards
Jon Hroar

[Frallan]

Could the crank be one of Classe Trimcos?
The best way to identify that is by the bolts attaching the flywheel. If they are countersunk, Trimco, if not, probably not his baby.

As for pins, my thinking is that you should be careful in adding to large pins.
Isn't the crank the limiting factor in material? So with to large pins you weaken the crank?
Anyway, with a good wedge, that is not a problem.
Frallan

[Jon]

Hi Frallan, and welcome!

The reason I worry is that when I separated the flywheel and the crank for pins stayed inn and four came out with the flywheel.
There was also some "carving" on one of the pins Suggesting that hole dot line perfectly up. I guess a reamer and new slightly oversized pins would be my fix if any.

However, I talked with Johannes Persson the other day about wedge mating, and of what importance it was. In his eyes the most important element to holding the flywheel on the crank was the friction between the flywheel and the crank (supplied by the large nut/washer)
The next most important thing was the snug fitting pin's... and the wedge sealed the deal...   he felt it didn't do to much of a job since it wasn't that big of a area. But it can be that little bit that puts you over the danger threshold. I have no trouble believing him, but at the same time I would like to hear what others do and think in this department.... 

[Jon]

A little bird told me that the guys from Finland had an own unique way of making a cheap-"flange" connection between the flywheel and the crank??

Could you guys tell us how it's done? Unless it's a secret?

[Jordy/DVK]

 Is this what they call "Achtfach verstiftet" in German??
 I read it in the specs of the cars on the DFL site, but I never knew what they meant with "achtfach verstiftet"...

[Ole]

Is this what they call "Achtfach verstiftet" in German??
I read it in the specs of the cars on the DFL site, but I never knew what they meant with "achtfach verstiftet"...

No, pic above is flanged. "achtfach verstiftet" means 8 dowels, 4 more than stock.

Achtfach verstiftet:



Saludos,
Ole

P.S. the DFL promises a relaunch of their website in english for YEARS now...

[Jordy/DVK]

P.S. the DFL promises a relaunch of their website in english for YEARS now...

  According to their site Dokke still has a 1485 engine...

[Georg/DFL]

P.S. the DFL promises a relaunch of their website in english for YEARS now...

Shut up, Ole!!!! 

We're working on it....sometimes....

[Ole]