New Project! Karmann Cabrio...

[Lids]

you are a brave man, looks like too much work

[Neil Davies]

Sounds like you're having an uphill struggle at the moment Neil! Nice work though.

you are a brave man, looks like too much work

I'm actually really enjoying it! Really looking forward to getting the back end off the old car and onto the new one though. Think I'll get some new bits welded in before it goes off for stripping though - I known its rotten in certain places so it'll at least give some strength rather than risking it all coming back as a big box of seperate panels... Gives me chance to save up some cash to have it done too. Worst bit is repairing other peoples bodges - the floorpan being welded to the heater channels through the bolt holes being the prime example! However, at least that means that the channels are in the right place for when I get the backe end on, rather than just floating in the breeze! When the back is properly in place I'll brace the shell, then cut out the welded areas, putting new channel bottoms on when I add the strengtheners. I can repair a couple more areas of the channels then!

[Neil Davies]

What did I say about enjoying myself? The back end of the karmann, on closer inspection, is absolutely rotten. If I try to cut it away it will probably collapse, and the filler is so thick in places that the dip stripping process won't shift it. So I've not really done anything in September at all, other than start the repair on the RH top hinge - because VW fitted the doors before the cars were painted, I've seen a hell of a lot of cars that are actually pretty bad around the hinges. Often sloppy hinge pins get the blame, but check to see if the hinge moves in the body too...

What I've spent most time on is to find someone breaking a '74 bug, which is actually pretty solid, and more importantly, has never really been repaired. I've agreed a price to take the back of the shell, which I'll remove the heater channels from, then weld in place onto the channels of the green '68, using the Karmann doors to gap it all up!  Yes, I know that it'll merely take it back to being what I had when I bought the green '68 donor car, but I didn't think that the karmann back was so bad...  Once that is in place then I'll start to carve up the karmann back end piece by piece - under seat strengtheners, inner quarters, quarter tops etc.

It'll get there eventually!

[jamiep_jamiep]

Sorry to hear about finding more rust Neil.... I know how that feels!!!

[kraftwerk]

the driveway where the volksrod was looks very famiar...lad named ben in stafford?? i went to look at the welding job on that bug, and walked away....so you got work on your hands i know!! well done for perseverence!!! you must have a very calm methodical aproach to it, i would have just scrapped the donor and looked for another!! Keep it up dude, you'll get there in the end!......welded floorpans through the bolt holes...ouch, not pretty!!!! good luck, its gonna be a good one(in the end!!)

cheers

Lee(Jamies..aka 'Kaferboy's brother)

[Neil Davies]

the driveway where the volksrod was looks very famiar...lad named ben in stafford?? i went to look at the welding job on that bug, and walked away....so you got work on your hands i know!! well done for perseverence!!! you must have a very calm methodical aproach to it, i would have just scrapped the donor and looked for another!! Keep it up dude, you'll get there in the end!......welded floorpans through the bolt holes...ouch, not pretty!!!! good luck, its gonna be a good one(in the end!!)

cheers

Lee(Jamies..aka 'Kaferboy's brother)

Hi Lee, you're right, it was that car! When I went to look at it first it was to cut the dash out of it, but it's more solid than the Karmann so I decided to go for the whole car. At that point I hadn't spotted the floor being welded to the channels... I thought that the reason the body wouldn't come off was the old favourite of jacking points being welded to the bottom of the channels! Oh well... TBH, most of the repairs are fairly easy, front clip, front quarters, bulkhead etc, but the back is a little trickier. When the body is all solid I'm bracing it up, then cutting the bottom of the heater channels out and replacing them with genuine VW ones. There are some horrible repairs though - if it wasn't for the 30 years of history then I'd have chopped it up too. It was cheap though! I've seen a '68 Karmann cab on thesamba for $4200 (£2500 in real money) and I've probably spent that much already on this pile!

[simon uk]

sounds rough (and familiar!) have you managed to salvage all the bracing panels for this one? I mean the curved pieces under the back seat, and ontop of the heater channels, connecting into the A post. From what I recall, the cross members are the same as a normal bug, and most other bug repair panels will also fit - ie rear 3/4 panel sections and bumper mounts etc. The welded strentheners bring back nightmares!

[Neil Davies]

Got another couple of pics...

The front end one shows the door mocked up before I reskinned it, the windscreen frame in place although I'm not welding it until the rest of the car is built, and the front wheel well finished. The back end shows the '74 with a simple repair on the body mount done (water had got trapped between the mount panel, the quarter and the lip of the bootfloor, so I had to repair all three skins!) and the lower quarter still to do.



I'm hoping to get the welding on the back end finished soon, then maybe get the back end onto the rest of the car by Christmas. I've got 2 1/2 days after I break up before my girlfriend does, so I'll spend that in the garage! Then in the new year I'll start Karmann-izing it!

[FIDDE]

Nice project its very important that you get the door gaps right, so you can open the doors
when you have  closed the top,but maybe you knew that already.I have almost a similar project
in front of me.Here is a picture of my 67.

/F

[jamiep_jamiep]

I think I'm gonna have nightmares after seeing those pics Fidde!

[Neil Davies]

Nice project its very important that you get the door gaps right, so you can open the doors
when you have  closed the top,but maybe you knew that already.I have almost a similar project
in front of me.Here is a picture of my 67.

/F

Hey, I'm not the only mental one restoring a basket case!  

One thing I've worked out about the doors is to load them up with all the glass, winders, quarter lights etc to make sure they've got the right amount of "sag" on them when they are open and closed, that'll help me get the back end lined up right. I found out loads of stuff about the windscreen frame too...

[Antilogic]

looks better than the 67 project I just sold!!

[Neil Davies]

Got the blue sedan back end repairs finished, so decided it was time to crack on with disassembly of the donor car! The blue back end was put up on the mezzanine with the (seized solid) hood frame, and the Karmann was wheeled in to be attacked with an air chisel and a crowbar!

30 minutes later whats left of the car went back outside:


And after another fairly relaxed hour of stripping the loom, sound deadening and seals out, the back end is ready to start cutting away all the Beetle bits, levaing just the Karmann metal behind! That'll be an interesting couple of weeks...

[Stefan Rossi]

looking good dude! got ya work cut out for yourself!

cabs are class i want one for my next project!

good luck

stef

[Black Sheep]

Blimey Neil looks like we both got our work cut out here , race yo to the finish 

[Neil Davies]

Blimey Neil looks like we both got our work cut out here , race yo to the finish 

I've had a little setback - the icy weather froze and then burst the pipes in my unit!

Still, attacked the back end - got the paint stripped from all the areas I suspected there were original Karmann welds, gently using a blowtorch and a scraper then wire brushing it off - it's amazing how the welds show up. Unlike an early Karmann, the welds are simply metal finished, not leaded. The only lead I found was on the engine bay seal strip and on the B-pillar where the Karmann top joins the VW pillar. Note the spare top section from a '68 cab - I discovered that the seatbelt mounts are further back on a '70 by about 150mm!

Now, a close up of original Karmann welds on LHS rear quarter - no lead, just linished smooth. Unfortunately then dented to buggery and covered in plod, but at least it's only the VW bit thats knackered!


Finally, a nice view of inside the back seat area, showing whats left of the heater channel. It'll have the spot welds drilled out to seperate the Karmann inner quarter from the VW outer quarter. I've since taken off the curved strengthener in the bottom left hand side of the picture, and although the B-post is mainly rust and fibreglass on this side, at least under the strengthener seems OK!


Half term next week so if I get a good week on it I might have this lot split into its seperate pieces!

[Neil Davies]

Half term next week so if I get a good week on it I might have this lot split into its seperate pieces!

Got it split up already! Photos later, but basically, cut the brace under the back seat out (on a diagonal so that it can be welded back in easily), split through the back of the side sections and lifted off each complete side. Then I used the air chisel to remove the boot floor and inner arches, leaving the engine bay and firewall in one piece. Job done! Complete Karmann back end reduced to three chunks to keep (and cut down further) on and under the table in the workshop!

Anton and Joe, when you see the pictures you'll not believe what I've done!

[Neil Davies]

As promised, more photos...

First up is the inside of the back end, Saturday morning. Doesn't look too bad, but I only need the Karmann metal.

With the quarters chopped away, I decided to leave the firewall and engine bay in one piece. I still had to cut through the luggage floor and bodymount panels with an air chisel though. Well, most of the luggage floor pushed out with a small tap from a hammer... The inner wings were covered entirely with a 2mm skim of filler.

Finally, took the outer quarter off. I drilled out all of the spot welds on the inside, then opened up the seam down the door post. Cutting with a 1mm disc below the Karmann welds got rid of most of the outer quarter. Need to repeat it for the othe side now!

[Black Sheep]

Hats off to you neil , my car lloks like a walk in the park compaired to what your going through , ready for sandown park then 

[Neil Davies]

Hats off to you neil , my car lloks like a walk in the park compaired to what your going through , ready for sandown park then 

Well, we're aiming for VoWo 2011... Pretty soon it should start coming together!

[Wout]

Good luck! There's allmost no car left for the moment  .
I can't wait to see the end result!

gr
Wout

[Neil Davies]

Good luck! There's allmost no car left for the moment  .
I can't wait to see the end result!

gr
Wout

The nice thing about doing it myself is that I know it'll be done right! I'm a bit of a stickler for details, so I'm trying to build the car like Karmann would have done! Basically all that's worth saving of the original car is the Karmann-only stuff, and even that needs work!

[jamiep_jamiep]

You're doing well there Neil bearing in mind the basket case you started with! Oh to live in the cali sunshine eh?!

[Neil Davies]

You're doing well there Neil bearing in mind the basket case you started with! Oh to live in the cali sunshine eh?!

It would be nice! Mind you, it'd just mean that my workshop would be warmer, not that I'd stop buying shit cars!

[Black Sheep]

You're doing well there Neil bearing in mind the basket case you started with! Oh to live in the cali sunshine eh?!

It would be nice! Mind you, it'd just mean that my workshop would be warmer, not that I'd stop buying shit cars!

Amen to that