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needles in my eyes: transmissions
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Topic: needles in my eyes: transmissions (Read 7005 times)
nicolas
Hero Member
Posts: 4014
needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
on:
November 09, 2007, 13:22:20 pm »
john rayburn said that he would rather stick needles in his eyes, then open up and rebuild a gearbox. a friend of mine opened up my transmission. now we need to put it back together.
but that is exactly what we are going to do...
we are going to a shop that has the old equipment to measure everything. but the task will not be monumental. it really is a project to see if we can make it work properly again.
the mods we are thinking of is:
welded 3th and 4th
superdiff
thick sideplates
and other things we should do to make the transmission last with the 2l engine...
it will be a stock geared transmission from a type3 or are there other gears we should consider?
what will components cost? and where can i get a good superdiff? i heard about the differential of a thing/181 but i don't know if it is good enough for a more race-oriented car...
lots of questions .
anyway if all this fails i have to look for a wellbuild transmission with a 4.12 R&P... anyone has one he can miss
Logged
Frank LUX
Hero Member
Posts: 1886
Back...Soon...hopefully!!!
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #1 on:
November 09, 2007, 15:28:48 pm »
The Thing/181 Diff your hear of is a ZF Limited Slip Diff...
I have one of those in my Race Tranny, got luck finding one, they are pretty rare and expensive...
They have only been installed in some Civilian 181's...
Frank
Logged
1960 Ragtop, 2332cc, 48 IDA's, Joe Hunt Magneto, someday it will be back...
1953 Split Window, 1799cc, 48 IDA's, Don Zig Magneto, OG BRM's...in da works...
SumFun Racecar, 2332cc, 48 IDA's, Magneto
Zach Gomulka
Hero Member
Posts: 6992
Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining.
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #2 on:
November 09, 2007, 17:06:54 pm »
Keep the 4.12 r+p to help get the heavy type 3 out of the hole. A 3.78, 2.06 mainshaft is a wise investment, much stronger than the 3.80. 1.26 3rd, .89 4th.
Logged
Born in the '80s, stuck in the '70s.
nicolas
Hero Member
Posts: 4014
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #3 on:
November 09, 2007, 18:21:07 pm »
Quote from: Zach Gomulka on November 09, 2007, 17:06:54 pm
Keep the 4.12 r+p to help get the heavy type 3 out of the hole. A 3.78, 2.06 mainshaft is a wise investment, much stronger than the 3.80. 1.26 3rd, .89 4th.
i thought about that, but where can i find the parts? or do i need a second transmission to pull it from? i have thought earlier about getting closer ratios but it will probally kill the fun in long distance driving... so it will be a stockish setup. but stronger, way stronger.
Quote from: Frank LUX on November 09, 2007, 15:28:48 pm
The Thing/181 Diff your hear of is a ZF Limited Slip Diff...
I have one of those in my Race Tranny, got luck finding one, they are pretty rare and expensive...
They have only been installed in some Civilian 181's...
Frank
so it is really a ZF?? wow that sounds great, but yes finding one seems to be a pretty big quest. but i will look around and otherwise i have to buy something aftermarket, but i don't know what and where. any leads?
thanks
Logged
Zach Gomulka
Hero Member
Posts: 6992
Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining.
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #4 on:
November 09, 2007, 18:28:23 pm »
The 3.78 mainshaft came in late type 1 style gearboxes (I think 1973+), any place that does VW transaxles can set you up with one.
Logged
Born in the '80s, stuck in the '70s.
too old for this
Full Member
Posts: 145
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #5 on:
November 09, 2007, 19:13:28 pm »
Quote from: nicolas on November 09, 2007, 18:21:07 pm
Quote from: Zach Gomulka on November 09, 2007, 17:06:54 pm
Keep the 4.12 r+p to help get the heavy type 3 out of the hole. A 3.78, 2.06 mainshaft is a wise investment, much stronger than the 3.80. 1.26 3rd, .89 4th.
i thought about that, but where can i find the parts? or do i need a second transmission to pull it from? i have thought earlier about getting closer ratios but it will probally kill the fun in long distance driving... so it will be a stockish setup. but stronger, way stronger.
Quote from: Frank LUX on November 09, 2007, 15:28:48 pm
The Thing/181 Diff your hear of is a ZF Limited Slip Diff...
I have one of those in my Race Tranny, got luck finding one, they are pretty rare and expensive...
They have only been installed in some Civilian 181's...
Frank
so it is really a ZF?? wow that sounds great, but yes finding one seems to be a pretty big quest. but i will look around and otherwise i have to buy something aftermarket, but i don't know what and where. any leads?
thanks
an alternative is the Quaiffe (torque biasing differential) uk company about 550 pounds +vat,but for some totally weird reason they are cheaper in the states
Logged
JG54
Bruce
Hero Member
Posts: 1420
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #6 on:
November 10, 2007, 01:40:00 am »
Quote from: nicolas on November 09, 2007, 13:22:20 pm
....the mods we are thinking of is:
welded 3th and 4th
superdiff
thick sideplates
it will be a stock geared transmission from a type3
What year is the trans you will be digging into? Swing or IRS?
Logged
nicolas
Hero Member
Posts: 4014
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #7 on:
November 10, 2007, 07:49:24 am »
it is a 67 type3 unit with swingaxles. i think i have to locate another one with the throwout piece and a 3.78 first gear. but i can't find the proper pieces at an affordable price at the moment. if i add up all the parts i need i am not far from the price of an outright highwaycruiser transaxle...
but i just am curious to rebuild it and make it work. but since this one is allready out i thought of modding it to a stronger one and swapping it with the one that is under the car at the moment.
Logged
Bruce
Hero Member
Posts: 1420
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #8 on:
November 10, 2007, 12:31:21 pm »
Drag racing? Slicks? Hp?
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Frank LUX
Hero Member
Posts: 1886
Back...Soon...hopefully!!!
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #9 on:
November 10, 2007, 12:44:52 pm »
Quote from: Bruce on November 10, 2007, 12:31:21 pm
Drag racing? Slicks? Hp?
Hi Bruce,
Are you the one who rebuilds ZF Diffs???
Frank
Logged
1960 Ragtop, 2332cc, 48 IDA's, Joe Hunt Magneto, someday it will be back...
1953 Split Window, 1799cc, 48 IDA's, Don Zig Magneto, OG BRM's...in da works...
SumFun Racecar, 2332cc, 48 IDA's, Magneto
nicolas
Hero Member
Posts: 4014
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #10 on:
November 10, 2007, 21:30:11 pm »
Quote from: Bruce on November 10, 2007, 12:31:21 pm
Drag racing? Slicks? Hp?
no slicks. maybe some lager 185 or 195 tires on short shafts, but for now 165/80/15
and i hope to have 140 hp and i just talked to a headporter today who really opened my eyes and said it could be done. i only need to build it right and it should be able to reach 150-160hp.
that has been a very nice talk. i only need to be very well prepared as there are some issues i have to deal with.
as for the gearbox. i hope to be able to find a keyed 3;78 first gear. and a superdiff. all the rest will stay the same. pretty stock configuration will be best for the planned use i guess???
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JS
Hero Member
Posts: 1628
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #11 on:
November 11, 2007, 11:40:19 am »
as for the gearbox. i hope to be able to find a keyed 3;78 first gear. and a superdiff. all the rest will stay the same. pretty stock configuration will be best for the planned use i guess???
I have run a OG 1300S box at the strip all summer with my 2276 and no problems. The trick is to stay away from slicks and use a sensible clutch disc.
I am not trying to imply that it's an ideal solution, but it works and it's cheap.
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Signature.
nicolas
Hero Member
Posts: 4014
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #12 on:
November 11, 2007, 19:31:08 pm »
what is a good disc? i used my stock non-spring disc in my 1641 and it was good, but it is not ideal for more power. the flywheelside is pretty much gone after Bitburg... it is probally my inexperience in dragracing, but i heard about berg having a superstreet disc with 2 different materials..?? or what else is good?
Logged
Bruce
Hero Member
Posts: 1420
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #13 on:
November 11, 2007, 21:30:13 pm »
Quote from: nicolas on November 10, 2007, 21:30:11 pm
i hope to be able to find a keyed 3;78 first gear. and a superdiff. all the rest will stay the same. pretty stock configuration ...
With the 9 tooth mainshaft, have the syncro hubs welded to their gears for 3rd and 4th. Use hardened keys for the 3-4 shift hub and 4th gear. Replace the brass 1-2 fork with a steel one. I wouldn't bother with the heavy duty side cover, stock will be fine.
You must make sure the installed engine/trans does not cause any wheel hop.
Logged
Zach Gomulka
Hero Member
Posts: 6992
Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining.
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #14 on:
November 11, 2007, 23:04:01 pm »
If you drag race it, pre-load the trans with the parking brake when you launch.
Logged
Born in the '80s, stuck in the '70s.
nicolas
Hero Member
Posts: 4014
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #15 on:
November 12, 2007, 08:38:54 am »
Quote from: Bruce on November 11, 2007, 21:30:13 pm
You must make sure the installed engine/trans does not cause any wheel hop.
thanks for the advice. i have heard before that it really is the wheelhop that kills the transmission in most cases... so i have to look out for that.
Quote from: Zach Gomulka on November 11, 2007, 23:04:01 pm
If you drag race it, pre-load the trans with the parking brake when you launch.
how do i do that. remember i am a dummy at dragracing. i only raced once...
Logged
Zach Gomulka
Hero Member
Posts: 6992
Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining.
Re: needles in my eyes: transmissions
«
Reply #16 on:
November 12, 2007, 16:57:46 pm »
At the start line in first gear, bring up the revs, pull up the parking brake with the button depressed and let out the clutch a bit until you feel the rear end squat down just a little. If the car rolls forward you let the clutch out too far. This will take out the slack in between the gears so they dont slam against each other. When you launch you have to simutaniously release the parking brake, drop the clutch, and mash the gas.
Logged
Born in the '80s, stuck in the '70s.
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