dropped spindles - problem (?)

[qubek]

Now we all know that dropped spindles are not enough
So see what happened when I installed them on my car:










At the beginning, it looked like this: 



It is totally impossible do drive the Bug like that, it rubs almost all the time. And it will be my daily driver once finished. The tires are 155-15 (right) and 165-15 (left) - those are temporary wheels. The left side is lower - previous owner replaced one of the rear torsion bars and didn't adjust it right.

What do you think? I think it's to low for a car dropped just with spindles. Broken leaves in the beam?

I know that it looks right that way, but I cannot drive it like that.

[richie]

i have found that the 2inch drop spindles typically drop 2 1/2 inches +,not ideal,you need 145s to clear or  I add adjusters to give some adjustment upwards if needed,cheers richie,uk

[qubek]

Usually people add adjusters to drop the car even more 
155 rubs like hell, and i was only driving slowly on the backyard, so I don't now if 145s will help much. I expected some problems with 155s, but not that much.
I have 155/70s on the other car, I'll probably try those, but the main question is whether my situation is normal or should i check the leaves or something.

[besserwisser]

I think that the problem is that dropped spindles makes the front beam wider. To drive a lowered bettle you need to have the wheel in the highest place of the fender. You need to take front beam of and install two adjusters. At the same time shorten the beam 25mm per side for linkpin and up to 38mm for balljoint. Be careful to set the adjusters at 50%up and 50% down. At the same time as you shorten the beam correct the 15mm that the beam is offcenter. In your case i´m sure that right now one fender is worse than the other. Meassure before you remove the frot beam. The above is just my experience over the last 25+ years.

[Lids]

I only use dropped spindles, but use 4.5 rims and 145 rubber.  I do not have any problems with rubbing and have a nice comfortable ride.

[Type1/DVK]

I had 175'ers up front, did not rub when i was alone in the bug, but with 2persons it rubbed instant! so 145/65ers will do!


(original but with dropped spindels..)

[colin jardine]

I think that the problem is that dropped spindles makes the front beam wider. To drive a lowered bettle you need to have the wheel in the highest place of the fender. You need to take front beam of and install two adjusters. At the same time shorten the beam 25mm per side for linkpin and up to 38mm for balljoint. Be careful to set the adjusters at 50%up and 50% down. At the same time as you shorten the beam correct the 15mm that the beam is offcenter. In your case i´m sure that right now one fender is worse than the other. Meassure before you remove the frot beam. The above is just my experience over the last 25+ years.

I think besserwisser has hit the nail on the head, dropped spindles increase the track width.  I run a combination of 2 1/2" dropped spindles, and a modest 2" narrowed beam with avix style adjusters.  I've ran a couple of different types of wheels on the front with different offsets, and have had to adjust the ride height accordingly.  My desire to slam the front end on the deck faded when i rubbed all the fresh paint off my wings!!

If you do pull the leaves out to check, your half way there towards fitting those adjusters and narrowing it.

[Zach Gomulka]

Put 145s on it and a pair of caster shims. The shims will raise the front every so slightly, and combined with the 145 tires it will solve your problem.

[alex d]

Strange, I've got a friend with dropped spindles and disk brakes and has no rubbing issues with 155R15 tires on stock steelies.

[Jon]

The leaf springs have broken on the drivers side.  Or the trailing arms are stuck in some way.
Keep us updated!

[qubek]

Keep us updated!

I will. I'll replace the leafs and maybe put 155/70s this week.
I do not have access to 145s here, and I would not like to order them abroad just for checking. Maybe in the and I'll have to, we'll see.

[qubek]

I will. I'll replace the leafs and maybe put 155/70s this week.

Well. I was a little bit optimistic, it finally took me over a month to find free time.
I finally decided to swap the beams with my other car. Now I have stock width adjustable beam here and dropped spindles in the other one. The tires are 155/65s, but I will change them for the summer. The stance is decent (IMO), ride quality is really good.



The car with dropped spindles has 5,5x15 ET34 ATS wheels with 155/70 tires and no rubbing issues

So now, I have only rear suspension, engine, interior and wheels to do

[JS]

Is there something wrong with the rear suspension?

[qubek]

Is there something wrong with the rear suspension?

Well, one torsion bar is long, the other one is short. They are adjusted properly (the car is not straight). The rubbers are probably worn. The shocks are worn for sure.
So yes, I would say that there is something wrong with the rear suspension 

[Shubee2 (DSK)]

Your car looks to be a 1966 Bettle in 61-68 all the rear Torsion Bars were short with a capped off cover if you have a long torsion bar on one side that the problem the longer the bar the more twist so to make it the same it needs more preload But I would Change to A New set of Short torsion Bars in  As Far as the dropped front Spindles they are 3/4 of inch wider then stock on a ball joint front end you need to run a 2 inch narrowed beam it will also allow you to use more wheel and tire choices

[tomi g]

I have dropped spindles  in my '66 and '70 bugs /4,5" rims with 145/80 tyres/ and do have rubbing problems  only at the corners while braking, with 4 people in the car. In my experience if you go for just a minor lowering a properly adjusted beam  will do the job, and you still  have the comfort of the ride that you can have with dropped spindles. I use it in my Ghia and works perfectly.
For radical lowering  you have to shorten the beam accordingly to the size of the rims you want to use /4,5 ET 34 or 5,5 ET 40 with
135 tyres are the best/. If the shortening is more than 8 cm, you should forget the schocks. The riding comfort will suffer, but the whole thing is not about the comfort )
For the '66 model year - seems to me that yours  is a '66 - the ball joint front suspension was introduced, while the rear remained the same. That's why the front track is about 4 cm wider than the rear.  Regards, tomi

[qubek]

Your car looks to be a 1966 Bettle in 61-68 all the rear Torsion Bars were short with a capped off cover if you have a long torsion bar on one side that the problem the longer the bar the more twist so to make it the same it needs more preload But I would Change to A New set of Short torsion Bars

I totally agree and replacement is what I intended to do.
Although I'll probably end up using a pair of used bars

in  As Far as the dropped front Spindles they are 3/4 of inch wider then stock on a ball joint front end you need to run a 2 inch narrowed beam it will also allow you to use more wheel and tire choices

We'll see. For now the spindles work and there's no rubbing. If I'll decide to go lower I'll probably shorten the beam. I don't know yet what I will do with the second car. I'll probably change my mind few times before starting the project 
What I definitely won't do is to shorten the beam more then necessary. I hate the "tricycle look".

For the '66 model year - seems to me that yours  is a '66 - the ball joint front suspension was introduced, while the rear remained the same. That's why the front track is about 4 cm wider than the rear.  Regards, tomi

Unfortunately this is the case. I don't know if saying that on this forum is smart but i hate the way narrow rear end looks. It's not good for handling either.

[qubek]

Your car looks to be a 1966 Bettle in 61-68 all the rear Torsion Bars were short with a capped off cover if you have a long torsion bar on one side that the problem the longer the bar the more twist so to make it the same it needs more preload But I would Change to A New set of Short torsion Bars

I totally agree and replacement is what I intended to do.
Although I'll probably end up using a pair of used bars

Yesterday, about 3 hours after i wrote this, the longer bar broke   
 

[Shubee2 (DSK)]

LOL Well its telling you something   Good Luck!!

[qubek]

This made me think that maybe used bars are not the best solution . But then I started to search and I can't find stock bars anywhere. I can see that they sell them on CIP1 for example, but in Europe, all i could find are sway-a-ways (or something) which are expensive and not something I really need.

[Shubee2 (DSK)]

Here you Go Only $20.00 Enjoy Check out Samba # 375827 hope it helps you out
 
 
 
 
TheSamba.com Classifieds Index -> Parts -> General Parts
Swingaxle Torsion Bars Ad number: 375827
 

Full size   
Swingaxle Torsion Bars - $20/Pair 
Stock torsion bars for 1960-68 swingaxle vehicles, 21.75" in length, $20/pair plus shipping. 
 
 

[qubek]

"Location: Minden, Nevada, USA" is the problem.
If I lived in USA, I would already have a new pair ordered.
But thanks anyway.

[alex d]

csp have torsion bars listed in their catalog, but at a price!