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Author Topic: Clutch slip  (Read 1135 times)
GARRICK.CLARK
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« on: February 24, 2018, 16:59:22 PM »

Hi Guys.
I'm experiencing clutch slip.
Pressure plate is a kennedy stage 2
Disc is a Daikin .
Motor is turbo
It doesnt slip till 3rd gear on a straight. And only when at full operating temp.
Is this heat related. like does the disc material FADE like brake shoes do.
Thanks.
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Erlend / bug66
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« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2018, 18:22:01 PM »

Switch to a stage 3 or a better disc
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GARRICK.CLARK
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« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2018, 00:15:23 AM »

Hi Erland. What would be a good disc to try.
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Erlend / bug66
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« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2018, 00:19:22 AM »

Depending on use..

I run a RLR Black Magic. And Stage 4..
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10.407 @ 134mph, SCC 2017
PPRMicke
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« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2018, 11:26:34 AM »

Here in Sweden, use (95%) Stage 1 and blackmagic 
If you use stage 4 with blackmagic, the gearbox will go into pieces   Angry
I would start with pressure on the pressure plate  at 200mn  ( 147 lb)
/// Micke
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Erlend / bug66
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« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2018, 11:49:32 AM »

Here in Sweden, use (95%) Stage 1 and blackmagic 
If you use stage 4 with blackmagic, the gearbox will go into pieces   Angry
I would start with pressure on the pressure plate  at 200mn  ( 147 lb)
/// Micke

Well the gearbox did split in half.. but stage 3 and BM did slip in a dynapack..
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10.626 @ 132mph, SCC 2016
10.407 @ 134mph, SCC 2017
GARRICK.CLARK
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« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2018, 12:24:45 PM »

OK. I'm going to weld a socket on my spare in put shaft and get a foot pound figure of when the disc slips. I'm sure it's gunna be a false reading as I think heat is playing a part as well. A little info.
It's 21 psi boost on through a type 4 and the torque hits the clutch pretty fast and hard.
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Neil Davies
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« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2018, 12:36:05 PM »

Do the clutch pressure plate and flywheel need resurfacing?
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GARRICK.CLARK
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« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2018, 16:32:04 PM »

Oreet  Neil. The fly and the P.P are new items with low low miles.
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mikko k
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« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2018, 18:37:42 PM »

At this page you can see how much torque different stage Kennedy pressure plates can handle, with stock disc.

http://www.racereadyproducts.com/transmission-components/clutch-pressure-plates/

Stage 1 = 180 ft.lbs = 244Nm
Stage 2 = 220             298Nm
          3 = 260             352Nm
          4 = 300             406Nm

Metallic disc can add 25% more torque. I donít know about Black Magic.

If somebody tells you that a lot of people use stage1, it only means that they have less hp and torq...

At my race engine (N/A 2,85L type 1), I had 300Nm and Stage 1 + BM disc, the clutch start to slip.. Now I have Stage 3 for next summer. I hope it helps me.
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GARRICK.CLARK
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« Reply #10 on: February 26, 2018, 20:41:58 PM »

Ok thanks Mikko, I'm gunna check the plate face 1st , see if the disc has made a nice even pattern on the surface of the P Plate, and the fly wheel face.
I'll be back.
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spoolin70
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« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2018, 21:12:17 PM »

Hi Garrick

My old turbo motor made just over 300hp and I only ever used a stage 3 Kennedy pressure plate.

I can't remember exactly what disc I used but it wasn't anything fancy - organic something I think.

It never once slipped, even with R888's on the rear. Personally I didn't find it too heavy either.

Hope that helps
Darren
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GARRICK.CLARK
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« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2018, 21:35:46 PM »

Thanks Darren the stage 3 might be the next step then. Unless this stage 2 plate face shows a bad contact patch.
The RB racing engine calculator recons I'm getting around 300 hp with 21 psi going through it.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 15:59:35 PM by GARRICK.CLARK » Logged
Erlend / bug66
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« Reply #13 on: February 26, 2018, 21:41:11 PM »

Stage 4 and Black Magic. 552nm/407 ft lbs to the tires.
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hotstreetvw
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« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2018, 03:26:02 AM »

I ran a stage 2 and black magic.  Lesson learned.  I couldn't preload without jumping through the beams.  Got to eliminations, I didn't preload for fear of the red light, smoked the ring and pinion and case.  There is a reason why RLR suggest at most a stage one with BM.
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Fiatdude
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« Reply #15 on: February 27, 2018, 04:33:42 AM »

I'm running a stage two with a 5 puck on my 2332 turbo, but at only 7 pounds boost with no slippage....

When I was running my 2990 turbo, it was with a stage one PP but with the Kennedy dual disc setup....

If you're really wanting to eliminate any possibility of slip I highly recommend the dual disc setup. Also one of the benefits of running the DD's you get away with a stage 1 PP and that is a lot easier on the thrust bearings in your engine while your riding the clutch
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BeetleBug
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« Reply #16 on: February 27, 2018, 09:24:56 AM »

Stage 4 and Black Magic here for years with a heavy streetcar, turbo, T1 gearbox and low 60ft. I used clutch management to achieve some slip and that is the key to keep you transmission alive.

-BB-
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GARRICK.CLARK
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Posts: 265


« Reply #17 on: March 27, 2018, 19:07:27 PM »

Guys, wanna guess what the brake away torque is on my kenny stage 2 cover and daikin disc, with no shims
is gunna be.
I'll be getting a foot pound number at the week end.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2018, 19:20:10 PM by GARRICK.CLARK » Logged
GARRICK.CLARK
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Posts: 265


« Reply #18 on: April 05, 2018, 06:37:23 AM »

Sanded the cover with some 600's wet and dry using a flat rubbing block. This has brought out the area of the cover that has the been slipping. Its from the outer edge going in a 1/3rd or the shoes surface.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2018, 17:46:43 PM by GARRICK.CLARK » Logged
GARRICK.CLARK
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Posts: 265


« Reply #19 on: April 09, 2018, 18:12:44 PM »

I tried the break away torque today.
My torque bar only goes to 100 ft pound.
So the bar clicked at a 100 no slip.
I put a bar on the end of the torque wrench and couldn't get that disc to budge at all.
Guess its definitely a heated up disc issue.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 19:24:51 PM by GARRICK.CLARK » Logged
Stev
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« Reply #20 on: April 17, 2018, 19:35:58 PM »

Does anybody of you guys know the release force of the Kennedy Clutchs? Not sure if "release force" is the wright describtion.  I talk about the force you need to open the clutch? :-)
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Looking for a flanged crankshaft, all type 4 main bearings and a flywheel for KEP clutch. Stroke 84 till 88. The bigger the better ;-)
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