The Cal-look Lounge
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
February 22, 2020, 13:58:32 pm

Login with username, password and session length
Thank you for your support!
Search:     Advanced search
343920 Posts in 27416 Topics by 6417 Members
Latest Member: r0ch3lle29
* Home This Year's European Top 20 lists All Time European Top 20 lists Search Login Register
+  The Cal-look Lounge
|-+  Cal-look/High Performance
| |-+  Cal-look
| | |-+  THOSE ANAHEIM HIGH SCHOOL "HOT ROD" GUYS
« previous next »
Pages: [1] Print
Author Topic: THOSE ANAHEIM HIGH SCHOOL "HOT ROD" GUYS  (Read 5181 times)
johnl
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1533



« on: October 17, 2012, 17:23:11 pm »

Most of you who read this site regularly know my writings and how I enjoy sharing history of the early days of VW’s Unlimited and Der Kleiner Panzers.  If you’ve read any of these stories you know that both VW clubs mentioned above evolved from guys who attended Anaheim High School.  I now have more Hot Rod car history to share with you and although not VW related I think it ties into the picture.

My family moved from Santa Ana to Anaheim in June of 1956 and thus my love affair with the city began and remains to this day.  From that time on I’ve always considered Anaheim my home.  I’ve not lived in the city limits for the past 35 years but my business is located there only 1.94 miles or 4 minutes from Anaheim High.  Daily I drive those streets that continue to stir memories of days long ago.

I’ve stated before that this was probably the best place on the planet for a kid that loved cars to grow up in those days.  Over the last 56 years the place has changed dramatically but there are still those old haunts that retain such fond memories

Last night I received an e-mail from a New Zealand Chrysler buddy and he mentioned something that caught my interest and so I started doing a bit of research.  My friend Owen, who owns a couple of historical Chrysler performance cars, mentioned the name Potvin Cams in his post.  This immediately brought back some memories of my experience with a Potvin VW cam, my first at the beginning of my VW life but now I’ll share the rest of the story with you.

Joe Schneider of Schneider Motors was the place that worked on my car and I hung out there when ever time would allow.  Joe had come from Germany I’m guessing shortly after WW II ended and became a mechanic and a rather good one in my opinion.

Schneider Motors was then located on Los Angeles St. (now Anaheim Blvd.) and just about ½ block north was Chuck Potvin’s shop.  Now at the time this meant nothing to me but when Joe built my first “Hot Rod” VW motor he used a Potvin Cam.  Possibly this was because it was a 2 minute walk to get it or he liked what they offered.  I do remember walking to Potvin’s shop with Joe and talking to Chuck but I had no idea of this guy’s Hot Rod history.

When I started researching Chuck Potvin http://www.kustomrama.com/index.php?title=Chuck_Potvin not only did I learn a lot but some other names came up that also have major Hot Rod history and these guys also were Anaheim High students.  Two names that I was able to research were Dick Kraft who is credited in creating the world’s first dragster, (The Bug), how is that for a name http://www.kustomrama.com/index.php?title=Dick_Kraft and Doug Hartlet who was first in the SCTA standing with car no. 1R on August 8th., 1948. The paper is signed by Wally Parks.http://www.kustomrama.com/index.php?title=Doug_Hartelt

Anyway I found this great reading and I had no idea that such a history of guys that attended Anaheim High other than those DKP guys, Peter Dayton, Gary Huggins, John Lazenby, Ron Fleming, Mike Mahaffey and a few more existed.  Don’t know why or how it would turn out that way but it did.  Maybe it is in the water…..  I think if you take the time to read these links you will learn much and if you’re a “car guy” like me you will appreciate what these early guys offered to our hobby.  Here is yet another link I’ve found with names and photos of guys who came out of Anaheim and also tie into Hot Rod history.  http://www.kustomrama.com/index.php?title=Anaheim 

Side Bar:  Here is a link I found while doing the research above.  I saw the name Ed Cousins and went numb.  When I was about 11 years old my Dad took me to the Ford Dealership in the sleepy town of Brea, CA. to meet Ed Cousins and see his ’32 Ford Truck. 

For a kid of that age who loved cars and especially Hot Rods this was heaven.  Ed was a very friendly guy and his truck was parked in the show room of Birch Ford which would later move to Harbor Blvd. in La Habra (Sarge’s home town) and remain there for many years prior to closing their doors. 

When I saw the photos of Ed’s truck http://www.kustomrama.com/index.php?title=Ed_Cousins'_1932_Ford I was blown away.  I only met him the one time but never forgot him or that magnificent truck.

Here are a few more famous names from Anaheim High School:

•   Gustavo Arellano (1997) - Author, ¡Ask a Mexican!
•   Dan Barker (1967) Author, atheist, and co-president of Freedom From Religion Foundation.
•   Charles Burlingame III (1967) - Pilot of American Airlines Flight 77, which crashed into the Pentagon on September 11, 2001
•   Lou Correa (1981) California State Senator
•   Ron Davini (1965) - 1967 MVP in College Baseball World Series (Arizona State University) who has worked with USA Baseball.
•   Reuben Droughns (1996) - NFL running back with New York Giants[1]
•   Jim Fassel (1967) - Former head coach New York Giants
•   Jorge Flores (2007) - Chivas USA football player
•   Scheila Gonzalez (1989) - Musician and music educator
•   Bobby Hatfield (1958) - Singer and member of the duo The Righteous Brothers.[2]
•   Tony Kanal (1988) - Bassist of No Doubt
•   Thomas Kuchel (1928) - U.S. Senator from California (1953–1969)
•   Gerry Mullins (1967) - Football player with USC and Pittsburgh Steelers. Started four Super Bowls at right guard for the Steelers
•   Brian Noble (1980) - - Football player with Arizona State and Green Bay Packers (1985–1993)
•   Alyson Reed (1976) - Tony Award-nominated actress (Cabaret, A Chorus Line, High School Musical)
Logged

Volkswagens Limited, DKP I
Celebrating 56 years of Volkswagens in my life 1963-2019

Life is a learning experience and then you die but when you do you've lived a good life if you contributed to your fellow man.
von-dart
Newbie
*
Posts: 40


« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2012, 19:43:58 pm »

^  Best history teacher ever. ^     Cool
Logged
Dyno-Don
Full Member
***
Posts: 104



« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2012, 19:50:01 pm »

nice story John!
Logged
johnl
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1533



« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2012, 21:27:35 pm »

^  Best history teacher ever. ^     Cool

THANKS..............  I love history and enjoy researching the details.  Everything is in the "details"....   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
Logged

Volkswagens Limited, DKP I
Celebrating 56 years of Volkswagens in my life 1963-2019

Life is a learning experience and then you die but when you do you've lived a good life if you contributed to your fellow man.
deano
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1850



WWW
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2012, 23:38:05 pm »

Chuck Potvin also did a lot of graphics and photos for the Lowry Brothers, but went by "NIVTOP" which is Potvin spelled backwards! He did all their catalog photos and layouts.

Growing up in La Habra, I always felt I was lost in space between two (or three) cool places. Leaving my house, we turned right to go to Whittier for Bob's, turn left to head to either Fullerton or Anaheim. La Habra was basically no-man's land.... Freeway close to nothing we always said.
Logged

Hot VWs Magazine Window Washer
Anglia Obsolete Guru
'67 Heaven
Fritter
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 625



« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2012, 01:07:49 am »

Good read, John!   Grin

Do you know the specs of the Potvin cam that was installed in your car?
Logged

Mike F.
'64 Indigo Blue sunroof Bug
johnl
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1533



« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2012, 01:36:07 am »

Good read, John!   Grin 

Not a clue.  It was a 40HP with an 82mm big bore kit.  I let Joe make the decision on what to use as I viewed him as the expert and I was just a kid of about 17.
Logged

Volkswagens Limited, DKP I
Celebrating 56 years of Volkswagens in my life 1963-2019

Life is a learning experience and then you die but when you do you've lived a good life if you contributed to your fellow man.
javabug
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 2102


WHAT'S UP WID DA BOOM BOOM???


« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2012, 02:25:35 am »

This is great stuff, John. Thanks!

Chuck Potvin also did a lot of graphics and photos for the Lowry Brothers, but went by "NIVTOP" which is Potvin spelled backwards! He did all their catalog photos and layouts.

Also interesting!
Logged

Mike H.

Sven was right.
johnl
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1533



« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2012, 02:31:01 am »

This is great stuff, John. Thanks!

Chuck Potvin also did a lot of graphics and photos for the Lowry Brothers, but went by "NIVTOP" which is Potvin spelled backwards! He did all their catalog photos and layouts.

Also interesting!

If you get into the links provided in my original post you will see the "NIVTOP" info.  I do find it interesting that CP worked with the Lowry Brothers.  He really was a rounded "car guy".
Logged

Volkswagens Limited, DKP I
Celebrating 56 years of Volkswagens in my life 1963-2019

Life is a learning experience and then you die but when you do you've lived a good life if you contributed to your fellow man.
beatnik beetle
Full Member
***
Posts: 168


« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2012, 09:30:07 am »

thats a great read, interesting facts..I might be wrong but, I'm sure Dean Moon offered a vw cam at one point and he always had close ties with Potvin...
Logged
hotrodsurplus
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 566


It's not how fast you go; it's how you go fast.


« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2012, 10:24:13 am »

thats a great read, interesting facts..I might be wrong but, I'm sure Dean Moon offered a vw cam at one point and he always had close ties with Potvin...

Moon actually bought Potvin's patterns for front-drive blowers. Bill Jenks ground cams on Potvin's old machine (I think a Storm Vulcan) for decades--in fact until he died a few years ago.

Those Storm Vulcans turned a lot of guys into cam grinders. Most early cam grinders relied on an oversized profile to grind the lobe but from what I know the SV machines could use an existing cam lobe profile as a template (think of a really big key-cutting machine).

I don't know if Moon ever purposely set out to grind VW cams but I do know that Jenks ground a few VW cams for custom jobs. He'd grind a cam for damn near anything.

If there's a linkage between all this business and Volkswagens it's likely the 400/Climax lobe profile that Potvin ground for really hot Flatheads. It has 284-degrees duration with .387 lift for .013" lash. Reduce the lash to .006"  and you get .394" lift. Multiply that by a 1:1.1 rocker ratio and you get a .433" lift at 284 degrees of duration...which is the stat for an Engle 110. Coincidence? Well considering what the Storm Vulcan could do, I don't think it is.

Ed Cousins was in the Renegades with my late pal Ed Ducazau. Renegades was a top-shelf club. Somewhere in my stash I have a photo of his pickup in the distance behind Ducazau's RPU at an event at Long Beach Stadium. I'll have to blow out the cobwebs...   
Logged

Chris Shelton. Professional liar.
johnl
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1533



« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2012, 15:34:19 pm »

thats a great read, interesting facts..I might be wrong but, I'm sure Dean Moon offered a vw cam at one point and he always had close ties with Potvin...

Moon actually bought Potvin's patterns for front-drive blowers. Bill Jenks ground cams on Potvin's old machine (I think a Storm Vulcan) for decades--in fact until he died a few years ago.

Those Storm Vulcans turned a lot of guys into cam grinders. Most early cam grinders relied on an oversized profile to grind the lobe but from what I know the SV machines could use an existing cam lobe profile as a template (think of a really big key-cutting machine).

I don't know if Moon ever purposely set out to grind VW cams but I do know that Jenks ground a few VW cams for custom jobs. He'd grind a cam for damn near anything.

If there's a linkage between all this business and Volkswagens it's likely the 400/Climax lobe profile that Potvin ground for really hot Flatheads. It has 284-degrees duration with .387 lift for .013" lash. Reduce the lash to .006"  and you get .394" lift. Multiply that by a 1:1.1 rocker ratio and you get a .433" lift at 284 degrees of duration...which is the stat for an Engle 110. Coincidence? Well considering what the Storm Vulcan could do, I don't think it is.

Ed Cousins was in the Renegades with my late pal Ed Ducazau. Renegades was a top-shelf club. Somewhere in my stash I have a photo of his pickup in the distance behind Ducazau's RPU at an event at Long Beach Stadium. I'll have to blow out the cobwebs...   

Chris, I'd remembering you making the comments about a possible link with the 400/Climax lobe and the Engle 110.  It sure sounds like it could be the fact.

Small world about the Ed Cousins link.  Do you know what ever happend to Ed?  Based on his and my ages at our meeting I'd supsect he has passed on.  At any rate I wonder what became of his '32 truck?  It sure was a beauty..........
Logged

Volkswagens Limited, DKP I
Celebrating 56 years of Volkswagens in my life 1963-2019

Life is a learning experience and then you die but when you do you've lived a good life if you contributed to your fellow man.
johnl
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1533



« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2012, 15:55:19 pm »

Further research on this site revealed more history for me.  First Stanley (Stan) Betz is mentioned but there are no details.  I've told the story prior that as a kid I use to ride my bike down to the Pickwick Hotel and go to Tiny's Hobby Shop which was on Los Angeles St. in the lower portion of the hotel.  To get there I'd ride down Chestnut St. and just a door or two from where the DKP club house would be a few years later Stan Betz had his paint shop.

Stan had his leg removed as a kid due to problems which I can't remember the details.  He wore a white bib-overall and with his peg leg sticking straight out would sit on the curb and mix paint.  You could find the place in the dark because of all of the colors on the curb there.

Always there was some cool car parked there and always Stan's Hot Rod with lots of louvers on the rear deck as he did those as well.    Years later I'd be in contact with Stan as an adult as a friend owned a sign shop in Orange and Stan's shop was right next door.  We'd go over and visit and look at the many movie props Stan had in the building.  He was really a nice guy and even mixed some touch up paint (Tango Red) for our C300 Chrysler.

The other part of the story is this link:  http://www.kustomrama.com/index.php?title=Dick_Gonzales%27_1955_Studebaker  While reading through this link I got down to the For Sale ad in the paper and spotted the address.  It turned out this was only a couple of blocks from my home and what is even more strange to me is I don't remember ever seeing this car.

For a kid that loved cars in general with emphasis on Hot Rods and Customs I can't figure how I never crossed paths with this Stude.  The two noted "high end" painters of the day were Watson's and Juniors House of Color and as you can see this car had a Watson paint job.  Note the asking price for the car and based on all of it's history and the work put into it I'm reminded of selling Butternut for $1600 with a Beckers paint job, Brad's interior, 1900cc Weber motor and five real American Mags.  I guess it was just the way things were back in the day.
Logged

Volkswagens Limited, DKP I
Celebrating 56 years of Volkswagens in my life 1963-2019

Life is a learning experience and then you die but when you do you've lived a good life if you contributed to your fellow man.
johnl
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1533



« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2012, 19:31:23 pm »

This came to me via e-mail from Mike Mahaffey.  I guess I wasn't the only one who got one of these cams.


Potvin cams - I had forgotten about those.  I think that is what Joe put in my first 1600 he built for my '51.
Thanks for the story!
Mike
Logged

Volkswagens Limited, DKP I
Celebrating 56 years of Volkswagens in my life 1963-2019

Life is a learning experience and then you die but when you do you've lived a good life if you contributed to your fellow man.
Fritter
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 625



« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2012, 19:34:51 pm »

Interesting. John, you have the same cam in your new car that Mike had in his 2180!
Logged

Mike F.
'64 Indigo Blue sunroof Bug
johnl
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1533



« Reply #15 on: October 18, 2012, 19:50:38 pm »

Interesting. John, you have the same cam in your new car that Mike had in his 2180!

The Green Monster has an Engle 130 (which I wouldn't have chosen) had I done the build myself.  Is this what Mike had in his 2180? 

What he is referring to in his post is a 1600cc that Joe Schneider built for him which was long before the 2180.  Mike's split came from Schneider Motors as a mechanic who worked there named Gary owned it and sold it to him.  Gary had tried to sell it to me prior to Mike but what was I going to do with (2) cars.  Seems strange to say that now as I currently own an even dozen....   Embarrassed Embarrassed
Logged

Volkswagens Limited, DKP I
Celebrating 56 years of Volkswagens in my life 1963-2019

Life is a learning experience and then you die but when you do you've lived a good life if you contributed to your fellow man.
Fritter
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 625



« Reply #16 on: October 18, 2012, 20:02:02 pm »


The Green Monster has an Engle 130 (which I wouldn't have chosen) had I done the build myself.  Is this what Mike had in his 2180? 

What he is referring to in his post is a 1600cc that Joe Schneider built for him which was long before the 2180.  Mike's split came from Schneider Motors as a mechanic who worked there named Gary owned it and sold it to him.  Gary had tried to sell it to me prior to Mike but what was I going to do with (2) cars.  Seems strange to say that now as I currently own an even dozen....   Embarrassed Embarrassed

[/quote]

You don't like the Engle 130?  What would you have chosen instead do you think?  Yes, I think it was mentioned by Mike M himself in another post that Ron Fleming swore that an Engle 130 was used in the famous Mahaffey 2180.

Yes, I understood that the 1600 was a previous motor, sorry for the confusion!

Love all this historical stuff John. 

Logged

Mike F.
'64 Indigo Blue sunroof Bug
johnl
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1533



« Reply #17 on: October 18, 2012, 20:40:50 pm »

Well, I'm not a Hot Rod kid anymore and would like something a bit more user friendly.  I think the largest I would have gone with my dated and limited knowledge is a 125 or maybe even a 120.  Should I ever take the motor apart I'll research it further.

I sent Mike Mahaffey a query as to what cam his 2180 had and am currently waiting for his reply.  Mike has a really nice Ghia vert with a 90.5x82, 44IDF Weber motor with Steve Tims stage one heads.  Steve assisted with the build and the motor ended up with an Engle 100 which really raises eyebrows but Mike showed me that the thing made good power up to about 6 grand.  He says he can go anywhere with it and even let one of his daughters take it without fear of driveability.

Some years ago I rebuilt the 392 Hemi in my '57 300C.  At several peoples recommendation I used an Isky cam that I thought was to wild for street.  Turned out that is exactly what occurred.  It was really good to pull into a show and hear the motor "roll" but beyond that it was useless.  Isky originally did the cams for Chrysler in the 300 series back in the early days but the specs for those were more mild.

I went over to Clay Smith (just up the street) and talked with George who did me up a grind on a new blank very close to the original factory specs and once installed the car really performs well.  That bad judgement call on listening to "experts" cost me a weekend and about $500.  I'm a believer that it is very easy to over cam a motor but you can get away with smaller.

I had breakfast with Ron this past Saturday and wonder if he would agree on a 130 for street driving today.  His current ride I'd say has a much milder cam and he seems to like the useability of it.
Logged

Volkswagens Limited, DKP I
Celebrating 56 years of Volkswagens in my life 1963-2019

Life is a learning experience and then you die but when you do you've lived a good life if you contributed to your fellow man.
johnl
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1533



« Reply #18 on: October 19, 2012, 01:56:06 am »

Here is Mike Mahaffey's reply regarding what cam was used in his 2180.

I don't remember but Ron swears it was and Engle 130.


Logged

Volkswagens Limited, DKP I
Celebrating 56 years of Volkswagens in my life 1963-2019

Life is a learning experience and then you die but when you do you've lived a good life if you contributed to your fellow man.
Fritter
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 625



« Reply #19 on: October 19, 2012, 02:11:42 am »

Probably not many 130s on the street then!  Vroooooom.  Grin

I am building a 2332 and probably will put a 125 in it.

I owned a 2110 with an Engle 110 in it about 10 years ago, it ran good but was all done by 5k or so, and I was always disappointed by that.   

120-125 is a good cam for a street 2 liter and being able to rev to 6000-6500 or so.  A happy medium.

Logged

Mike F.
'64 Indigo Blue sunroof Bug
hotrodsurplus
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 566


It's not how fast you go; it's how you go fast.


« Reply #20 on: October 19, 2012, 10:04:34 am »

Chris, I'd remembering you making the comments about a possible link with the 400/Climax lobe and the Engle 110.  It sure sounds like it could be the fact.

Small world about the Ed Cousins link.  Do you know what ever happend to Ed?  Based on his and my ages at our meeting I'd supsect he has passed on.  At any rate I wonder what became of his '32 truck?  It sure was a beauty..........


I'd like to see the .050 specs of the Potvin. That would tell us more of the story.

Don't know what happened to Cousins but I'm guessin' he kicked the bucket some time ago.

As for lamenting the 'low' prices that people sold stuff for, we've been through this several times. Remember, real value is tied to income. The $1,500 that he advertised that Stude for in '63 is the equivalent of $11,348 in today's funds. That was a TON of money for a 10-year-old car that had undergone a lot of modifications. How much would any highly modified 10-year-old car bring today? Unless it was a Benz or Bimmer a hell of a lot less than $11K! Hell, you can buy an '02 Vette for not much more than that.

Regarding the W-130 cam, I agree it might be a little bit too hot for street. Before you go swapping cams, though, understand that cam timing (specifically the intake valve closing event) and compression ratio go hand-in-hand. If you reduce cam timing you must also reduce compression ratio correspondingly. Otherwise your effective CR will increase to the point that the engine will detonate. And to lower the CR sufficiently to run really short cam timing like a W-100 would require opening the chambers (not great) or increasing the deck height (even worse). Efficiency would suffer and that's not saying anything about the ports and valves which were chosen to work with that particular camshaft. Low-speed power would suffer because of the giant ports/valves and high-speed would suffer because of the short timing. You'd probably hate it. I would.

I had a W-110 in a 2110. I liked it--it pulled like gangbusters from pretty much idle upwards. But I always felt that it lacked a little upstairs. It would've been perfect in a heavier, more aerodynamically challenged car like my Thing but for a 'hot' cal-look car like my '66 it fell a little short. I think the 120 would make a reasonable compromise but I don't know if the fast ramps of the 125 would be a good choice. I don't know why Engle chose to name that cam the 125 because it's not really the bridge between the 120 and 130. It's like its own fast-ramp animal. 
Logged

Chris Shelton. Professional liar.
Pages: [1] Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!