After Reading Russels post.....

[Paul Bahnstormerz]

20 years of VWs this year, restoration of car has gone bad, parts are crazy money nowadays, tired of parts everywhere in the house, ditched the gf because I could have more building time without her whining about me being under the car. The VW scene is a strange place to me nowadays, having come back last year, it's all lifestyle stuff!
But, I'll keep building my California look bug. I'm off to lead load the body now and dream of a day when the car is alive again.

[speed7]

I'm 58 , been into cars and bikes since I was 16 and have my 74 late callooker since 27 years.
It's become a regular drag racer with a 2185cc -180hp mill capable of running the 1/4 in a decent 12.8sec.
But it still is road registered and allows to enjoy me take a good nip of adrenaline now and again ...

[Russell]

20 years of VWs this year, restoration of car has gone bad, parts are crazy money nowadays, tired of parts everywhere in the house, ditched the gf because I could have more building time without her whining about me being under the car. The VW scene is a strange place to me nowadays, having come back last year, it's all lifestyle stuff!
But, I'll keep building my California look bug. I'm off to lead load the body now and dream of a day when the car is alive again.

Exactly, its all lifestyle, that is the main problem, people do it now because its either cool or a look not because they understand and love it, like the magazines and shops they all follow this grungie and patina (shit look)

Lets not shave, lets not cut our hair, lets not wash, lets not paint the car, lets get dreadlocks, let the rust get a better hold...... Don't get me started.

IN Fact a statement; I want to coin the phrase "Shit Look or SL" as this will ruin our hobby and cars; and as SL becomes the mainstream us normal VW guys will have the baggage to carry as we did in the late 80s and early 90s in the UK with BUGJAM. The investment we make in our cars should be rewarded not belittled, look at any classic car magazine and the value they give on our cars.... they are clueless as they all think they are POS.... they are not its just they always see the SL style.

In fact we should boycott all this crap with one exception "Hayburner Magazine" not my style but a great mag and a good read...., in fact wonder if they would do a Halo Style Mag with the best of the best VWs...... infact im going to call them.

Rant Over !

[VWGlassee]

I'm 25 and have a 64 Callook
Bought it stock when I was 21. Still love it!

It's the only Callook here in the area (I think...). All my friends drive slammed bugs. I did to! Worked 3 years on my previous bug. Slammed it, drove it... And found it stupid. Not my cup of tea

It's a pity that there aren't any other callookers in the area!

Yannick
Belgium

[Russell]

I'm 25 and have a 64 Callook
Bought it stock when I was 21. Still love it!

It's the only Callook here in the area (I think...). All my friends drive slammed bugs. I did to! Worked 3 years on my previous bug. Slammed it, drove it... And found it stupid. Not my cup of tea

It's a pity that there aren't any other callookers in the area!

Yannick
Belgium

In Belgium  Der Autobahn Scrapers, nothing un cal look about them.

[j-f]

We Should make some stickers saying "shine is not a crime", "horsepower is good for you"... Maybe it will attract people who dont want follow the main rust/dirty scrapyard look stream
I saw too much good solid cars at shows that are litterally killed by rust because the owner found this the only way to look cool... yep,it's harder to grab a welder and work to put the car back in good shape. Its a lazzy guy thing.
Rust is not a crime... my a**.

[Peter]

Where do you live, Yannick?
Feel free to stop by in Muizen!
There are 2 lookers living here (almost)

[Stripped66]

IN Fact a statement; I want to coin the phrase "Shit Look or SL" as this will ruin our hobby and cars; and as SL becomes the mainstream us normal VW guys will have the baggage to carry as we did in the late 80s and early 90s in the UK with BUGJAM. The investment we make in our cars should be rewarded not belittled, look at any classic car magazine and the value they give on our cars.... they are clueless as they all think they are POS.... they are not its just they always see the SL style.

This is not at all unique to VWs. Nearly every automotive niche has a "SL" element with growing participation.

How classic car magazines value "our" cars is something entirely different; but I would suspect that in 2050, a 1990 Corolla -no matter how original it was restored or how custom it was modified- won't receive much attention, either.

[Zach Gomulka]

The "shit look" has to do with money more than laziness. Should these people just fuck off and find a cheaper hobby? Just because their style doesn't interest you, doesn't mean they can't have fun, and isn't that what it is all about? We need more people in this scene, not less.

[richie]

In Belgium  Der Autobahn Scrapers, nothing un cal look about them.

wonder where the name came from?   

[Bugsy]

Just got 46. Read about Callook in the early 80´s and fell in love.
Didnt get my first bug until early 2000 though. Built a 62´and 66´ but never got to build a real Engine for any one of them beacuse of the cost and me not being an Engine guy.
I´m not into "shit lookers" (thanks Russell) so the Money got into body work and interior. I love design so thats why i only build "Callook style"
So they both ended up with 1600´s. In great shape that is but never the Engine i whant to have. Have three kids to feed.
Got hold of a one owner all original 66´in great shape a couple of years ago. A nice driver that i really dont want to screw up ex it´s in need of a repaint. Maybe some lowering spindles and BRM´s? And then the ball is Rolling again. Have accepted the fact that Engine is never to become a reality.
But the style of the cars and all friends that comes with it is something you can live on for a long time.
Keep on callookin guys. You give me something to live for every day.

Regards
Patrik

[RIP356]

The "shit look" has to do with money more than laziness. Should these people just fuck off and find a cheaper hobby? Just because their style doesn't interest you, doesn't mean they can't have fun, and isn't that what it is all about? We need more people in this scene, not less.

But do we want this type of person?

How many times have you seen features in magazines where the owner has said he poured sea water over the body to help it rust??
Will these get restored properly or just disgarded when they get too dangerous to drive?
I have seen it here where they get their Shit Looker on the road as cheap as they can, then try and sell it for big bucks as its the latest fad.
Restoring a vehicle no matter what make is not cheap, and people know that before they start, but if your going to do something do it properly.

One mans Patina is another mans Rust

[j-f]

quote author=Zach Gomulka link=topic=24257.msg316413#msg316413 date=1426267989]
The "shit look" has to do with money more than laziness. Should these people just fuck off and find a cheaper hobby? Just because their style doesn't interest you, doesn't mean they can't have fun, and isn't that what it is all about? We need more people in this scene, not less.
[/quote]

I don't totally agree. I'm the first to point that the fun is all about. Working on my car, on friends cars, going to shows or just cruising, spending hours on campground having some beers and bbq , looking at other cars at shows that either are cal look, resto cal or vintage, I like them all . Even patina one,but true patina....
I always respected others people, but, as I love those old cars and the scène that come with, I never understand why making a car rust to death with all kind of junks  pile on it make it cool. If it was something quite unique, I would find this fun. But a whole trend or movement based on that making a vw show looking like a scrapyard is something I dont understand.
Some people like radikalbugz over here in belgium put a lot of work on their cars making them quite unique.like them or not. But too much others try to copy them without the work that come behind.
Money? It would cost less to leave the car as it is. Put it on the ground if you want, paint the wheels pink if you like. it's up to you. That's what make the vw scène so interesting. People who make their car rust doesn't seems to care or be aware that it will cost a whole lot more of money to restore them.

[Zach Gomulka]

I agree that no one wants an unsafe car on the road, same problem with the guys building rat rods over here. Rust that is through the metal on any part, be it structural or not, is not a good thing. Surface rust however, well I've got better things to worry about than how people are  "styling" their VW.
In my late teens and early 20's, I did my best to build a fast VW. I was obsessed with the traditional Cal Look. I had a rust free but ugly 67 sedan, so naturally what appealed to me was Mark Herbert's SSB. I wanted to play Cal Look too, so not having much money, I put what I did have into making it low in the front and fast as I could afford in the back. The result was a car that ran a best of 14.8 (with only 1600cc), but was an absolute fright to drive. The front suspension work was cheap, it was all I could afford, and rode like it had square wheels. The brakes were stock and not kept up with most of the time. I was young, dumb, and broke, and no one was going to tell me any other way to build my car. But it was very quick, for what it was!
I suppose what I'm saying is, that with limited funds I'd rather see a car that is safely modified, even if it is still slow and not Cal Look. I could care less about what it looks like. If the car is too low and/or too rotten and self destructing as a result, that's something that no one wants on the road. I could argue that too much HP with neglected suspension and brakes are much, much worse though. And you know that's exactly where the little money a teenager interested in Cal Look will go!!

[Russell]

Your right we do want all kinds to support or brand of car, whether its cal look, gasser, race, custom, resto csl, vintage, etc. I like it all

But and its a BIG BUT, some very unsafe and shit stuff is out there and they are talked up as being the next best thing, last year I remember reading A feature in one of the mags about  a van that caught fire, now that had happened to me before and its a sore experience,,,,, but to see a feature in print in a mag with burnt out seats and interior and charred paint.... That is way beyond cool

I see that having a strong view on a topic gets people involved so this is good, keep it comming

Now, another think I hate is crap race cars.. Anyone ?

[stussyrich]

Now, another think I hate is crap race cars.. Anyone ?

Define Crap.

[karl h]

i think Russel means unsafe
just crappy looking cant be the point, just look at the SSB, its a legend...

[Paul Bahnstormerz]

Didn't Paul Rui, bury BRMs and rub the paint work with brake fluid on a split beetle to give it patina? But then again that car was a cool as fuck, and didn't qualify for rat look as it didn't have a rope around the bumper.
Having recently seen one of the magazine cars recently up close, utterly unsafe, wheel studs 5" long with spacers ripping themselves from drum, rear wheel bearings running dry, gear box side plates coming off due to such negative camber.
But it's cool as it was photo with some ugly bird with tattoos for the magazine

[Rocket Ron]

I'm 45 this year and had the same bug since I was 16. Money to spend on my cars has always been hard to find, nearly as hard as finding time to work on them. I'm now at point in my life where I now have a little more of both time and money but the cars are currently less important than maybe they were in earlier years. Having said this I am planning a trip this year that will hopefully get my Mojo back.

With regards to the patina thing, I've stopped buying the vw mags as I'm truly fed up with the rusty bugs and busses featured.

 Not wanting to start an argument but I think there is a definite difference between a survivor car with faded paint and the intensional destruction of a car by rubbing off the paint and loading it with chain and ropes, never can see the logic in that.

The early " patina " show cars that I saw at the volksworld show were very detailed underneath and most importantly safe with decent naturally aged bodies. I don't attend many shows but at Ebi last time some of the cars that turned up that week, that by all accounts had been thrown out of Germany whilst attending a vintage meet were in my opinion total death traps.

The lack of a need for an annual inspection for pre 60 cars here in the UK whilst making it easier for the responsible vw owner has given the irresponsible few the excuse to run round in a car that should be nowhere near the road. But hey they look cool  

[leec]

Just because its a shiny car doesn't mean its 'all good' underneath.
How many shiny Volksworld feature cars have been re-done over the years to find several bodges

In my opinion if a car is well engineered and safe/drives well the paint is the icing on the cake. You can have nice icing but a shit cake

[Flow]

I better wait for years (and meanwhile drive it) for some expensive but good welding than make it myself and lose a lot of time for a crappy result...

[WhiteTrash]

Exactly, its all lifestyle, that is the main problem
Lets not shave, lets not cut our hair, lets not wash, lets not paint the car, lets get dreadlocks, let the rust get a better hold...... Don't get me started.
Rant Over !

Ahh and so we slowly draw you over to our dark side where you realise our values are the right values. Young men should take care in basic grooming (not the fag gilette and nivea type though) representing a stout appearance and behaviour, taking pride in things being done properly. Lost in the modern Brussel's lead, everybody has the right to express and your government does support your laziness and slag attitute live style, stopping you from taking responsibility and caring for your own life 

[Russell]

Exactly, its all lifestyle, that is the main problem
Lets not shave, lets not cut our hair, lets not wash, lets not paint the car, lets get dreadlocks, let the rust get a better hold...... Don't get me started.
Rant Over !

Ahh and so we slowly draw you over to our dark side where you realise our values are the right values. Young men should take care in basic grooming (not the fag gilette and nivea type though) representing a stout appearance and behaviour, taking pride in things being done properly. Lost in the modern Brussel's lead, everybody has the right to express and your government does support your laziness and slag attitute live style, stopping you from taking responsibility and caring for your own life 

Coming from anyone else this would be funny from you I'm worried..... We may have 6hrs together on route to Hanover, that will be interesting .....

[Torben Alstrup]

Turning 54 this summer.
IMHO Russel and Bernard basicly hit the nail on the head. I also think that the market is somewhat saturated (in lack of a better word)
When I look at the engines I build today, they are much more period correct types of engines plus my standard plus series, plus a few higher detailed street engines for both busses and bugs.
Very little race.

T

[Jo Clifford]

I will be 47 this year, but have only been into VW’s for the last 20 years, at the age of 16 I was into Vespa's and Lambretta's, I have owned some of each and ridden many miles around the UK and across Europe. 
My first car was a MK1 Ford Escort a car I owned it for about 15 years, I’ve also owned V8’s and even a Corvair Lakewood and briefly a 1968 Triumph 500, in all honesty I just love ‘hot rodded’ cars & bikes.
My first aircooled VW was the Pagan Princess – Razor Edge Ghia, I enjoyed the ‘show car’ scene, but cars are for driving, so I am now enjoying having a couple of real drivers.
Both my 59 & my 67 are built around ‘Cal-look’ principles, but the focus is more on quick fun drive anywhere cars, than to fit any niche style or label.   
Both have stroker motors and closer ratio gearboxes, but built to be practical enough as dailys if the mood takes me 
Not interested in SL, but I really appreciate an original paint unmolested car.

[dannyboy]

rusty slammed shitters don't do it for me but we all have different taste,i buy a vw mag when theres a car that interests me  in otherwise i don't bother, cal look is just the style i like,
im not bothered about exact details but if its got nice wheels sits good and has t bars ill probably like it ohh and muxst have a big arsed motor 

[vwhelmot]

I loved cal look before but I still blame Keith Seume for igniting my passion for it. That bloody book fired me up when it came out, the stories and the fantastic pictures, it had a big influence on me. At that time I was rebuilding my 1303 , my first proper resto but I realized that the big windows and bulbus front didn't really cut it in the cal look world although I still like dumper.  Towards the end of that rebuild I had bought my 64 and little did I know that that car would take up so much of my time and money. I kept referring to the book particularly the lightning bug interior with it's gold paneling and minimalistic interior and wild flake paintwork etc.  I turned my bug from a £600 daily to a show winner but somehow I lost my whole vw mojo not long after. I had done the show circuit here in the uk for approx three years attending and showing as many as I could and dare I say it I got bored.

This car was sold to Dave forder who turned it into a landy blown German looker.



     Towards the end of that I had the hankering for an oval with a nice 30hp motor so I went on the search. I found a suitable car through Owen Warlow and after parting with £2500 ( it was 2004 I had a nice 56 which I like to call it the "used" look. No shitty rust ( I grit blasted every bit off ) no crap, just a lovely honest car in jungle green. I built a nice 30 hp out of two motors and found a judson blower and to be honest I've loved just driving and enjoying it every min and not attending any shows in the last ten years.



      I still owned my cal looker but because it was shiney , I was scared to take it out for fear of a stone chip etc ( but as I know now i hadn't built it to the highest standard then)  I decided to sell it eight years ago.  It sold after a while as it wasn't to everyone's taste and I realised as soon as it was trailered away that I had made a mistake.
      In those eight years I dabbled with some jap cars, celica gt4, type r civic, but they never came anywhere near the thrill of a fast bug. That was until I got into fast bikes.  Now this is something I still enjoy and after passing my test ages ago I can honestly say that nothing compares to a fast bike!
      I could go on and on but last year I have managed to complete my life and let's just say that the 64 will be back, better than ever. I'm rebuilding it into the car I should have done way back then. Oh and I'm 40 but age has bugger all to do with it.

[RichardinNZ]

VWHelmot...off topic but can I see more photos of your Oval!

Thanks
Richard

[Russell]

Now, another think I hate is crap race cars.. Anyone ?

Define Crap.

Not easy to do, my opinion of crap will be different to another's but for me it's easy, a race car is not a fast street car it's a race car, so should be all about the go, if your race car can be beaten by a street car it's a crap race car....

It's easier to define what is a race car... bernies car, detailed to the max, goes like shit and always performs, richies verts, the race shop Ghia

Or any car with standard rear torsion bars.

[Dead Dog]

I've just turned 45 oooooold 
The beetle I race is the first car I ever had.
It's just a generation thing I think, beetles were very popular & cheap & cool when I was 17, always loved them, it's the car that was 'about' at the time, like 'kids' these days are into polos golfs etc because it's whats about and affordable now.
My boys love older vw's and the race scene, and both want to race - I doubt it will be aircooled though......... maybe I should refuse to help them if it isn't aircooled 
The vast majority of adults get married have kids buy a 'sensible' car and their automotive life is finished. We on the other hand still have the passion.
And the younger ones that do go aircooled unfortunately seem to be hooked into the rusty pile, that is not so slowly rusting away and the floorpans gradually getting ground away scene - why spend thousands on restoration & paint when rust is wayy cool, and hey if you manage to get it low enough and rusty enough it could be on the cover of Hayburner - wooot!