The Cal-look Lounge

Please don't shoot me  :D, this is just an observation i have made that maybe totally incorrect, but i just thought it might be worth getting some other peoples points of view on it.....

As the aforementioned title suggests, after reading Russels post describing the lack of enthusiasm that we are currently seeing in our hobby, it got me thinking about what could be the reason for the the down turn of interest in creating these 13sec 1/4 - Drag racing inspired machines., could it be the cost? If so why? because as far as i'm aware, an air ride system with the latest in trend wheels and a shock-tower less beam could buy you a decent spec'd 1776/2110cc motor?

I think the problem could be to do more with age? I as a young Cal-look nerd I seem to be a rarity in my local area and to be fair i'm very lucky to live in the location i do, Stoke-on-trent in the UK must be one of, if not the most densely populated areas in the uk for cal-look beetles ( i maybe wrong so don't shoot me  :D ;D ). There must be at least 20 Cal-look bugs in the area, ranging from my humble 2276cc street car to Ritche Moss's (Lil stink hound on here) 11sec N/A car, to John Rathbones full on Pro Mod'esk race car.

As youngster I was highly influenced by this but only by chance encounter, bumping into a Jamie Plamer (kaferboy on here) in the local shop car park in his 63 bug, who encouraged me to come along to a meet where i was mesmerised by John walkletts 11 sec nirto's fuel injected street car, Poe's (66racer on here) 66 12sec street car and Crazy Donges 2110 daily driver that he proceeded to power slide around the roundabout that the pub car park was situated on.

If this chance encounter had not accrued I'm not sure i would have been taken by the way of the Cal-look, as my mates were more into modern cars, classic mini's and slammed vw's, as this is what is portrayed in the main stream magazines and on social networking sites such as Facebook.

Cal-look has been described to me by my slammed vw mates, of which i have many as an "old man's hobby", this has no offence intended, but thats just the way it is seen by some. Hot Aircooled Vw's are no longer featured in magazines such as VW Performance, only watercoold 400hp daily driver golf GTi's, but this is progress. Where as slammed tatty aircooled vw's buses and bugs are everywhere!

I help organise the UK Cal-look Drag and our Local Club the Rennwagens. I'm officially the youngest member of the club (thats prospect or full member). At the Cal-look drag day event which we hold every year i can think of only 2 other guys that are around my age that race. Why is this? As i have mentioned before it can't just be a cost thing? Has the hobby acquired an unjustified stigma of the older owner, as hot vw's for daily use just aren't as practical, reliable or as fast as the watercooled generation. Should we just embrase our new found position and encourage younger people by spreading the word of the Cal-look Hot Vw on social networking sites and move with progress, the lounge will never die but maybe it can become a book of knowledge to the new younger generation to look to for guidance as it did me?

Im not saying our hobby is dead, far from it, it just maybe needs to head in a different direction.......

So just out of interest lets see how old everyone is? As this post maybe utter bull shit and i'm talking out of my arse hahaha  :D ;D


Im 26 and run a 2276cc motor in a 66 bug capable of low- mid 13sec 1/4's.      

I'll be 34 in two weeks. I've always felt that I am on the younger side of the Cal Look hobby, even more so as time goes by. It is what it is.

32  ;D
Life changes have slowed my car hobby down. A 4 year old son, my wife and I working full time manager roles means spare time is a rarity and no garage at home.

Peach, Im 31 now and have drove Cal Lookers since I was 18.

None of my VW mates were into Cal Look. A couple were into fast VWs but not necessarily Cal Look. It didn't bother me. Most my 'normal' mates didn't understand why I liked Beetles at all haha.

The age thing I think is because its cheaper to build a lowered Beetle than a 'proper' Cal Look.

When I was 18/19 I was rockin my 68 with a 1300 single port on its last legs with a single quiet pack, lowered beam and repro Rivieras. Felt like a bit of a tit driving a Beetle with a fairly 'sporty' sounding exhaust built in a style that was supposed to be fast, but it as slower than pretty much everything else on the road.

Even though I wanted a fast Cal Looker, I could see the attraction of a resto cal style Beetle - cheap to build, cheap to run, get just as much attention at the local VW club meet etc. Maybe would get more attention as thats what the others seemed to be doing too, prob for the same reasons.

So, I dont think its an age thing to be honest, I think its about the budget. To build a nice proper Cal Look is more expensive than a nice really low air ride style Beetle... they cost more to run, more work to maintain, and cost more to insure. And lets face it, big engine Cal Lookers dont make the best daily drivers, or do long journeys very well.

Peach, you've hit the nail on the head pretty much. Cal lookers aren't featured as much - since Ivan handed over Volksworld there hasn't been a Cal Look issue. They're expensive to build and the economy hasn't helped. Then there's life getting in the way - younger folk will naturally have more time but less cash, and as your disposable income rises houses, wives and children come along or jobs simply take up more of your time (I spend every evening and weekend doing extra work for my job). BTW I'm 37 with a wife and my first child on the way. No more racing for me...
The one thing that no-one has mentioned is the expectation that people put on themselves. Back in the mid 90s when I turned 17 a late 60s/early 70s wrongun could be build easily enough, painted cheaply and have a 1776 that ran 14s and you were pretty hardcore. Stroker motors were 2007 or 2165 and may have run into the low 13s, but 12 second street cars were really rare. Nowadays the quality of cars has increased as has the speed - 10 sec street cars are achievable easily if you've got the money. Does the young kid with his first bug look at that and get put off by the commitment to building up to that point?

Im 50.
I have been into aircooled for 30 years, first resto cal while living in the UK, then just under 20 years with split screen kombis.
After selling my last splittie I decided to build another beetle, its a lot cheaper than restoring a split!
So its not the cost!
I like doing things to the best of my abilities and wallet, to me it has to look nice as the main thing, that is why I do not like this trend of "patina" vehicles or to use the correct word "RUST".

I do believe the magazines are promoting this as nearly every car lately is a "patina" vehicle.
I cant imagine ten years ago a shitty split screen, with rust and dents  being on the cover of Volksworld?

I am now trying to get the "Look" right, i cant afford genuine stuff so am going with repo BRM's.
So I am 50 but new to the scene?

Divorced with two young daughters so I only get to spend every other Saturday on the beetle, its taken over two years but its now in paint, i do everything myself and its now rolling but have the interior and motor to do
I dont know how long it will take but it will get there eventually

 
I'm 54 and been in and around VW's since about 17 years old.

In my opinion Volksworld had become the most stale of publications, with a 'same old same old' feel to it. Don't get me wrong I love to see great Cal-Lookers.. but every month? Every Cover?  ???

There needs to be more cross-over and unity in the VW Scene and this to me is what is missing currently.

If it were possible to 'bottle' what happens at EBI and condense that into a magazine things might change for the better. All walks of VW's come together at EBI and every model and condition is accepted and enjoyed without question or division.

I've a project in my workshop currently and haven't touched it for months now. That's probably to do with age and health more than anything, but I'm certainly not buzzing to get it finished by any means.

Looking forward to Volksworld and EBI to give me back some Mojo..

 

45 - Wife, two children, hefty mortgage living in London.  Working full time, studying part time for a Masters degree.

Got into the scene about 1994, built my car whilst living at home and working at the local supermarket whilst at college.

Moved into my current house 10 years ago, downsized the garage and this is a real pain.  Can only really work on the car when it is sunny.

Spent the last ten years collecting parts for the engine (very expensive) and replacement parts to redo the car.

Almost all of my money has been spent on renovating the house and I even told the missus the new engine cost £1000.!!!!

I make plans to work on the car, and then this time gets eaten into, so its very slow progress.

I'm 51 as of a week ago or so.

I'm fairly certain I was conceived in my Opa's (dad's side) panel Kombi workvan, and my favourite memory from when I was a little one was sitting in my Nanna's (mum's side) Karmann Ghia watching her scarf blow around as she waved to all her friends (royally I might add!  :D) as she drove to church. I got a '59 Beetle when I could drive, but my first quick one of my own was a mid-14sec Squareback in the early 80s.

I have an old VW that I'm playing with very slowly. I could probably justify buying most things for it and it really should have been finished 2 years ago (I've had it 3 years now), but I prefer doing it myself, for me it's a sideline nowadays to de-stress in the workshop after my work cycle. I have 2 little boys now as well, so part of the fun is getting them into it too.

(http://i1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc458/MODNROD/VW/P1020337_zpsfc9918ca.jpg) (http://s1212.photobucket.com/user/MODNROD/media/VW/P1020337_zpsfc9918ca.jpg.html)

This is the stuff I enjoy most about our hobby..........

(http://i1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc458/MODNROD/VW/Disassembled002_zps34bc609e.jpg) (http://s1212.photobucket.com/user/MODNROD/media/VW/Disassembled002_zps34bc609e.jpg.html)

(http://i1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc458/MODNROD/VW/Ouch1_zps1f0df57c.jpg) (http://s1212.photobucket.com/user/MODNROD/media/VW/Ouch1_zps1f0df57c.jpg.html)

I have a runabout work car that is nearly dead, so when it finally goes I've decided to get a runner ACVW, hopefully a Squareback as they're my favourite, so I'll have the workshop toy AND a daily!  8)

Have fun out there.

I'm 70 in a few weeks, run a  9 second car and have been into Cal Look for quite a few years. ;)

To add to the points above, its all about rebelling and not wanting to do the same as the generation before.  Who wants to be into the same thing as their parents ? Be it music, fashion and car styling. I also think there is a lot more emphasis on life style now. You can buy an old rust bucket, whack on some Rothink stickers, buy a Cool Flo hoodie and you're instantly part of a scene for very little money.  Just my observation over the years.

Do Cal-Lookers need big engines every time??
Isn`t the Look about the Styling, too?  ::)

I like the Look but still drive with 1200ccm because at the Moment there`s no Money to spend on the engine.
(I´m 27 btw)

45 - work and diy take my time and there's always something else that needs my cash.
Add that to selling a brilliant '67 a few years ago and price rises meaning my current bug cost the same but has less of everything means enthusiasm is low at present.

That said some of the build threads on here and other forums are inspirational so maybe I'll get my arse in gear this year.

i´m turning 52 tomorrow, doin the VW thing for 33 years now
(not much time with the job, the wife and three kids still at home)

I've been in to VW's since I was 19.....always loved them as growing up my Dad had two beetles- a 62 then a 72. I remember going everywhere in those cars with my mom and two sisters. I restored my first one when I was 19 (70 beetle). Got in to the American V8 stuff for a while then at 25 bought my 68 that I have restored and built a stout 2110 for. It took me 8 years to accumulate engine parts as I had gone back to school to get a second engineering degree while I was married with two small kids. Finally got the engine "done" 4 years ago and have been driving and having fun with the car since. I can say I don't have the money or time to race the car though I would love to.....

I'm 50 now and with work, two houses, two older kids and a new 8 month old I have limited time and money as well. I'm as enthusiastic as ever with Cal-Look VW's but it's not cheap to build a nice one even if you do it yourself. I live in Florida and there are not very many Cal-Look VW enthusiasts here, mostly slammed rusty beetle and buses which don't really do it for me. IMO most younger gen folks want the "latest" stuff, cars included. Hell, they can go get a used Subaru STI that already hauls ass, has air conditioning, a good stereo, is quiet, ect,ect and be part of the tuner "scene". It's way easier and instant gratification. From what I've seen young gen. don't want to spend lots of time building an old car - too much work and effort. IMO, To build a Cal-Look car you have passion for it which overtakes the work, effort, time and $$ factors.

Hey Peach, I'm 46 my first car at 17 was a stock '72 1300 Beetle. I've always loved them stock and modified and owned a bunch of different models from Ovals to Mexi's. Most people would tell you I'm passionate about them. I've also dipped my foot in the American V8 market with a '68 Chevy Nova and had fun with that. I love classic American cars and classic cars in general. I just find them all more aesthetically appealing to look at and drive. I've also driven and owned modern cars from sporty saloons to hot hatches and sports cars. All fun in their own way. But I always missed not owning or driving a classic. I also like tinkering which I am happy to do on old cars but open the bonnet of anything modern it's buried under plastic cowling and I wouldn't know where to start !  ;D

When I first started driving I too was the odd one out amongst my closer friends away from the VW scene who all drove fast fords and hot hatchbacks. I could appreciate those cars and their performance too but they just didn't inspire me to follow that path.  It may also be parental influence as my dad always loved Beetles and owned a few when I was a child and he also loved classic American cars and owned them when he lived in California in the 60's  :)

60 years old (plus a few months) and had a 'few' VWs in my time! For me, the journey is often better than the destination, which is why I have no interest in owning a car for 10, 15, 20 years etc. I love putting a car together, enjoying it for a while and then moving on to another. These days, due to divorces and life stuff, I now only have room in my life for one toy at a time. Loved my time with the Chop Top, rescuing it, giving it the recognition it deserves in this modern world, but felt too great a responsibility owning a piece of history that I didn't feel I had the right to change much. Loved my time with Bluey, too, adapting someone else's cast-off to create the 'Old School' (actually, it's new wave, really...) Looker, with five-speed, 2332 IDA motor, drive it with Dean Kirsten to EBI and then, to crown it all, take it across to the USA to join the rest of my DKP buddies for the club's 45th anniversary celebrations, and drive it to a Bug-In. THAT was cool. But once I came home, how could I ever match that again? I needed a new challenge, and set about building the Porsche I always wanted. What happens when that destination is finally reached, only time will tell. Until then, I get my kicks racing VWs a couple of times a year in the USA (thanks to Mike Hunsaker and Ron Fleming), as well stealing the keys to anything with wheels at EBI.  ;D

treads from 2007  ;)
http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php/topic,960.0.html (http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php/topic,960.0.html)

41 soon :D
into vw since 94 , started with a 74  restored to oldschool (look-a-like)66
buy my 61 n 97  and restored to  cal look & oldspeed way (it depend the engine  :D) 

Well age wise I've got you all beat.  I'll be 71 next month and still have my first air cooled Bug.  Bought it from the original owner in July of '84 and never looked back.  Cal-Look for me and the car doesn't get sold til I die.  The wife understands totally.  I am very lucky...!

52 this year.....first car a Golf  :o , second a Passat  :o, third a Scirocco  :o, fourth a Scirocco GTI......then bought a '71 1300 T1 as an MOT failure in 1986 for £50  :) ....restored it, stored it, restored it again a few years back and still have it....I'll never sell it, but am lucky enough to have other cars to drive every day, so the T1 is a weekend dry weather toy that gets hours of garage time most winters.....there is ALWAYS something to improve on it and this winter its got full sequential EFI with ITB's ...... who knows what next....its a great hobby.
Steve

33 next month. Seems that I'm a young blood :D
Full of ideas and projects for a long time but I made a side step of the hobby scene. I like to work on my cars, helping friends with their projects    but doesn't do as much shows is I used to. Can't understand the rats and hoodride thing and I'm more interested in the mechanical and technical thing.
I think lots of people see cal look as an extremely narrow minded way of modifying a vw. With too much codes and and very elitist. And that's quite true. The nicest cars are high money build. But maybe most people forget that cal look is also about the fun and a way of thinking/living made by young and a bit rebel teens in the 70's. They street raced their cars,did dumb things with, make road trips that gave them memories for a long time, They simply have fun. Now,lots of cal look are more trailer queen or strip beast,seeing very few street miles.

46 next month..... Oh it's sore....

Been in to VWs since I was a kid, had my first one at 16, thank goodness for herbie !

Had a few air cooled Vws in my time and they still seem to follow me home, again like herbie, anyway like a bottle of wine or a good lady they all mature with age and we all change, I appreciate more as I get older and enjoy the chase of finding restoring and bringing back to life some old forgotten and neglected VW.

My son of 13 has a beetle and loves the stories and scene, but peer pressure to buy a hot hatch must be very hard for both youth and our passion.

Youth of today have different values, look at cell phones they change them as much as they change there underware, they don't want to wait save or build a car they want to buy cool and accepted.

As long as we keep injecting passion to a few, cal look will survive, however the beetle scene used to be like the bus scene now, full of specialised cowboys.... No much owner youth gets fed up or can't afford as they are being ripped off frequently.

Also patina....... What a load of shit, it's good cars being left to get worse in the name of cool .

I think that's about the size of it

Having bought my bug back after eight years apart, I can confirm there are many "specialised" VW performance cowboys in the UK today. Some of modifications were shocking.  Its bad for the scene as the customers who weren't particularly mechanically minded didn't have a clue what lay beneath.

Truly inspirational! Thanks Donny.

Being 27 i'm one of the few 'young' guys with a cal-look car in the Netherlands but even the total number of cal-look cars is quite low. The patina car thing is stupid and I will never drive a beetle with a stock engine again when you can do this going to a meeting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNs7Urt1s60 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNs7Urt1s60)

peach 26 ...  :o i thought you only passed your driving test last year  :D

Really interesting point of view !

But in my area we are doing it upside down. We have two clubs around here, one is full of slammed beetles and busses driven by ~35 to 55 year old guys and the other one (our club, the RKC) is full of cal look driven by 23 to 34 year old guys !

But when we were younger we began in the vw world as fans of slammed and hoodride beetle... It is just a question of taste, trends and what your "most influent friends" push you into !  ;D

X 2  ;)

I am 44, love beetles since my teens.
Read a book and was hooked on The Look.
Have the same beele since 2000 was restored and put back on the road by 2004.

I somehow like old shit.
Always had old cars as daily driver old peugots, mercedes, alfas, always 25 years + cars.

Spot On!!

I'm 40 in a couple of months, jeez where did that go?

I've been in vw's and in particular fast vw's since i was 14 years old and watched Moody to a wheelie :)
I've tried to "grow up" and get it out of my system but it wont go. I'm currently building another racecar and cant wait to get back on the track

Meanwhile in the other side of the vw world, I've stopped buying volksworld because i hate rusty cars :(
 

20 years of VWs this year, restoration of car has gone bad, parts are crazy money nowadays, tired of parts everywhere in the house, ditched the gf because I could have more building time without her whining about me being under the car. The VW scene is a strange place to me nowadays, having come back last year, it's all lifestyle stuff!
But, I'll keep building my California look bug. I'm off to lead load the body now and dream of a day when the car is alive again.

I'm 58 , been into cars and bikes since I was 16 and have my 74 late callooker since 27 years.
It's become a regular drag racer with a 2185cc -180hp mill capable of running the 1/4 in a decent 12.8sec.
But it still is road registered and allows to enjoy me take a good nip of adrenaline now and again ...

Exactly, its all lifestyle, that is the main problem, people do it now because its either cool or a look not because they understand and love it, like the magazines and shops they all follow this grungie and patina (shit look)

Lets not shave, lets not cut our hair, lets not wash, lets not paint the car, lets get dreadlocks, let the rust get a better hold...... Don't get me started.

IN Fact a statement; I want to coin the phrase "Shit Look or SL" as this will ruin our hobby and cars; and as SL becomes the mainstream us normal VW guys will have the baggage to carry as we did in the late 80s and early 90s in the UK with BUGJAM. The investment we make in our cars should be rewarded not belittled, look at any classic car magazine and the value they give on our cars.... they are clueless as they all think they are POS.... they are not its just they always see the SL style.

In fact we should boycott all this crap with one exception "Hayburner Magazine" not my style but a great mag and a good read...., in fact wonder if they would do a Halo Style Mag with the best of the best VWs...... infact im going to call them.

Rant Over ! ;D

I'm 25 and have a 64 Callook :)
Bought it stock when I was 21. Still love it!

It's the only Callook here in the area (I think...). All my friends drive slammed bugs. I did to! Worked 3 years on my previous bug. Slammed it, drove it... And found it stupid. Not my cup of tea :)

It's a pity that there aren't any other callookers in the area!

Yannick
Belgium

In Belgium  Der Autobahn Scrapers, nothing un cal look about them.

We Should make some stickers saying "shine is not a crime", "horsepower is good for you"... Maybe it will attract people who dont want follow the main rust/dirty scrapyard look stream ;D ::) :P
I saw too much good solid cars at shows that are litterally killed by rust because the owner found this the only way to look cool... yep,it's harder to grab a welder and work to put the car back in good shape. Its a lazzy guy thing.
Rust is not a crime... my a**.

Where do you live, Yannick?
Feel free to stop by in Muizen!
There are 2 lookers living here (almost)

This is not at all unique to VWs. Nearly every automotive niche has a "SL" element with growing participation.

How classic car magazines value "our" cars is something entirely different; but I would suspect that in 2050, a 1990 Corolla -no matter how original it was restored or how custom it was modified- won't receive much attention, either.

The "shit look" has to do with money more than laziness. Should these people just fuck off and find a cheaper hobby? Just because their style doesn't interest you, doesn't mean they can't have fun, and isn't that what it is all about? We need more people in this scene, not less.

wonder where the name came from?   :-X

Just got 46. Read about Callook in the early 80´s and fell in love.
Didnt get my first bug until early 2000 though. Built a 62´and 66´ but never got to build a real Engine for any one of them beacuse of the cost and me not being an Engine guy.
I´m not into "shit lookers" (thanks Russell) so the Money got into body work and interior. I love design so thats why i only build "Callook style" :D
So they both ended up with 1600´s. In great shape that is but never the Engine i whant to have. Have three kids to feed.
Got hold of a one owner all original 66´in great shape a couple of years ago. A nice driver that i really dont want to screw up ex it´s in need of a repaint. Maybe some lowering spindles and BRM´s? And then the ball is Rolling again. Have accepted the fact that Engine is never to become a reality.
But the style of the cars and all friends that comes with it is something you can live on for a long time.
Keep on callookin guys. You give me something to live for every day.

Regards
Patrik

But do we want this type of person?

How many times have you seen features in magazines where the owner has said he poured sea water over the body to help it rust??
Will these get restored properly or just disgarded when they get too dangerous to drive?
I have seen it here where they get their Shit Looker on the road as cheap as they can, then try and sell it for big bucks as its the latest fad.
Restoring a vehicle no matter what make is not cheap, and people know that before they start, but if your going to do something do it properly.

One mans Patina is another mans Rust

quote author=Zach Gomulka link=topic=24257.msg316413#msg316413 date=1426267989]
The "shit look" has to do with money more than laziness. Should these people just fuck off and find a cheaper hobby? Just because their style doesn't interest you, doesn't mean they can't have fun, and isn't that what it is all about? We need more people in this scene, not less.
[/quote]

I don't totally agree. I'm the first to point that the fun is all about. Working on my car, on friends cars, going to shows or just cruising, spending hours on campground having some beers and bbq , looking at other cars at shows that either are cal look, resto cal or vintage, I like them all . Even patina one,but true patina....
I always respected others people, but, as I love those old cars and the scène that come with, I never understand why making a car rust to death with all kind of junks  pile on it make it cool. If it was something quite unique, I would find this fun. But a whole trend or movement based on that making a vw show looking like a scrapyard is something I dont understand.
Some people like radikalbugz over here in belgium put a lot of work on their cars making them quite unique.like them or not. But too much others try to copy them without the work that come behind.
Money? It would cost less to leave the car as it is. Put it on the ground if you want, paint the wheels pink if you like. it's up to you. That's what make the vw scène so interesting. People who make their car rust doesn't seems to care or be aware that it will cost a whole lot more of money to restore them.

I agree that no one wants an unsafe car on the road, same problem with the guys building rat rods over here. Rust that is through the metal on any part, be it structural or not, is not a good thing. Surface rust however, well I've got better things to worry about than how people are  "styling" their VW.
In my late teens and early 20's, I did my best to build a fast VW. I was obsessed with the traditional Cal Look. I had a rust free but ugly 67 sedan, so naturally what appealed to me was Mark Herbert's SSB. I wanted to play Cal Look too, so not having much money, I put what I did have into making it low in the front and fast as I could afford in the back. The result was a car that ran a best of 14.8 (with only 1600cc), but was an absolute fright to drive. The front suspension work was cheap, it was all I could afford, and rode like it had square wheels. The brakes were stock and not kept up with most of the time. I was young, dumb, and broke, and no one was going to tell me any other way to build my car. But it was very quick, for what it was!
I suppose what I'm saying is, that with limited funds I'd rather see a car that is safely modified, even if it is still slow and not Cal Look. I could care less about what it looks like. If the car is too low and/or too rotten and self destructing as a result, that's something that no one wants on the road. I could argue that too much HP with neglected suspension and brakes are much, much worse though. And you know that's exactly where the little money a teenager interested in Cal Look will go!!

Your right we do want all kinds to support or brand of car, whether its cal look, gasser, race, custom, resto csl, vintage, etc. I like it all

But and its a BIG BUT, some very unsafe and shit stuff is out there and they are talked up as being the next best thing, last year I remember reading A feature in one of the mags about  a van that caught fire, now that had happened to me before and its a sore experience,,,,, but to see a feature in print in a mag with burnt out seats and interior and charred paint.... That is way beyond cool

I see that having a strong view on a topic gets people involved so this is good, keep it comming

Now, another think I hate is crap race cars.. Anyone ?

Define Crap.

i think Russel means unsafe
just crappy looking cant be the point, just look at the SSB, its a legend...

Didn't Paul Rui, bury BRMs and rub the paint work with brake fluid on a split beetle to give it patina? But then again that car was a cool as fuck, and didn't qualify for rat look as it didn't have a rope around the bumper.
Having recently seen one of the magazine cars recently up close, utterly unsafe, wheel studs 5" long with spacers ripping themselves from drum, rear wheel bearings running dry, gear box side plates coming off due to such negative camber.
But it's cool as it was photo with some ugly bird with tattoos for the magazine ;)

I'm 45 this year and had the same bug since I was 16. Money to spend on my cars has always been hard to find, nearly as hard as finding time to work on them. I'm now at point in my life where I now have a little more of both time and money but the cars are currently less important than maybe they were in earlier years. Having said this I am planning a trip this year that will hopefully get my Mojo back.

With regards to the patina thing, I've stopped buying the vw mags as I'm truly fed up with the rusty bugs and busses featured.

 Not wanting to start an argument but I think there is a definite difference between a survivor car with faded paint and the intensional destruction of a car by rubbing off the paint and loading it with chain and ropes, never can see the logic in that.

The early " patina " show cars that I saw at the volksworld show were very detailed underneath and most importantly safe with decent naturally aged bodies. I don't attend many shows but at Ebi last time some of the cars that turned up that week, that by all accounts had been thrown out of Germany whilst attending a vintage meet were in my opinion total death traps.

The lack of a need for an annual inspection for pre 60 cars here in the UK whilst making it easier for the responsible vw owner has given the irresponsible few the excuse to run round in a car that should be nowhere near the road. But hey they look cool  ::)

Just because its a shiny car doesn't mean its 'all good' underneath.
How many shiny Volksworld feature cars have been re-done over the years to find several bodges

In my opinion if a car is well engineered and safe/drives well the paint is the icing on the cake. You can have nice icing but a shit cake

I better wait for years (and meanwhile drive it) for some expensive but good welding than make it myself and lose a lot of time for a crappy result...

Ahh and so we slowly draw you over to our dark side where you realise our values are the right values. Young men should take care in basic grooming (not the fag gilette and nivea type though) representing a stout appearance and behaviour, taking pride in things being done properly. Lost in the modern Brussel's lead, everybody has the right to express and your government does support your laziness and slag attitute live style, stopping you from taking responsibility and caring for your own life  ;)

Coming from anyone else this would be funny from you I'm worried..... We may have 6hrs together on route to Hanover, that will be interesting .....

Turning 54 this summer.
IMHO Russel and Bernard basicly hit the nail on the head. I also think that the market is somewhat saturated (in lack of a better word)
When I look at the engines I build today, they are much more period correct types of engines plus my standard plus series, plus a few higher detailed street engines for both busses and bugs.
Very little race.

T

I will be 47 this year, but have only been into VW’s for the last 20 years, at the age of 16 I was into Vespa's and Lambretta's, I have owned some of each and ridden many miles around the UK and across Europe. 
My first car was a MK1 Ford Escort a car I owned it for about 15 years, I’ve also owned V8’s and even a Corvair Lakewood and briefly a 1968 Triumph 500, in all honesty I just love ‘hot rodded’ cars & bikes.
My first aircooled VW was the Pagan Princess – Razor Edge Ghia, I enjoyed the ‘show car’ scene, but cars are for driving, so I am now enjoying having a couple of real drivers.
Both my 59 & my 67 are built around ‘Cal-look’ principles, but the focus is more on quick fun drive anywhere cars, than to fit any niche style or label.   :)
Both have stroker motors and closer ratio gearboxes, but built to be practical enough as dailys if the mood takes me  :)
Not interested in SL, but I really appreciate an original paint unmolested car.

rusty slammed shitters don't do it for me but we all have different taste,i buy a vw mag when theres a car that interests me  in otherwise i don't bother, cal look is just the style i like,
im not bothered about exact details but if its got nice wheels sits good and has t bars ill probably like it ohh and muxst have a big arsed motor  :D

I loved cal look before but I still blame Keith Seume for igniting my passion for it. That bloody book fired me up when it came out, the stories and the fantastic pictures, it had a big influence on me. At that time I was rebuilding my 1303 , my first proper resto but I realized that the big windows and bulbus front didn't really cut it in the cal look world although I still like dumper.  Towards the end of that rebuild I had bought my 64 and little did I know that that car would take up so much of my time and money. I kept referring to the book particularly the lightning bug interior with it's gold paneling and minimalistic interior and wild flake paintwork etc.  I turned my bug from a £600 daily to a show winner but somehow I lost my whole vw mojo not long after. I had done the show circuit here in the uk for approx three years attending and showing as many as I could and dare I say it I got bored.
(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l242/vwhelmot/Bug%20jam/2008-10-12_20-34-40_12102008670.jpg) (http://s98.photobucket.com/user/vwhelmot/media/Bug%20jam/2008-10-12_20-34-40_12102008670.jpg.html)
This car was sold to Dave forder who turned it into a landy blown German looker.

(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l242/vwhelmot/CACEC1F8-E75D-4580-A41C-3CEE6A2606FD.jpg) (http://s98.photobucket.com/user/vwhelmot/media/CACEC1F8-E75D-4580-A41C-3CEE6A2606FD.jpg.html)

     Towards the end of that I had the hankering for an oval with a nice 30hp motor so I went on the search. I found a suitable car through Owen Warlow and after parting with £2500 ( it was 2004 :) I had a nice 56 which I like to call it the "used" look. No shitty rust ( I grit blasted every bit off ) no crap, just a lovely honest car in jungle green. I built a nice 30 hp out of two motors and found a judson blower and to be honest I've loved just driving and enjoying it every min and not attending any shows in the last ten years.

(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l242/vwhelmot/F3957533-BF4C-434F-ADFC-CC0517E994E6.jpg) (http://s98.photobucket.com/user/vwhelmot/media/F3957533-BF4C-434F-ADFC-CC0517E994E6.jpg.html)

      I still owned my cal looker but because it was shiney , I was scared to take it out for fear of a stone chip etc ( but as I know now i hadn't built it to the highest standard then)  I decided to sell it eight years ago.  It sold after a while as it wasn't to everyone's taste and I realised as soon as it was trailered away that I had made a mistake.
      In those eight years I dabbled with some jap cars, celica gt4, type r civic, but they never came anywhere near the thrill of a fast bug. That was until I got into fast bikes.  Now this is something I still enjoy and after passing my test ages ago I can honestly say that nothing compares to a fast bike!
      I could go on and on but last year I have managed to complete my life and let's just say that the 64 will be back, better than ever. I'm rebuilding it into the car I should have done way back then. Oh and I'm 40 but age has bugger all to do with it.

VWHelmot...off topic but can I see more photos of your Oval!

Thanks
Richard

Not easy to do, my opinion of crap will be different to another's but for me it's easy, a race car is not a fast street car it's a race car, so should be all about the go, if your race car can be beaten by a street car it's a crap race car....

It's easier to define what is a race car... bernies car, detailed to the max, goes like shit and always performs, richies verts, the race shop Ghia

Or any car with standard rear torsion bars.

I've just turned 45 oooooold  ;D
The beetle I race is the first car I ever had.
It's just a generation thing I think, beetles were very popular & cheap & cool when I was 17, always loved them, it's the car that was 'about' at the time, like 'kids' these days are into polos golfs etc because it's whats about and affordable now.
My boys love older vw's and the race scene, and both want to race - I doubt it will be aircooled though......... maybe I should refuse to help them if it isn't aircooled  ;D
The vast majority of adults get married have kids buy a 'sensible' car and their automotive life is finished. We on the other hand still have the passion.
And the younger ones that do go aircooled unfortunately seem to be hooked into the rusty pile, that is not so slowly rusting away and the floorpans gradually getting ground away scene - why spend thousands on restoration & paint when rust is wayy cool, and hey if you manage to get it low enough and rusty enough it could be on the cover of Hayburner - wooot!

Wasn't going to comment but......I agree with Russel and Bernard....I will also say that a "true" survivor car with faded paint or patina (not disrepair, owner inflicted enhanced damage, or obvious abuse) is very cool. In Florida I have seen way too many of SL cars and especially buses that are indeed dangerous and victims of the owners further abuse of the vehicle. I think if they would put as much effort in to repairing the vehicle properly it would be pretty nice, but after talking with some owners of SL cars they're not interested in doing much work at all. I just don't like it when the car is made worse. I never understand the lifestyle bullsh%t either, but too each his / her own.  ::)

Just because it is an affordable VW bug doesn't mean the paint job is any more affordable.
The cost of a paint job could surpass the value of the SL.
Far cheaper to do nothing and just save up half a tank a gas and take it as is to the next VW event?
Maybe some of the SL look cars are owned by enthusiasts that can only afford to participate at that level?

Hopefully some of the SL cars are leading to an early ruin for poor fitting inferior aftermarket parts.  :D

Index and bracket racing must give you fits  ;D

 :D

Looking back to my day, seeing two nine-second cars race to within 2/100ths of their index is great racing. Seeing a stock Polo against a Skoda Fabia is not...

LOL :)

even funnier LOL  :D

I just moved to Oud-Turnhout Peter.
Do you have a link so I can follow your Projects? Or FB? :)

Hope to meet you this season!

See U soon  8)

Agreed :)

The vwdrc in the uk is a joke at the mo, I love bracket racing but not with stock cars zzzzzzzz

One thing I think hasn't helped with the SL "scene" in the uk is the abolishment of the MOT test on pre 1960 cars

We had a car in last week that proved this to be an absolute joke

1953 oval so doesn't need an MOT

This was a uk RHD car

Its was in for lowering

In the course of the car car being with us we gave it a once over

Remember this car is MOT exempt and being used in the uk

It had:-

No rear lights
No brake lights
No indicators
No number plate light
One leaky wheel cylinder
Most of the battery tray missing
The opposite side floor was rotten
The end of one heater channel was rotten
The frame head lower plate was rotten

But hey it was all fine as its MOT exempt!!!!!!!!!

A proper joke!

SL breads dangerous cars IMO

just make sure its not youf legs that fall through the floor when its driving along.... thats only going to end one way  :o

i wont be driving it lol

worse thing is i told the customer and they said " thats ok its mot exempt" !!!

The lack of an MOT is a complete joke just for those reasons. I didn't mind taking my 56 down to the mot station every year for a check, even though I knew my car is spot on mechanically and bodily. The government here have got their heads up their arses. There are so many people who own vintage cars that do not know one end of a spanner from another but its fine to just carry on driving not knowing what`s going on underneath.
             Then there are the people in the SL scene who think that's great to drive a shit heap with no floor or brakes. It looks bollocks and it is bollocks.   I don't care what people say when its something like " I cant afford to fix it up" , that`s bullshit.   I had a vw bug from 17 onwards on the road and always did my utmost to look after it , it was always safe and I put effort into it. Its pure laziness, you have to put the effort in to get the results.  Yes , the prices of decent cars have gone up, but that's relative. I used to have to pay a whole months wages on insurance every January and that used to be hard and it was only £300 but at the time , for me that was expensive.

I'm 24 and would like to think my '67 has a strong cal-look influence to the stance and tyre choice etc but run merely the stock nos mathcin 1300 SP motor..!

I think you have hit the nail on the head mate, I'm practically a freak for no having a slammed O.G paint bug..!

I also think youre right on age - on word : insurance!

No way would i get insured on a 2336 EFI powered lump so i havent even bothered, yet!

turnign 25 will hopefully see my chase a long held dream of putting a 'nice' 1910/14/15 EFI unti together and upgrading the brakes, thing is theres getting on for £10k in that sentance with the right trans too...!

^^^^The above is what I'm talking about. I've seen many SL cars in Florida like this. Most of the owners know how to repair the cars properly and from what I've seen the owners of these cars could definitely afford to fix them and have them safe but choose not to because they think it's cool to drive a car that's falling apart. I get it if you just don't have the money, we've all been there and it sucks. Not having money doesn't mean it's Ok to do something unsafe and dangerous. I just don't get it.....

Fortunately, insurance in the US doesn't work that way at all...

wouldnt at all be possible in austria either

Insuring a Beetle with a larger engine?

I turned 39 last week....and have a shiny 56 looker with a big motor that can run 13.0 (cover of V World july last year)
 There was only a window of a couple of years when I was able to build it financially...that was
when I got my income was sorted and before I bought a house, got married and had a baby.
 I certainly wouldn't be able to do it now(although I am doing a lowlight ghia- no big motor tough).
  It feels like there was a time when hi po parts came down a bit  as they were more mass produced
and now they have gone up  loads....my new ally case was 400 and my tran's was 500 (£) now those prices have doubled
in 6 or 7 years??
or am I imagining all that ?? :)

I live in Dessel, just 10 minutes from Oud-Turnhout.
I am not a true cal-look folower but do like racing a lot.
Now that the house is finished.. that is just what I will be working on again.
Giving the 66 fastback engine the nitrous treatment and building a new racecar.

Jesse

Everything is cooler stateside..! 

how does the principle of insurance work then in the U.S..?

I'm turning 34 this year . I like a patina VW , I guess my Plymouth is a patina car , but get really pissed off when someone says its Rat Look ! Trouble is the patina / shit look whatever you wanna call it scene has become so fashionable that there aren't enough decent cars to go around , so people have to create a piece of shit or just drive one that needs major work .

As for the scene , I got bored of it years ago , but my passion for the cars has never diminished . I just enjoy building and owning my cars and don't feel the need to show them. So many people have left VWs  and gone over to the vintage hot rod scene . I'm into hot rods too but I never understood how people can simply switch to another scene , and completely forget about something that was such a big part of their lives !

If I go to a show , I see plenty of young people , perhaps not driving cars that are my taste . But at least they're into it , I'm sure as they mature their tastes will improve ha ha ! the the ride of their super slammed cars will piss them off , they'll either build a Cal Looker , or just buy a T5!

Rambling on ! Rob

I don't really think that it is a generation thing... Look at this picture for exemple, the father is in the karmann and one of his sons is in the beetle (the other one is waiting for his turn...) and you know what ?! The father has been dragged here at the Das Drag Days by his sons, not the contrary...

My point of view : just a matter of influence, a lot of us where in resto cal/slammed cars since one of our friends showed us what power and class of cal look looks like, then we changed our minds !


(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/p480x480/11069935_795753493834015_3813683476239664803_n.jpg?oh=100aa4643b7fee443e4da4b9f72b035d&oe=55788E65&__gda__=1438286907_ff4f72ccef884bef29b42bed19a408df)

That's 2 seriously cool cars!

splitter......  :D :D :D :D ;)

It's based on the value of the vehicle, type of vehicle, and risk (sex, age, accident history, geographical location). To get a normal insurance policy for a Beetle, the insurance provider will either use the car's book value or a 3rd party appraisal to set the "stated value" of the policy. Engine size is not a factor, as they otherwise don't care whether it's capable of a 20-sec 1/4 mile or a 9-sec 1/4 mile...it's still a Beetle to the insurance company. Classic car insurance coverage is typically based on an appraised value and will have restricted driving stipulations (must be garaged, can't be a daily driver, etc).

Well I read all the posts and I think JF got right back on page 1 ;) Very well put dude! :)

Oh and I am 38 this year  :-\

For me life got in the way, moved from UK to Florida, have a job with more responsibility, married with an 18 month old son. At this point in my life I don't own an ACVW which is the first time in 18 years, but I will be back in an ACVW one day and hopefully will pass on the addiction to my son :)

Also as Jeff68 said the scene here in Florida is crap! Which doesn't help!

The life cycle of a VW enthusiast in the UK from my circle of friends was.
Teenager: Start out with a cheap bug, go for the cheap Taiwanese chrome, see through dizzy caps and day-glo ignition leads, slam it, cruise it.
Mid - Late 20's: Get serious, hi-po VW's, Cal-Look, IDA's etc.
30's: Either, get out of scene buy a house and will never return as Wife has balls in a jar, or have family/commitment and go dormant but planning to return, or still working on that project car from their late 20's, that hasn't seen daylight in 4+ years.

:)

Brgs
Rob.

You're trying to wind me up and its not gonna work !  There is nothing wrong with having varied tastes ....

 :D mate ill be racing you in a v8 gasser before you know it  ;) you do have to admit it was funny when the gasser circus was in the next fireup lane to the vws and someone shouted out splitter  you did look round straight away  :D

Really , I did ? Ha ha , I don't remember that !

i do  ;)  :D

You're making this shit up !... and I think we got a little off topic ...

sorry it went off topic but it did happen as it was me who shouted it  :D

Turned 30 earlier this year and what I noticed with the few people I know from the VW scene here is that most of them who owned a VW, let's say between 18 and 25, either went to other car scenes or just completely stopped being in any car scene at all. I don't think this has to do with cal-look being "dead", as some like to say these days, as I noticed that from people who were into different kind of VWs, into busses as well and also into water-cooled cars. I guess you have other priorities when getting older, or people get simply bored at some point and need new things. Then for some different reasons one will stop and sell his cars and parts for personal or professional reasons, another will get a totally different car and get into a totally different car scene to breathe something new, others will maybe own a VW again later... some other will just stop being into any car scene at all because it's just not their thing anymore. Almost every guys around 20 love fast and cool cars, the same way almost every teenage guys dream of being a rockstar and end up getting an electric guitar that they will never touch anymore after a few months/years (did I say myself...  ::) ;D). Then the same way you have very few people who will still enjoy playing music, you'll have very few people still enjoying old VWs even after so many years. Take everybody that's into the VW scene right now and into 10/20/30 years only very few of them will still own an air-cooled VW and still love them as much as they do now, and this in my opinion has nothing to do with being into the cal-look scene or not. That's just how things are and how they have always been with everything.

Again about the "cal-look is dying" thing, I stopped counting how many times I've heard or read online/in magazines about how the german-look scene was dying because of "every possible reasons people could think of". I recall hearing people talking about it even before I bought my first VW in 2001... now 15 years later maybe I'm the only one to notice that, but I see as much german-look cars as before. I didn't see every single german performance shops closing, I still see them developing new products. French VW magazines are the only one I'm buying every months and you can still see these cars regularly. So if cal-look has to die the same way then I'm fine with it, let it die  ;D I don't even know where all of this is coming from, who woke up one day and decided they have the authority to say that this or that is dying? It seems some people just like to want to see things changing and dying but things are always the same all in all. Or maybe we are just spending too much time online braging about random stuff like I'm doing now, instead of using that time and these brain cells to do more interesting and prodcutive things like going to sleep because it's past 5am here  ;D