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History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
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Topic: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went.... (Read 64327 times)
Matt H
Full Member
Posts: 158
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #30 on:
June 25, 2009, 05:36:26 am »
Lonnie Reed Square ports anyone
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stealth67vw
Hero Member
Posts: 2261
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #31 on:
June 25, 2009, 05:54:46 am »
Quote from: 1970 on June 24, 2009, 20:36:18 pm
I actually traded Big Frank my Super Flows with longer valves, etc for a set of those black Street Eliminator "SCS" heads from the 1980's... still wonder what ever happened to those "black heads". They actually didn't run that hard.
Didn't Jason Popper end up with those?
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John Bates
JB Machining Services
1967 street bug 2020lbs w/driver
12.34 @ 108 mph 1/4
7.76 @ 89mph 1/8
Jim Ratto
Hero Member
Posts: 7121
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #32 on:
June 25, 2009, 17:06:51 pm »
Quote from: stealth67vw on June 25, 2009, 05:54:46 am
Quote from: 1970 on June 24, 2009, 20:36:18 pm
I actually traded Big Frank my Super Flows with longer valves, etc for a set of those black Street Eliminator "SCS" heads from the 1980's... still wonder what ever happened to those "black heads". They actually didn't run that hard.
Didn't Jason Popper end up with those?
my Super Flows yeah, not the black SE heads. I think they went on that 2276 that was built @ BH with Engle 110 and 40IDFs and made a scorching 107hp
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marc1951
Sr. Member
Posts: 282
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #33 on:
July 03, 2009, 02:49:17 am »
Quote from: Sarge on November 01, 2007, 00:32:40 am
The Underdog ran square-port heads back in the day that were done by Ron Fleming. Then, there were the angle-port heads that Darrell Vittone and Fumio came up with...the angle was at the exhaust port and was a 45 degree bend rather then a 90 degree as in a normal head (wish I had a picture...I tried calling Vittone, but he said they only had this set up for a very short period and had no photos). The next step was welding and I'd like to think it was DV and Fumio who came up with this but I'm not too sure. When I built my sandrail in 1974, Darrell introduced me to Fumio and I ordered two new Type III bare heads through the parts dept at the dealership where I was working at the time. I gave these to Fumio and he did his magic...welded, large intake ports and 40X35.5 valves. These went on a 78.4X92 engine with an Engle 125 and made 155hp @5500 rpm on DV's dyno. I wish to this day I'd never let the car go with those heads. The best part was being charged $275.00 for the weld/port job(a fortune back then
). Those were the days...
The way I understand it, Berg read an article in Hot Rod magazine about square port heads on a Pontiac (I think) and thought it might work on VWs as well. Ron Fleming worked for Berg back then so for a while there, the hot setup was the square port head. I remember that when we were thrashing on the Underdog at the races, we covered the heads so no one could see the ports. I believe later it was discovered it was one corner of the square that was doing all the magic so the port shape of choice became a tear drop shape.
Sarge, you got one hell of a deal as about the same time I sent Fumio a set of bare heads with larger valve seats, valves, springs and welded by Auto Craft. After a couple of months, the heads were shipped back COD, all assembled and a beautiful porting job..........$850 labor!!! I had about $1300 invested in those heads total and as you said, a hell of lot of money back in the 70s.
Marc Buehler
51 split
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The legendary DRA car club
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rick m
Hero Member
Posts: 1296
Driving Hot VWs for 44 Years Strong!
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #34 on:
July 31, 2009, 08:29:58 am »
Since this post was first made I had to go back through all my early 70's pictures and find a shot I took of Vittone's Race Shop 67 Modified Compact heads. This was taken at a division 7 points race at Sacramento Drag Strip. Dave Andrews had his blue 67 there and if I remember right Darrell had a white 67. This was the first time I had seen the angled ports (sometime around 73'-74' if I remember right. Dave Vanderbeke, the Schley's and many others were there too. It was a great weekend.
Rick Mortensen
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Rick Mortensen
Driving Hot VWs since 1970
Fastbrit
Hero Member
Posts: 4731
Keep smiling...
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #35 on:
July 31, 2009, 08:59:06 am »
Quote from: rocket ron on June 24, 2009, 20:59:20 pm
what about the scat split port heads, one head per cylinder
seemed to make good power, one of the early 90's brit racers had them on his car but cant remember which one
John Brewster at Autocavan. Terrible heads. Seized valve guides was a problem due to lack of oiling. Needed an externally-fed spray bar to direct oil onto valve springs/stems to stop them seizing in the head.
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Der Kleiner Panzers VW Club
12.56sec street-driven Cal Looker in 1995
9.87sec No Mercy race car in 1994
Seems like a lifetime ago...
Sarge
Hero Member
Posts: 4345
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #36 on:
July 31, 2009, 12:33:29 pm »
Gotta' love that cheese ball glass fuel filter in close proximity to a hot exhaust pipe in Rick's picture. See guys, small fuel line; fast race car
!
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DKP III
.
Hero Member
Posts: 1768
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #37 on:
July 31, 2009, 14:47:02 pm »
http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php/topic,9724.0.html
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rick m
Hero Member
Posts: 1296
Driving Hot VWs for 44 Years Strong!
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #38 on:
August 01, 2009, 07:55:55 am »
Good point Keith. Think about how much of the exhaust guide or boss would be exposed to the exhaust port on the heads. Superflows casted this type port. Dean Lowry really liked them but then again they put a lot more meat around the area and I believe the port had a little less angle. They were interesting but you did not see to many of them. Probably for the very reasons you stated.
I liked the ingenuity of the early guys. Still, Fumio's heads always seemed to work no matter who ran them and they were not as radical as some would think. Dean Lowry did the heads that were on my teal green 67 and the ports were not huge. They were welded ported heads but I was impressed at the flow numbers Dean pulled out of them for me. I wanted all the air speed to work for me with no more than .520 lift at the valve for my street engine. If you listen to my burnout on Ocean Street Video, I had my 2110cc motor at 7,000 rpms and it was buzzing along nicely.
I am impresed at what the CNC CB heads do out of the box. You'd pay $1,200 to $1,400 25 years ago for what you can buy in a set of wedgeports today for less. The hobby has progressed nicely with more choices and parts available than in the early years.
Rick M
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Rick Mortensen
Driving Hot VWs since 1970
Jim Ratto
Hero Member
Posts: 7121
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #39 on:
August 02, 2009, 18:11:28 pm »
the sideways D port "wedgeports" a la Lonnie Reed, but done on my 040 heads by Jeff Denham (for SCAT) were probably the best street head I have ever driven. Combined with 9.3:1 and an 86C, it was almost too much power. No camminess, just explosive, neck-wrenching power no matter what rpm or gear. My old 2276 was
the
motor I loved most. You could hear the snap and the viciousness in the bite of the exhaust note. With big heavy tires, anchor Jap BRMs, full interior, full tank of 92 octane, spare tire, etc, that motor went 12.91, 12.74 and 12.66, all with 40mm vents.
They get my vote.
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marc1951
Sr. Member
Posts: 282
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #40 on:
August 03, 2009, 04:21:15 am »
I was in my storage room looking for something, saw this and thought some people might be interested.
This manifold is off of the Under Dog.
Square port heads were the secret weapon at one time.
Marc Buehler
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The legendary DRA car club
(Der Rennmeister Association)
1946vw
Full Member
Posts: 105
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #41 on:
August 03, 2009, 07:21:15 am »
Gene Berg spead ports 1976 and old angle exhaust
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marc1951
Sr. Member
Posts: 282
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #42 on:
August 04, 2009, 04:07:07 am »
"Gene Berg spead ports 1976 and old angle exhaust"
Now.... that's cool!
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The legendary DRA car club
(Der Rennmeister Association)
1946vw
Full Member
Posts: 105
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #43 on:
August 04, 2009, 06:10:27 am »
More old parts and one new one (are there empi 88 in the boxes)
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Lee.C
Hero Member
Posts: 6458
I might be an Idiot but I'm not an Arsehole!
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #44 on:
August 04, 2009, 13:18:26 pm »
Thats some seriously coool stuff
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You either "Get It" or you don't......
streetvw
Hero Member
Posts: 554
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #45 on:
August 04, 2009, 15:10:03 pm »
Quote from: 1946vw on August 04, 2009, 06:10:27 am
More old parts and one new one (are there empi 88 in the boxes)
opps can someone pass a tissue!!!!
they are too cool :
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Jim Ratto
Hero Member
Posts: 7121
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #46 on:
May 02, 2010, 02:18:29 am »
saw some awfully cool stuff today, circa 1970-72, makes you wonder if we've come
that
far....
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HW
Newbie
Posts: 3
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #47 on:
October 22, 2016, 02:03:20 am »
I enjoyed reading all the impute everyone had on the “History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....’. A real step back in time. Thank You
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karl h
Hero Member
Posts: 931
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #48 on:
October 22, 2016, 08:22:01 am »
http://www.salzburgkaefer.at/rallye/technik/index.html
german, but pics of the motor, it was a 1600cc with stock exhaust internally modified and 46 IDAs, 125 DIN hp on a non c/w crank and 9:1
denzel in Vienna also made square port heads
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61 panel
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=465022
68 ghia vert
63 sunroof
http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php/topic,27456.0.html
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04 new beetle vert
Rome
Newbie
Posts: 16
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #49 on:
October 22, 2016, 18:39:07 pm »
Some more details in the article which Karl H mentions above:
The Porsche Salzburg type 1 rally engines first started with 1584cc displacement; later 1599cc and achieved up to 125hp. Engine case only received some modifications for a dry sump oiling system. The heads were flycut 1mm (0.040") and reshaped into a semi-hemi combustion chamber which provided 9:1 compression ratio. 40mm intake valve, stock 32mm exhaust. Special D-shaped intake ports to match the intake shapes from the Sauer & Sohn manifolds. Stock fuel pump. Carbs were initially Solex P40II from a Porsche 912; later came Weber 46 IDA from a Porsche 904 which were modified for this engine specifically in Maranello. The muffler was a stock unit but gutted internally, along with stock but gutted pea shooters. A stock camshaft was reground to a "secret grind", made by Porsche Salzburg's engine wizard Paul Schwarz and his son on their home basement camshaft grinding machine. The flywheel was lightened 2 Kg (4.4 lbs) and balanced along with the crankshaft. The pistons were based on stock production units.
The article provides some details on the dry sump oiling system, and suspension modifications.
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Bryan67
Hero Member
Posts: 1133
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #50 on:
October 22, 2016, 22:09:31 pm »
Years ago I bought a $100 set of IDA`s at work too. But my boss got pissed and made me sell them to him. Only because I was on his time. He never used them. After looking at the old show pictures I can see that I need to get mine out. I was at the same shows.
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If you`re going to do something, do it right.
Fiatdude
Hero Member
Posts: 1823
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #51 on:
October 23, 2016, 00:05:13 am »
On my car right now -- -- a glutton for punishment
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Bruce
Hero Member
Posts: 1420
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #52 on:
October 23, 2016, 20:35:12 pm »
Quote from: Rome on October 22, 2016, 18:39:07 pm
The heads were flycut 1mm (0.040") and reshaped into a semi-hemi combustion chamber which provided 9:1 compression ratio.
Something doesn't add up here.
If you take a stock DP head for a 1600cc engine at 7.5:1 CR and ruin it with a hemi cut, you'll be down around 6:1 CR (or lower). A 1mm flycut isn't going to get you up to 9:1.
I wonder what they really did?
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modnrod
Hero Member
Posts: 795
Old School Volksies
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #53 on:
October 23, 2016, 21:29:53 pm »
Quote from: Bruce on October 23, 2016, 20:35:12 pm
Quote from: Rome on October 22, 2016, 18:39:07 pm
The heads were flycut 1mm (0.040") and reshaped into a semi-hemi combustion chamber which provided 9:1 compression ratio.
Something doesn't add up here..........
Stock chamber 43cc, +9cc for the head step, +9cc for the piston height = 7.5:1 comp.
Stock chamber, flycut away the step and a further .040" = 36cc, add 8cc or so for a shallow hemi-cut as the pics seem to show then new chamber = 44cc.
Piston deck height at .040" gives 6cc, so new comp is now set at around 9:1.
I've just gone through all the figures on my 1584 I'm putting together, so it's still fresh in my mind.
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andrewlandon67
Hero Member
Posts: 517
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #54 on:
July 27, 2017, 04:43:32 am »
Man this is a good thread... definitely makes me feel spoiled for choice with any variation of CNC wedgeports available for pretty much whatever you've got to spend. Currently running a set of the EMPI GTV-2 Stage 1 Wedgeports (40x35.5, 170 CFM) with some light polishing in the ports, 44 HPMXs, 8.75:1 plus an FK-8 on a 1914. Hasn't been down the track since tuning, but we're hoping for 14s at 6000 feet. I'm having a hard time imagining the time and effort the old guys really put into their heads, back before computerized CNC mills and flow benches, but it really gives one an appreciation for their efforts.
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14.877 @ 88.85 mph
My car is what it is, maybe not Cal Look per the books, but it's more than most.
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Ron Greiner
Jr. Member
Posts: 61
DKP II
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #55 on:
July 27, 2017, 23:22:13 pm »
my 2084 cc motor I built in 1976 for my 68 sedan had welded 40 x 35.5 heads that John Crawford had done for me,( Rogers older brother ) it ran 13:30's in the 1/4
with a 125 Engle cam and 48 IDA's
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deano
Hero Member
Posts: 1851
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #56 on:
July 28, 2017, 05:32:53 am »
I now own these Fumio heads....
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Hot VWs Magazine Window Washer
Anglia Obsolete Guru
'67 Heaven
Neil Davies
Hero Member
Posts: 3438
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #57 on:
July 28, 2017, 09:14:47 am »
Dean, those are a bit cool! Is there any history behind them, and what car they may have been used in? And just as importantly, can you show some closer pictures of the ports please? Ive always wondered about the angle of the exhaust manifolds!
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2007cc, 48IDFs, street car. 14.45@93 on pump fuel, treads, muffler and fanbelt. October 2017!
deano
Hero Member
Posts: 1851
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #58 on:
July 29, 2017, 01:21:00 am »
Quote from: Neil Davies on July 28, 2017, 09:14:47 am
Dean, those are a bit cool! Is there any history behind them, and what car they may have been used in? And just as importantly, can you show some closer pictures of the ports please? Ive always wondered about the angle of the exhaust manifolds!
Those Fumio heads came from Darrell Vittone back around 1973. They were purchased by Doug Marcum of OK, and run for a few years with a best time of 11.40. They were later sold to Butch Thomas (OK) who ran them for a few years, but replaced them with Deano's about 1976. They have been sitting in a box ever since. I got them with matching Empi manifolds, a prized Chas Morse hand-made merged exhaust system. Heads still have 42 x36 valves and spring from Fumio and measure 29cc in the chambers. Those headers slip right into the exhaust ports and slide up to a machined/welded step. Two 8mm studs were welded to the outside, which actually holds the pipe(s) in place.
«
Last Edit: July 29, 2017, 01:27:11 am by deano
»
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Hot VWs Magazine Window Washer
Anglia Obsolete Guru
'67 Heaven
Joel Mohr
Full Member
Posts: 184
Re: History of the ported VW head? Styles that have come and went....
«
Reply #59 on:
July 29, 2017, 01:35:09 am »
I think most people have forgotten that Clyde has been doing all of the port work at Bergs since the mid 70s....he told me he was only 14 when he started...HE has some great head stories...
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