Then or Now?

[Jim Ratto]

Would you rather be in the present Cal Look scene or some era from the past? If you were around in the heydays, then you're a better candidate to answer this. Remember the cost of parts is all relative to your income... then, now.... nonexistent, whatever.
So weigh the pros and cons.... things like CNC heads, MSD distributors, internet ease of ordering, versus being able to get good genuine VW stuff @ dealer, Berg stuff, DDS and (even EMPI if you go back far enough)... high octane fuel, less traffic, looser laws, etc...

Which is better?

[Shubee2 (DSK)]

Then!!!!! The Old Days For Sure being able to get good genuine VW stuff @ dealer, Berg stuff, DDS and (even EMPI if you go back far enough)... high octane fuel, less traffic, Nothing Beats A Good Ole New Or Used German VW Part not all the China Crap of Today Plus The Cars Were Real Cal Looks Not A Resto Cal Of Today if its got Chrome  mise well Put All The Crap on it Roof Rack Mud Flaps ECT. Super Slammed??? 

[Jim Ratto]

Then!!!!! The Old Days For Sure being able to get good genuine VW stuff @ dealer, Berg stuff, DDS and (even EMPI if you go back far enough)... high octane fuel, less traffic, Nothing Beats A Good Ole New Or Used German VW Part not all the China Crap of Today Plus The Cars Were Real Cal Looks Not A Resto Cal Of Today if its got Chrome  mise well Put All The Crap on it Roof Rack Mud Flaps ECT. Super Slammed??? 

I knew you'd reply. 

can you run muflaps with a sidewinder header?

[Shubee2 (DSK)]

Then!!!!! The Old Days For Sure being able to get good genuine VW stuff @ dealer, Berg stuff, DDS and (even EMPI if you go back far enough)... high octane fuel, less traffic, Nothing Beats A Good Ole New Or Used German VW Part not all the China Crap of Today Plus The Cars Were Real Cal Looks Not A Resto Cal Of Today if its got Chrome  mise well Put All The Crap on it Roof Rack Mud Flaps ECT. Super Slammed??? 

I knew you'd reply. 

can you run muflaps with a sidewinder header?

Yes you can

[Jim Ratto]

I forgot 4" bores.

Did they have those in the good old days, Shubee?

[Shubee2 (DSK)]

I forgot 4" bores.

Did they have those in the good old days, Shubee?

Did Not Need Them The Old Guys knew how to Make Horse Power without the Big CC's

[Jim Ratto]

fricken relax

[Rennsurfer]

HAHAHA!!!

Okay, now... back to the original question. That's a tough call, Jim. But I'd have to say then. Because I didn't have my house payment, had more money than I knew what do with, was a LOT younger, there wasn't this current overpricing of stuff for our cars, the amount of utter crap wasn't as rampant (cheaply made ersatz parts), cars were newer and less prone to rust, O.C.I.R., virgin European spec. engine cases were a dime a dozen, and I'd be back with my club members and seeing 'em almost everyday again. Way too much good stuff for the pro column.

For fun, let's look at the current day; house payment, raising two sons (which is a GOOD thing), over abundance of knock-off/reproduction stuff, I'm with my car club friends again (another GOOD thing), stuff is way too much money these days, cars are old and rusty, hoodrides, rat look, gay patina fascination garbage, accessory overload gayness, "slammed" & "bagged" vomit, ultra "narrowed" front beams (barf), and any other dumbass VW gangster lingo, no more O.C.I.R., I don't give a rat's ass 'bout cnc heads, MSD, or any of that high tech stuff. I'm a fossil and prefer mechanical fuel pumps, good old reliable ignition points, and factory casted cylinder heads done right And I'm running out of stuff for the con column.

Hmm... yeah, I'm gonna go w/THEN. Just take me back to 1979, please.

Next?

[DKK Robert]

Have to say then, not just for the parts ect....... and the cars were more affordable.

[Jim Ratto]

HAHAHA!!!

Okay, now... back to the original question. That's a tough call, Jim. But I'd have to say then. Because I didn't have my house payment, had more money than I knew what do with, was a LOT younger, there wasn't this current overpricing of stuff for our cars, the amount of utter crap wasn't as rampant (cheaply made ersatz parts), cars were newer and less prone to rust, O.C.I.R., virgin European spec. engine cases were a dime a dozen, and I'd be back with my club members and seeing 'em almost everyday again. Way too much good stuff for the pro column.

For fun, let's look at the current day; house payment, raising two sons (which is a GOOD thing), over abundance of knock-off/reproduction stuff, I'm with my car club friends again (another GOOD thing), stuff is way too much money these days, cars are old and rusty, hoodrides, rat look, gay patina fascination garbage, accessory overload gayness, "slammed" & "bagged" vomit, ultra "narrowed" front beams (barf), and any other dumbass VW gangster lingo, no more O.C.I.R., I don't give a rat's ass 'bout cnc heads, MSD, or any of that high tech stuff. I'm a fossil and prefer mechanical fuel pumps, good old reliable ignition points, and factory casted cylinder heads done right And I'm running out of stuff for the con column.

Hmm... yeah, I'm gonna go w/THEN. Just take me back to 1979, please.

Next?

It is a tough call. Shubee, I'm just teasing, I see your point and I see Mark's too. Mark, the narrowed beam ratrod crap isn't really "cal look" as far as anybody here is considered (right guys?....as I swing a big baseball bat )... so yes it must have been nice 30 years ago to have that void, but those cars...well to refer to them as cars.... sorry, those foldup tin scraps, that once WERE cars... they don't apply... right?
I think we're pretty lucky today to have advances in technology that allow us to work on cars less, yet go faster. More often. But to be able to go to Downtown USA VW dealer and buy stuff, and to go get a forged crank @ Bergs (remember when they were on sale for $695?), find an orig set of Berms for $1000...IDAs for $400.00... I was around for all that, and it was nice, and had I known then what I know now.... you know the rest.
I think today, if you're careful in your selection, you can build decent stuff. The getting old part and having no $$$... somebody figure that one out for me.

[Rennsurfer]

Yeah, I see your points (not the ignition variety), Jim. True, we can make the cars go faster today. And thank you clarifying the baseball covered items. Once again we, FOR SURE, agree on a car related topic.

 

You would've gotten along rather well with the crowd that was a few years older than you... easily. But at least we're all here, now, and enjoying this... yes?

[John Rayburn]

I had fun then, and I'm having fun now.

[Rennsurfer]

I had fun then, and I'm having fun now.

[louisb]

Course I was not around "then" but I would go with now. People only remember the good things about passed days and rarely remember the bad. There were a lot of crap parts floating around then and the standard of cars being built were much lower than they are now even with better starting material. Add to that the advances in the past 20 years and the stuff that is on the horizon. Its like comparing hot rods from today to hot rods from the '50s. Sure there were some great cars back then, but I think there are more of them now.

--louis

[John Rayburn]

I had fun then, and I'm having fun now.

                                                    Thank God for you, Mark! Then and now!

[javabug]

I wasn't around in the "old" days, but one thing I sure miss from back then is the make do with what you have approach.  Especially with the advent of internet forums and "easy" info, there's all kinds of people who, without a web site or ordering THE part to do THE job, don't seem to know how to make something work.  Not that I'm any kind of expert, but it seems like a little of the ingenuity and thinking a problem through to solution is gone.

On the other hand, back then how would an east coast wannabe like me rub virtual elbows with my VW heros?  I do love the internet for the networking and relationships I've been able to build.

[Speed-Randy]

I forgot 4" bores.

Did they have those in the good old days, Shubee?

Did Not Need Them The Old Guys knew how to Make Horse Power without the Big CC's

for about a hundred miles before it came apart, i know, your engines never blew up

[Speed-Randy]

I had fun then, and I'm having fun now.

thank god for you john

[kingsburgphil]

Great thread! Definitely now. In 73-75 good race parts were hard to find, p&c's,1.14rockers. linkage etc...scarce. No 5 speeds, weak trannys, fragile heads and nothing digital. 76 brought more and better parts from companies like Autocraft, better street stuff like Cima instead of ISS or NPR. It's
been somewhat of a linear progression from then till now, but nothing can duplicate the shock and awe witnessed in 67/68 @ OCIR when VW's
driven by the likes of Lowery,Vittone,Bays, and Schley blew off the waterpumpers.

I've got the money, I can get the parts/work. But I don't think I can buy the same thrill...After all there can only be one first time. 

[Bewitched666]

As i started way back in the beginning of the 80's till now its hard to tell what period to choose.
I think both now and then have their stuff pros and cons

Parts wise i think i'll go for "now" becoz they are easier to get and "then" for all the stuff we did to make the cars go fast.
I must say that when i lived in curacao and in the states people who drove beetles where a close group and thats something i miss when i came to live in holland in 1994.

But thinking back of all the fun i had with beetles i think i will choose the back in the days period Jim

[j-f]

I'm too young to be able to choose a period I never know (How old were you back in '82  ).

But even if it was more difficult to get parts or info, VW people made a lot's of things with what they had. And when I look to old books or magazines, car shows were full of cars and people, owners and builders put lot's of originality and work to find new way to improve the look, style and power of their car.

Now, old school cars looks basically all the same. Everybody seems to want the same parts and reach the establishes style.

To me, I can't choose something I don't know, but then looks more fun.

[LuftsickTero]

 

[Jon]

Now...

[Rennsurfer]

"Wern't" = 

[Shubee2 (DSK)]

I'm too young to be able to choose a period I never know (How old were you back in '82  ).

But even if it was more difficult to get parts or info, VW people made a lot's of things with what they had. And when I look to old books or magazines, car shows were full of cars and people, owners and builders put lot's of originality and work to find new way to improve the look, style and power of their car.

Now, old school cars looks basically all the same. Everybody seems to want the same parts and reach the establishes style.

To me, I can't choose something I don't know, but then looks more fun.

Your Statement is Very True  (owners and builders put lot's of originality and work to find new way to improve the look, style and power of their car.)

(Now, old school cars looks basically all the same. Everybody seems to want the same parts and reach the establishes style.)

[deano]

The 'ol days were full of pot holes we tend to forget.... pulled head studs, cracked heads and case, broken clutch tubes, the LAW (too much noise, too low, too much smog, no bumpers....), broken main shafts/first gear, axles, lack of knowledge, few knew how to weld on VW heads, and no money to spend on your stuff! If you made $3 per hour, a $75 BRM was still expensive.... and so was a $300 Becker paint job. 

[Paul Bahnstormerz]

Dunno, but nowadays to many over detailed cars, repro BRMS, 2276cc, chrome trim, bumpers, etc. go to any show and you'll see them, open a VW magazine and there they are, all this and it's combined with old men reliving their youth. I remember being impressed by seeing a car on BRMs, nowadays everybody follows the recipe book too much!

[OgCalLook]

1975 = 16 years old, I was just happy to have a select-a-drop and 145-xzx's!!!

Cars were plentiful & cheap, (especially in Riverside, working for a shop) but like Deano said $3 hour....
The cool thing was, I ONLY drove VWs.... all day, everyday.

Now - The knowledge base is crazy and being shared!! (internet) but you can't listen to one person, you have to form your own opinions/conclusions.
as far as inferior parts go, Its a challenge to make things work, so mic it, machine it, polish it..... make it work, just like the old days

[javabug]

I want to change my answer.  My new engine should be running in a couple of weeks, so I choose "future."   

[Rick Sadler]

In a perfect world we could blend the two into one. It was definately great growing up as a kid in Orange County and having a majority of the "Original VW Gurus" live within driving distance. Now the next generation of Gurus are in many differant locations throughout the world with a large amount still within driving distance of the OC. These next generation guys (many of which were tutuored by the originals) have made it possible to build 2387cc and larger engines more reliable than what some of the"Big 2 litre" engines of yesteryear. As for parts, many manufacturers have come and gone and some for a very good reason. Although there is quite a bit of nostalgic value to some items many of those items are produced today with higher quality materials and workmanship. Don't believe me? ask some of the guys that raced in the 70's. I am not talking about all the "trinkets" that have been knocked off overseas rather some of engine components that are now available to everyone. Quality parts that are now made of chromolly instead of high carbon steel, a choice of engine cases made of aluminum or magnesium instead of only magnesium, one piece forged cranks in a multitude of strokes and rod combinations, connecting rods in "H" and "I" beam styles with enough differant lengths and journal sizes to make your head spin and just about any combination of cylinder head you could ask for. Because of these choices, we can now build our Cal-Lookers to have power and reliability. As for the events, their was nothing like the Original Bug-Ins. With the grandstands completely packed, acres of show cars, and the carnival like atmosphere this has yet to be duplicated. I think most of this is attributed to changing of the demographics. When you look at the age group of attendees at the Bug-In, you had the passion of a group that was predominantly in their teens to late twenties. When you go to an event now most are late twenties to their fifties. The thrill is still there however, the die hard enthusiasm to spend the night in a field so you can spend the entire next day in the elements for most is gone but not forgotten. How great would today's events be if most of us were still in our late teens and early twenties with the anticipation of watching side by side 8 second passes in a full bodied VW?  Or to see the number of "over the top" quality cars that have been produced in the last 5 years. I am in no way trying to take anything away from the innovators of yesterday, because without them we would be nowhere today. So , what would I like? I want to have the car I currently have that I could not afford when I was 16 making a 1.65 per hour, with all of todays parts and all the knowledge I have at my ripe old age of 50 and be transported back to 1974 when I was 16 years old and not a care in the world waiting in line to get into the Bug-In with my fellow club members. To me the perfect combination of both.