Traction Bar Yes or No

[Paul Bahnstormerz]

Fitting the engine, the muffler is fouling the traction bar, the transmission is mounted with HD grey VW front mount, Berg intermediate mount, Berg Solid rear yoke and Bugpack torque bars. Is that enough to stop wheel hop? Engine is nitrous 1776.

Thanks


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[leec]

I know when Jim Smith did my cage (tied to frame horns) he still recommended I keep my berg traction bar, and I did.
Why have you gone solid rear mount but rubber front?
Lee

[Paul Bahnstormerz]

Used the solid yoke to tie the frame horns together nice and solid. I have a midmount with aluminium blocks

So if I have a removable rear balance, is the traction bar worth wrestling with?


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[leec]

My rear valance is removable, I'd say the inner wings are still strong enough

[kever65]

i had a csp cup bar, solid gear box mounts, no cage, and still wheel hop ( very bad), than i installed bunny ears on top of the gearbox, all wheel hop gone!
1776cc NA, 12.8 best et so far, all steel street car.

(can you please give some info on your setup ? )

kind regards,

Davy

[andy198712]

i had a csp cup bar, solid gear box mounts, no cage, and still wheel hop ( very bad), than i installed bunny ears on top of the gearbox, all wheel hop gone!
1776cc NA, 12.8 best et so far, all steel street car.

(can you please give some info on your setup ? )

kind regards,

Davy

Davy,
Any details on the bunny ears? I've seen a picture but wondered what thickness plate and was it ally? Also how did you attach it? Longer engine mount bolts?

Cheers
Andy

[NoBars]

I am of the opinion that the sheetmetal on each side of the engine doesn't provide enough support when getting into serious power and traction, especially if the apron has been made removable.

I don't run one, low 11s on motor. I'd rather keep the weight out of the car. I do have some struts that toe the roll bar down tubes/package tray to the rear trans mount.

[cedric]

No bar just cage to the frame in the back..no wheel hop...

[leec]

I can't say I have ran my car without one, and I am not saying the traction bar cures wheel hop as I believe shocks and tyre type/psi all contribute as well.

[kever65]

Hello,

i made a test piece out off 6mm steel, 40 mm wide, this can be mounted wit the original bolts on the engine, will make the same in alu though.

(info on your engine setup please

[Flakeyjake]

I had big problems with wheel hop, then i have built my own traction bar and after this, no problems longer, it was the best result for my car!

[andy198712]

Hello,

i made a test piece out off 6mm steel, 40 mm wide, this can be mounted wit the original bolts on the engine, will make the same in alu though.

(info on your engine setup please

Hi,
i can't see my engine bolts coming through to the engine bay side far enough to get a 6mm plate and a nut on there... only got a couple threads showing, am i missing something here?
i was first thinking ally plate, its cheap off eBay!
its a 2110 with 911 fan setup, GSXR throttle bodies and custom flywheel crank trigger setup run through megasquirt

[kever65]

thanks for the info on your motor, think i saw a topic about it.
maybe there are different sizes of bolts, but i was able to use it with the original ones, still some threads left, you can easy convert it to a longer one,. I made it in steel first because i can easy weld it by myself. Before i mounted them wheel hop was so bad a lost my rear windshield at the track !! (was in place for the last 10 years)
now all wheel hop is gone.

[andy198712]

thanks for the info on your motor, think i saw a topic about it.
maybe there are different sizes of bolts, but i was able to use it with the original ones, still some threads left, you can easy convert it to a longer one,. I made it in steel first because i can easy weld it by myself. Before i mounted them wheel hop was so bad a lost my rear windshield at the track !! (was in place for the last 10 years)
now all wheel hop is gone.

Thats some serious hop!!

[spanners]

https://www.flickr.com/gp/40412896@N00/x0cnw3
I've used a yoke for all generations of my race cars in different disciplines from off-road / Rallycross to today's circuit cars, the engine/trans interface is the stressed member that ties the horns to the stress plate, it needs nothing else, weight is next to nothing and takes no space.

[andy198712]

And is that standard bolts? I'll post a pic of mine tomorrow and show you

[Eddie DVK]

https://www.flickr.com/gp/40412896@N00/x0cnw3
I've used a yoke for all generations of my race cars in different disciplines from off-road / Rallycross to today's circuit cars, the engine/trans interface is the stressed member that ties the horns to the stress plate, it needs nothing else, weight is next to nothing and takes no space.

Very interesting and lightweight, do you have some better pictures?

Good informational stuff here guys, keep it coming.

[Iryanu]

https://www.flickr.com/gp/40412896@N00/x0cnw3
I've used a yoke for all generations of my race cars in different disciplines from off-road / Rallycross to today's circuit cars, the engine/trans interface is the stressed member that ties the horns to the stress plate, it needs nothing else, weight is next to nothing and takes no space.

Interesting method, ticks all the boxes if it works! 

[spanners]

Thanks guys, my very first set up way back was very mechano but did the job, I used a T3 suitcase motor back then which was heavy, as a teen I had no brass to waste on getting lightweight one off exhausts made, and nothing was made off the shelf then, I just welded scrap steel drops to the firewall and hung the motor with 3mm X 25mm off the top engine bolts, this set up came back in the '90s when I hid it behind the fan housing fir Beetle cup races where such mods were not allowed, it was never sussed even tho my cars launched better than most, the strength to brace to the horns is in the motor/trans interface, why do folk weld in huge complex tube systems? The hangers themselfs can be very light, crash once like an aircraft is my mantra, forget auto over engineering....  wasserboxers are heavier than T1 by about 25 kg with coolant, so I needed some more strength, I made a light square tube cross member with captives to fit over the bell, lightweight verticle steel drops strengthen and spread any cyclic load paths up into the firewall, the cross brace sits on the radius of the parcel shelf with suitable gussets and bracing on the underside etc, the longer upper engine bolts were just made from ht studding with captive nuts inboard, I run raised and inclined motors so the top of the motor flange needed cropping at the top, I did it this way because it's a cosher mod in the open series I'm in now.  I can't vouch for my method suiting a 500 hp full on turbo drag car launching, but most of these have their own engine support systems already developed and built into the roll cage, but it will work on anything evolving that is already axle tramping and needs a quick and simple upgrade.

[Neil Davies]

On my drag car, which was under 200bhp, I had a bar in the back of the cage welded between the inner wings, just inside the parcel tray. Two bolt in bars joined that to the gearbox cradle and stiffened the whole lot up. Never hopped at all. I ran a solid rear mount, a berg style rubber mid mount and a crappy urethane front mount, which didn't neet to do anything because of the other two. I should really have tied the ends of the torsion tubes into the cage too, because just before I sold the car I found it had started to stress fracture the inner wings where they joun the rear cross members under the back seat.