Jordy's Weekend Warrior engine... 1914/2165cc??

[Jordy/DVK]

 
*edit* renamed the topic

I have been thinking about builiding my own engine. For most of you this is an easy 'been here, done that' story. I know exactly how everything works (in theory), but I have never ever actually split an engine case. I'm thinking about building a 1776 or 1914 engine. A nice engine to be able to use on the strip, but more important easy to handle/cruise in daily traffic...
 I've already ordered the books "Hot-rodding the VW engine" and "How to rebuild your VW engine" to start with...

 My intentions for this topic are a bit twofold. Firstly I like to know how and when you id start? When did you (re)build your own engine for the first time? What parts/displacement did you choose? What mistakes did you make? And secondly what tips/hints would you give to people who are a little hesitant to build their own engine?

 I'm not interested in purely technical things but more in a mix with personal stories...
 
 Thanks! Jordy...

[Roman]

Add one more book: The Bentley manual. You have all measurments you will ever need for the engine and then some!

My first rebuild was in 8:th grade in tech class. My teacher was a VW freak so when it was time to learn how an engine worked, he got an oildripper that we more or leess tore apart and put together again but with new bearings and gaskets.
When I was 21-22 or so I bought parts for my first tuned engine (late 80's), a 1914. I put it together with the "OK do it your self handbook for VW" (OK is a gas company in Sweden). There were no major problems with the engine.

Just use common sense and read some quality books and you will find it very easy to get those first 100+ hp. The more power you want to have the more complicated it will be so a 1776 or 1914 will be a good start. I guess many people read magazines and think 200+ hp is a must, but I can assure you 100 hp with a 4.375 R/P makes acceleration like a 250 hp "normal" car.
If you are not into drag racing 160-170 hp in a stroker engine is more than enough and you have an engine that will have rather normal service interval. It is more fun to have a 170 hp engine fully working than 240 hp in parts on your work bench...

[Jordy/DVK]

When I was 21-22 or so I bought parts for my first tuned engine (late 80's), a 1914. I put it together with the "OK do it your self handbook for VW" (OK is a gas company in Sweden). There were no major problems with the engine.

 That's where I am now (age 22) and I'd like to get more into engine building. I also wanted to start with a 1914 engine.
 As I said I'm a bit hesitant. I don't want to spend big money on an engine to blow it in 2 weeks...

 Thanks for the story!!

[Georg/DFL]

Hi Jordy,

there are so many things you can do wrong! Very important: Always work concentrated!

Here is a littel story that cost me quite a lot of money:
When I first split my 1776 (wich I didn't build by myself) just to put in a W120 and straight cut Magnums I didn't work as concentrated as I should have. The problem arose when I put the halfs back together – I had no clue if I had to put O-rings over the four shuffle pins or not. I knew that the two normal case studs need them, but the shuffle pins? I just couldn't remember if I removed some or not when I split the case. In the end I put O-rings on all six studs/shuffle pins. After I put the halfs together and tighten everything I had to stop working at my engine for some four days or so. When I started to mount the flywheel seal it just went in – usualy you have to use a hammer! So what happend?

To cut a long story short because of the O-rings over the shuffle pins (just four little O-rings) the whole case was twisted and had to be line bored! You can imagine how happy I was!

I would recomend splitting an old case and putting it back together a few times before you start on a 1776 or 1914. That's good practice and it doesn't matter if you brake something.

[Jon]

Hi Jordy,

I don't think you should worry to much, if you got the books, and this forum ;-) , it should be no harder than following a coocking recepie...  What I have found out during my builds, is that you need a friend that can machine for you.

And, get a new engine block when you start out... preferebly one ready for the sylinders/crank you want to use...  I know I am... next time ;-)

- It's always better to measure one thing to many, than one thing to little...

[SilverPig]

Just remember that there is a difference between ASSEMBLING an and BUILDING an engine. I would practice on a less expensive engine before fucking up something that could have been avoided with some experience.

[Jordy/DVK]

hey Jordy, found this old post and wondered how your project turned out? Did you build something?

 
 Hey Jim!!

 Thanks for bringing up this topic. Unfortunately I have to say I haven't started building any engine yet. Due to some changes in my life that required some funding, my budget for an hi-3po engine shrank to $0,-   
 Let's hope my budget will allow me to build a nice 1915 this winter...
 

[yvre]

Hot VWs also did a nice series of articles a few years ago - Engine Blueprinting Basics.
Deano wrote them if I remember correctly.

[Jordy/DVK]

 Last monday I bought a set 043 heads with 42x37,5 valves set up for 94mm barrels.
 They're 2nd hand unused and bought at Aircooled.net. (I heard Darren Gurola DRD is their head guy isn't it?)
  >> http://aircooled.net/new-bin/viewproductdetail.php?keyword2=EHD0024&cartid=
 
 Are the valves used in these heads any good? Any advice on new springs?

 I will be building an engine around these heads...
 I think I'm going for something like the famous "Zach-Gomulka's-Friend"-engine...

• 1915cc (94x69)
• 42x37,5 heads
• stock rods
• Engle FK-8
• 1:1,4 rockers
• Cromemoly

[Jordy/DVK]

 I'm going to order some more parts for my engine next week, but I need some advice. (changing my mind again)

 I'm thinking of going for a 78mm crank instead of a 69mm. ( 2165cc instead of 1914cc)
 Is that feasible with those 42x37,5 heads? What peak RPM can I expect, considering the heads will be ported. (no welding)

 I know bigger engines live easier lives, but I don't want it to drive like a Diesel. (low rpms)

 Would a 2165cc, (H-beam), 78mm CB crank, 94mm mahles, WebCam 86c, 1,4:1 rockers be a good combo?
 
 And for a 78mm i need b pistons right? And what length rods? 5,4"?
 
 

[Zach Gomulka]

Sounds like a stout combo. What is the difference between the 86b and 86c?
Use 5.4" rods and B pistons. The heads should work great.

My friend Chris "Fruitcake" King is in Hawaii until December. Soon as he gets back Ill get him on this forum!

[Diederick/DVK]

jordy, i can't wait to see you finish that 1915/fk8 combo!
so we can race our 1915s a.s.a.p. and have fun.

i reckon a stroker will cost you a lot of extra time and money to build.
why not have more fun on the short term?

just my thoughts...

[Bewitched666]

Jordy the heads you bought would go on a 1915 engine but you need alot of carb to run them to make them work optimally.
Idem for the 2165 engine.

For a 78 crank the 5.4 conrods will be ok although i have run that crank with stock lenght rods and yes run the b type pistons for more sideload relief.

But my 2 cents is since your building your first engine go with the 1915cc engine,like one said before a 120hp 1915 will kill any v-8 or golf gti etc on the streets.

The bigger stroker engine requiers more insight in engine building as the stroke is bigger en you need to adjust deckheight etc but thats my 2 cents.

Anyway go with what you feel will be best for you and your wallet and goodluk with building it maat.

[Jordy/DVK]

What is the difference between the 86b and 86c?

86b   300º   260º   0.575"   14.61   108º   
86c   310º   272º   0.585"   14.86   108º
source: http://actionimport.com/Tech_Files/cam_information.htm

jordy, i can't wait to see you finish that 1915/fk8 combo!
i reckon a stroker will cost you a lot of extra time and money to build.

That 1915/fk8 combo sounds awesome, but it's maybe a little too much of a "screamer" for me.
And I don't think a 2165cc will cost so much extra since the heads are the only parts that would require an upgrade when going for more cc.
Since I already have the heads the rest will not make that much difference in price anymore. (maybe $100 on the crank, that's it)

Jordy the heads you bought would go on a 1915 engine but you need alot of carb to run them to make them work optimally.
Idem for the 2165 engine.

I don't think the heads are too big for the engine capacity. 2165cc is a nice displacement for 42x37,5 heads.
Jim Ratto and Tobias Pleines both run larger valves (44mm) on their 2165/2176 engines.
Since Tobias car is an all-out racer I think my heads will suffice for a hot street/mild strip engine.

[Bewitched666]

Oh ok Jordy,i thought your were going to build a 1915cc engine,
no if you go with the 2165 then the heads will work great,slap some big carbs on it and you will fly if you hav ethe correct combo with the gearbox,

Didnt know aircooled.net selled secondhand stuff,have to take a look then

[Jordy/DVK]

Didnt know aircooled.net selled secondhand stuff,have to take a look then

 LOL! no I bought the heads from someone who got them from AirCooled.net
 they don't sell 2nd hand stuff
 

[Bewitched666]

My mistake