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Author Topic: Fueltech sharing  (Read 35606 times)
richie
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« Reply #30 on: October 01, 2019, 18:09:26 pm »

Go to file top left then to bottom of tab that options, to options and its in there Smiley
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Cars are supposed to be driven, not just talked about!!!   


Good parts might be expensive but good advice is priceless Wink
mikko k
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« Reply #31 on: October 01, 2019, 18:32:27 pm »

Thank You Richie!  Smiley
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Basti
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« Reply #32 on: October 02, 2019, 09:31:43 am »

Go to file top left then to bottom of tab that options, to options and its in there Smiley

Fueltech expert  Cool
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- black 62 cal look beetle
- Pro Mod Race car
richie
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« Reply #33 on: October 02, 2019, 10:58:00 am »

Go to file top left then to bottom of tab that options, to options and its in there Smiley

Fueltech expert  Cool


 Cheesy   Nope, not yet anyway Wink   
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Cars are supposed to be driven, not just talked about!!!   


Good parts might be expensive but good advice is priceless Wink
PPRMicke
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« Reply #34 on: October 02, 2019, 12:10:09 pm »

The easiest way is to update the FT ( uppdate 4,25)
When you have downloaded it you will get 3 choices about languages Select English
/// Micke
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mikko k
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« Reply #35 on: October 02, 2019, 19:50:06 pm »

Yes, thats right, but it was only for installing language. Not for program. It was my first download for FT.
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PPRMicke
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« Reply #36 on: October 03, 2019, 22:55:48 pm »

Yes, thats right, but it was only for installing language. Not for program. It was my first download for FT.
If you do not choose the correct language you will get it in Spanish or Portuguese software You cannot change the language
/// Micke
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mikko k
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« Reply #37 on: October 04, 2019, 08:37:43 am »

I did choose English and still it was Portuguese.

But what Richie said at above, the options is there.
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PPRMicke
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« Reply #38 on: October 04, 2019, 13:04:27 pm »

  Open file At the bottom you have options
Open it and you will find language and a little more value to be set
/// Micke
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johandryselius
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« Reply #39 on: September 03, 2020, 19:09:52 pm »

Hi all!

I have recently installed a GearController since I have a FT500 and it is not integrated. Have hooked it up to FT strain gauge shift knob and it works like a dream. A couple of settings to think about:
1. Sensitivity of the strain gauge i.e. how hard do you pull/push your knob when shifting - higher value if you are softer in shifting - I have mine at 1500 being kind of hard handed
2. Values to initiate the ignition cut i.e. together with the above - you want to have your values close to 0V and 5V when shifting (set sensitivity above) and then theses values I have set to 1V and 4V pulling/pushing respectively.
3. How long the ignition cut should be on each gear to securely get the next gear in. Set a value around 350 ms shift 1-2 and then a bit less on 2-3 and 3-4. Then test under full load and work your way backwards until you cannot get the next gear in - then move back a bit. In this way you will have the shortest amount of time of the ignition cut needed to shift.

After installing this I have of course zero clutch slip and do not lose any boost during shifting.

Johan
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1600cc Challenge Porsche 356:
9,4386@242,48km/h; 6,1229@193,15 km/h 1,50 60 foot @ Kjula Dragway 2022
1600cc Challenge Buggy:
9,5112@225,42 km/h; 6,0624@185,85 km/h 1,38 60 foot @ Kjula Dragway 2020
Europes quickest ProStock VW:
9,8538@218,80 km/h; 6,2569@176,24 km/h 1,35 60 foot @ BRC Tierp Arena 2014
Christiano
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« Reply #40 on: September 03, 2020, 19:53:02 pm »

Good to see you're doing good with your setup!

One extra hint with regard to ignition-cut times.

Too long and you'll wear your pro-shit/dog engagement b/c there'll be no load in the trans and the engagement will be loose.
The ignition cut happens ONLY to allow you to DISENGAGE the gear, not to engage the next one. The ENGAGEMENT is something that your trans should be able to perform without an ignition cut.

So, how do you figure out what is the perfect timing without trial/error?
Check the image I attached.

As soon as you move the shifter and start applying the ignition cut, the RPM will drop.
As you can see on the image, the RPM drops and there's a point that I circled where it tries to come up, but it's then brought down again by the ignition cut.
This is the point where the next gear is finally engaged, but the extra ignition cut time won't allow your engine to rev up again. So any extra ignition cut time you have beyond that, is just killing your ET.

Knowing that, the best approach to give you the almost perfect ignition cut time would be: Identify when the cut starts, measure how long it takes until you see the next gear engaged and the rpm trying to go up again, add ~10-20ms to this time to have a margin of error/safety and go for a testing run.

Hope it helps Smiley

Let me know if you guys have any other questions
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johandryselius
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« Reply #41 on: September 03, 2020, 20:31:36 pm »

Christiano!
This is such great information - I'll check my logs tomorrow! Thanks!!
Johan
Logged

1600cc Challenge Porsche 356:
9,4386@242,48km/h; 6,1229@193,15 km/h 1,50 60 foot @ Kjula Dragway 2022
1600cc Challenge Buggy:
9,5112@225,42 km/h; 6,0624@185,85 km/h 1,38 60 foot @ Kjula Dragway 2020
Europes quickest ProStock VW:
9,8538@218,80 km/h; 6,2569@176,24 km/h 1,35 60 foot @ BRC Tierp Arena 2014
Christiano
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Posts: 57


« Reply #42 on: September 21, 2020, 17:03:03 pm »

Glad to help!
Let me know if you found any room for improvements after checking your logs.


Also, let's try use this "pandemic-forced-break" to improve the cars and clear up any doubts you guys may have.
Send your questions and I'll do my best to reply them as soon as possible.

Doesn't matter if they're specific to Fueltech features or if it's some help to analyse some of your logs and improve your tuning. Just post them.
The more channels you have been logged, the better it is to identify what can be improved.

Glad to help you guys to improve your program.

Thanks
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Frallan
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« Reply #43 on: September 22, 2020, 07:34:16 am »

Wow Christiano!  You are really a nice and supportive guy! 
Well, it is obvious that you helped Johan Dryselius....and some of it paid off this last weekend!

Thanks!
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Christiano
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« Reply #44 on: September 22, 2020, 12:18:41 pm »

Oh really?
Good to hear! Any video/info about it?
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Frallan
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« Reply #45 on: September 22, 2020, 13:31:21 pm »

https://www.facebook.com/johan.dryselius/videos/10158604660003934

Even more insane - 6,06@186km/t - 9,51@225km/t. 1584cc, unported heads, 35,5x32 valves, 36 PSI! 😎

An incredible achievement!  FT500 and that special knobshiftercontraptionhocuspocus..... :-)
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Christiano
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« Reply #46 on: September 22, 2020, 13:40:27 pm »

Nice!

Let's wait for him to confirm whether anything here on this topic helped on going faster!

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Frallan
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« Reply #47 on: September 22, 2020, 13:53:41 pm »

Nice!

Let's wait for him to confirm whether anything here on this topic helped on going faster!


That is a very professional and appreciated attitude.
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PPRMicke
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« Reply #48 on: September 22, 2020, 14:33:30 pm »

https://www.facebook.com/johan.dryselius/videos/10158604660003934

Even more insane - 6,06@186km/t - 9,51@225km/t. 1584cc, unported heads, 35,5x32 valves, 36 PSI! 😎

An incredible achievement!  FT500 and that special knobshiftercontraptionhocuspocus..... :-)

or on instagram
on pprmicke
who is also a fueltech (ft600) user
/// Micke
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Christiano
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« Reply #49 on: September 22, 2020, 15:50:49 pm »

Thanks!

Just started following you on instagram.

There are a few other tricks with the GearController, for both the integrated or standalone versions, to help you not to kill the engine that much when shifting and keep the boost line almost flat.
I'll talk about it later  Grin
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PPRMicke
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« Reply #50 on: September 22, 2020, 19:26:13 pm »

Thanks!

Just started following you on instagram.

There are a few other tricks with the GearController, for both the integrated or standalone versions, to help you not to kill the engine that much when shifting and keep the boost line almost flat.
I'll talk about it later  Grin


Super Nice
 /// Micke
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Christiano
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Posts: 57


« Reply #51 on: September 23, 2020, 00:00:51 am »

Hey all,

So, back to the ignition cut when flat-shifting.

How about a boostline like the below one.

[ Attachment: You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Good uh?
Notice it's almost flat as I mentioned on a previous post and this isn't only b/c of the ignition cut time.
It's also about the TIMING AND CUT PERCENTAGE you apply.

You want to get out with the least amount of cut % and with an ignition timing reduction that keeps your engine happy, so that you won't have your boost dropping too much when shifting.
How do you achieve that?

For users with gear controller integrated to the Fueltech (FT600 and newer)

All you have to do is to configure how much ignition cut and ignition timing reduction you want to apply.
For that you just need go to the "Powershift (gear change ignition cut)" and play with the values.
Notice that for the log I sent above, I have a really low ignition cut % and timing.
The engine/trans combo allowed me to run this low of ignition cut and timing and the result is that almost-flat boost line.

[ Attachment: You are not allowed to view attachments ]

For users with the external GearController module, it's a bit tricky b/c you can't configure things so easily like on the newer FT modules.

The standalone GearController, when you shift gears, will actually send a 2-step signal to the FT box (remember you had to wire the 2step wire to the module?).
Yep. That's exactly what you're thinking. The standalone GearController will actually activate the 2step to promote the ignition cut/timing retard.
Now that we know it, we have to play with the 2step configuration to make it work similarly to the newer FT modules.
How do we access the 2step advanced configs?

Go to the "Advanced Map Options" and switch "RPM settings" to "Custom"
[ Attachment: You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Now go back to the 2step config menu and you'll see the following options enabled
[ Attachment: You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Remember the post that I made some time ago about the "Advanced 2step strategy" where you can apply a ridiculous low ignition timing on your 2step?
Now it'll come handy Smiley

Since this is a 2step signal hitting the Fueltech module from the external GearController, you can try reducing the ignition cut on 2step value and use a ridiculous low timing on the "high resolution ignition retard".
So when trying to build boost of the line, you'll try apply a low ignition cut % and have the timing retard locking the launch RPM where it should be AND when the GearController sends the 2step signal during the shifting, this same strategy will be applied, so you'll also have a low ignition timing/cut when shifting.

There's a catch and this is regardless this strategy I'm talking about: When you use the external GearController, you have to make sure that your RPM when shifting won't drop BELOW your (2step RPM target)-(StartCompensation X RPM before).
If you get your RPM BELOW this value the igntion cut/retard won't happen b/c, as I said before, the external GearController is actually sending a 2step signal to the FT module.
I've seen people breaking transmissions b/c of that and when they didn't break the trans, they'd wear out the pro-rings. And this usually happens when doing the 1-2 shifting, which is where the RPM drops the most.

Hope it helps someone to improve their program
« Last Edit: September 23, 2020, 00:05:07 am by Christiano » Logged
Basti
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« Reply #52 on: September 25, 2020, 07:04:08 am »

Nice one Christiano Wink
I guess not many can follow Wink

Cheers,
Basti
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- black 62 cal look beetle
- Pro Mod Race car
johandryselius
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« Reply #53 on: September 25, 2020, 10:17:22 am »

Christiano!

Thanks for sharing - I had all the facts from a friend in Brazil and applied it and also I was aware of the standalone (as I have) GearController using the 2 - step cut and the need staying above the 2 - step RPM. What I didn't know was 'Go to the "Advanced Map Options" and switch "RPM settings" to "Custom"' - I'll sure check in on this.
Thanks again!
Johan
Logged

1600cc Challenge Porsche 356:
9,4386@242,48km/h; 6,1229@193,15 km/h 1,50 60 foot @ Kjula Dragway 2022
1600cc Challenge Buggy:
9,5112@225,42 km/h; 6,0624@185,85 km/h 1,38 60 foot @ Kjula Dragway 2020
Europes quickest ProStock VW:
9,8538@218,80 km/h; 6,2569@176,24 km/h 1,35 60 foot @ BRC Tierp Arena 2014
Christiano
Jr. Member
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Posts: 57


« Reply #54 on: September 25, 2020, 16:47:49 pm »

No problem.

Even here in Brazil 99% of the people running the standalone gear controller don't know that they can do it b/c this isn't something you find in the instructions an even when it's in the instructions people over here don't pay much attention to it.
Plus, the custom RPM description says "not recommended", which makes most people to stay way from using it Smiley

You just need to stop a bit and think about the big picture, how things work and are tied together and then you'll find a different way of doing things  Smiley

Thanks
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johandryselius
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« Reply #55 on: September 25, 2020, 22:39:07 pm »

Christiano!

Before the last race I added a high resolution ignition retard to the 2 step: -35. Now that I have added the "Advanced", what does the "Maximum Levels" & "Above limiter RPM.." mean?

Johan
Logged

1600cc Challenge Porsche 356:
9,4386@242,48km/h; 6,1229@193,15 km/h 1,50 60 foot @ Kjula Dragway 2022
1600cc Challenge Buggy:
9,5112@225,42 km/h; 6,0624@185,85 km/h 1,38 60 foot @ Kjula Dragway 2020
Europes quickest ProStock VW:
9,8538@218,80 km/h; 6,2569@176,24 km/h 1,35 60 foot @ BRC Tierp Arena 2014
Steve D.
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« Reply #56 on: September 26, 2020, 02:44:33 am »

Hi Christiano,

I'm assuming all this information isn't really meant for synchros?
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Über Alles

5 tracks, 5 days, 1000+ miles.
10.77 avg. on pump fuel.
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Christiano
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« Reply #57 on: September 26, 2020, 13:50:09 pm »

Hi Christiano,

I'm assuming all this information isn't really meant for synchros?

That's correct. This won't work with synchro trans.

Christiano!

Before the last race I added a high resolution ignition retard to the 2 step: -35. Now that I have added the "Advanced", what does the "Maximum Levels" & "Above limiter RPM.." mean?

Johan


"Maximum level" is the % of ignition cut or timing retard (depends on the menu you're changing that will happen).
So if you have 90% as the maximum level for the ignition cut, 90% of the ignition events will be dropped in order to promote the ignition cut.

"Above limiter RPM" is like a progression threshold you allow for that event to happen.
So, let's say you have your 2step RPM set to 6000rpm and an "above limiter"  set to 150rpm.
Once you hit the 6krpm mark, the ignition cut/retard will be proportionally applied until you hit 6150rpm, where the maximum cut/retard that you configured will be applied.

So, as I mentioned on that post that I made (last year I guess?), what we want to have is the high resolution retard applying enough retard so we don't have to use that much of the ignition cut, so we keep the engine "awake and ready to go" like we use to say over here.

For those of you that were using the 2step without the high resolution retard and now migrated to the high resolution retard, if you compare both logs, especially the "Ignition Cut - 2step"  channel, you'll see how your engine became less dependent on ignition cuts during the 2step.

If you want me to take a look into one of your logs, just PM me and I'll give you my email.

Thanks
« Last Edit: September 26, 2020, 13:52:17 pm by Christiano » Logged
johandryselius
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« Reply #58 on: September 26, 2020, 14:18:45 pm »

Christiano!

Thanks so much for the clarification! Now I have the pieces I need. Will do some minor changes for next year. The car is now going into "winter service and updates".

You still racing over there - maybe you can race all year?

Johan
Logged

1600cc Challenge Porsche 356:
9,4386@242,48km/h; 6,1229@193,15 km/h 1,50 60 foot @ Kjula Dragway 2022
1600cc Challenge Buggy:
9,5112@225,42 km/h; 6,0624@185,85 km/h 1,38 60 foot @ Kjula Dragway 2020
Europes quickest ProStock VW:
9,8538@218,80 km/h; 6,2569@176,24 km/h 1,35 60 foot @ BRC Tierp Arena 2014
Christiano
Jr. Member
**
Posts: 57


« Reply #59 on: September 26, 2020, 14:29:21 pm »

We're not having actual races b/c of the pandemic, only private testing sessions.
But yeah. It's basically all year racing. We just have a break on the last 2 weeks of December and beginning of Jan.

I'm not racing, just working on some cars.
Hopefully next year I'll have to handle the problem of racing my car again and still work on other cars Smiley
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