"ROOM" "FOR RENT"

[PRO-FASTBACK]

HELLO,DOUG

   You posted high speed air bleeds pictures and info, 7 hp down low and 12 up high --thats great!!

   Was wondering was that w/ the rifel drilled venturies also or just the high speed bleeds?

   If w/ the both what is the hp gains w/ just the bleeds and what apx. hp gains w/ the rifel drilled venturies?

   Can I get a set of venturies?

  I run 50mm venturies in my 58s but was wanting to up them to 52mm. If I were to put rifel drilled what size should I run?

  Are they drilled at a taper/angel or straight down?

  I am very interested due to the fact that my egts are up to 200 degrees off per cylinder!! And I was wanting to step up my venturi also.

  Thanks for your post very nice work!

[DOUG BERG]

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[DOUG BERG]

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[DOUG BERG]

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[DOUG BERG]

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[Trond Dahl]

         PRO FASTBACK ,,,
                                                         THATS THE E-MAIL I GOT IN AN ENVOLOPE THRU SNAIL MAIL FROM THE SHOP !!!
                                                                                    I THOUGHT IT WAS FROM TROND !!!
                                                                "YOUR ANSWERS"  ARE 1 PAGE BACK "ADRESS'D TO TROND" !!!
                                                                              LIST'D 1-7 JUST LIKE THE PAPER I WAS SENT ....
                                                                           (EXACTLY LIKE YOU JUST POST'D....   SORRY GUYS)

                                                                                       HOPE IT'S MAKE'N SENSE NOW !!!

                                                                                                  LOVE   DOUG...

                               I POST'D TO TROND IN "THE USED BRM POST"  I WONT GO INTO "MOMS" E-MAIL W/O PERMISSION ,,, WHILE I'M NOT AT HOME  !!!

That explains a lot :-D I was scratching my head trying to understand what I had previously asked you to make you write to me like you did :-D

[Jim Ratto]

       RATTO-CAL ,,,

                                                       I "COULDN'T STOP"...   THINK'N 'BOUT "WHAT YOU SAID"    'BOUT CAMS !!!
                                                      HERE'S ANOTHER "KEY" .... IT'S ANOTHER   "BASIC PRINCIPLE"   OF PHYSICS !!!
                                                                  (THAT I FOUND ON ANOTHER "VERY LONG" ROAD TRIP) .....
                                                           WHEN THERE'S "NOTHIN MUCH TO DO"  'CEPT DRIVE ALL NIGHT !!!!
 
                                                  IF YOU "PLACE YOUR THUMB" OVER YOUR STRAW ,,,  WHILE IT'S "IN YOUR DRINK" ,,, 
                                                     & PULL IT "UP OUT" OF YOUR DRINK ...  "THE FLUID" IS LOCK'D IN THE STRAW !!!

                                                      AND THIS IS "VERY KEY"....   IN   "MORE WAYS THAN ONE"   IN YOUR ENGINE !!!
                                         ESPECIALLY    "IN CAM DESIGNS" !!!     AND "THE OUTLET"  &  "FLOW POTENTIAL" !!!         GET IT 
                                                            YOU ALREADY "KNOW" THAT "THEY GO HAND IN HAND"  RIGHT
                                  IT'S NOT LIKE EQUAL/OPPOSITE  (BUT IT IS)    IT'S MORE LIKE   100%  / 100% (THATS REAL WORLD)
                                                                      CAUSE THERE'S "NO SUCH THING" AS 50%/50%
                                                         UNLESS YOUR ONLY GIVEN IT A  (1/2 ASS) ATTEMPT     GET IT 

                                THERE'S "SO MANY MORE COOL THINGS"  I LEARN'D FROM THE STUPID STUFF IN LIFE !!!  AND HOW IT APPLY'S
                                  GOT SOME "MORE" REALLY "OFF THE WALL" STUFF TO SHOW YOU !!!   YOU WONT BELIEVE HOW IT WORKS !!!
                                                                  WELL "YOU" PROBABLY WOULD !!!  MOST WOULDN'T !!!

                                                                                       "DANGEROUS" DOUG BERG....

                                                         YOU INTRIGUED ME WITH SOME MATH NAMES.,,,    I HAVE "NO CLUE".... 
                                             I USE "RENTON MATH" !!!       THAT MEANS "BOTH HANDS"  AND "BOTH FEET"   IF "NEC." !!!

Night time is the right time for thinking, someday I will tell ya about the night in my room, the album and the revelation when it comes to rocker geometry. The light bulb clicked on brightly that night. Cough.
We cut a 94mm cylinder too, one night, to make a "track" to see on degree wheel, there the slug was @ 50% stroke, supposedly the place of max velocity. So where does full lift belong to have 100% (+) VE and highest bmep? At that point? Still trying to figure that one out. Dema Elgin taught me more in a few nights than I've picked up in the time brackets around those nights.

[DOUG BERG]

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[Jim Ratto]

when you turn up the revs, you're closing the time the lungs of the motor have to take a big deep breath. But, the airspeed into the cylinder goes up (to a point) too? I guess for ultimate in high rpm filling, you want that In valve to close as late as possible. I think of it like, just because you turn the garden hose tap off, you still got that column of water in that 15' hose going somewhere (unless you have a trigger sprayer on the other end, in the closed position). here @ sea level we're all under pressure, literally. Can't see it, feel it, smell it, but it's there, and good thing or the blood would boil in our veins.
Makes hp too, if we harness it. (I'm not a turbo VW guy. )
What's facinating, is that these modern engines with VVT or Variocam or whatever acronym each manufacturer chooses to use, they ALSO retard cam timing for a smooth IDLE. Less cyl pressure? Alfa was doing it way back in the early 1980's. Maybe they were rusting but...
Fun to think about this stuff while you ride a big inner tube down a CA river... you can see it for yourself, what's going on in between the air horn and the comb chamber.
Sometimes I wonder what my car would do if I backed up my cam back to 108ATDC, from the 104ATDC the intake f.l. is at now. Maybe become a wet dish rag.
Imagine a cyl cc of 332ccm and a intake profile of IO 104 BTDC and IC 104 ABDC.... it's for real.

[DOUG BERG]

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[DOUG BERG]

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[Jim Ratto]

the 104/104 cam isn't mine... it's a factory Porsche cam profile for 2.0L six that did 220hp/8200 for hours on end (906, 911R).
My cam is similar to an Engle "135"  . Lots of hand wringing and sleepless nights deciding, but Mario over @ Pauter turned me on to the stick in my car. Your bro "finished" the heads that are on my car (they were a few years in the making on my workbench up north, then ditched the project when I moved to Southern Calif, the guy that ended up w/ them sent to Clyde to finish up). More than e.t.'s I built this one for therapy. Therapy for me isn't a floorjack and wrenches strewn about, oil lines bleeding all over my garage.
If I were a rich man, I'd own (and drive) one of the Italian-engineered jewels I'm always clamoring on and on about... A Miura S would probably do it. But I'm never gonna have that kind of dough in my back pocket, so I decided to "use what I have" and give it a soul and character as close to what I see in some 12-cyl exotica as I can, which is probably the sign of a real misfit in the VW world. I did this motor to "pretend", giving similar characteristics (I hope) in power delivery (not amount, of course), sound, etc. I can get out on one of these Ventura County backroads and "pretend", as silly as it sounds, it's kept me interested in my car, a good thing. I can sit bored @ work, in a cube, for 8+ hr, looking forward to my 25 min drive home thru the canyon, Webers howling, power on oversteer, matched revs on the downshifts, and then roll it in the garage, pat in on the roof and do it again the next day. It works.

[DOUG BERG]

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[DOUG BERG]

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[Jim Ratto]

111405672 can be used as an lambda sensor bung, ya mean thinking like that?

[DOUG BERG]

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[DOUG BERG]

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[DOUG BERG]

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[DOUG BERG]

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[PRO-FASTBACK]

Thanks for the info Doug!! 

[Jim Ratto]

                                                       YOU "MIGHT NEED" TO GRAB A GOOFY BIKE HELMET WITH A STRAP FOR THIS ONE !!!
                                                                       "DONT WANT" YOUR LIDS TO COME OFF ON THIS ONE !!!
                                                     (OR MAYBE    "I WANT YOUR FRIENDS AT WORK"  TO THINK "YOUR AS CRAZY AS I AM" !!!)
                                                                          "ANYONE WHO WANTS TO PLAY ALONG" AT HOME CAN TOO !!!
                                                                    YOUR WIFES WILL LOVE IT !!!!  (WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOING?)

                  4-ME  "TIME"....   "IS"       "MALUABLE OR BENDABLE" .....  EVER BEEN BUSY AND "TIME FLEW"    OR.....   THE "COMPLETE OPPOSITE" !!!
                                                EVER GET "WAY MORE DONE" THAN PHYSICALLY POSSIBLE IN "A VERY SHORT" AMOUNT OF "TIME"  
                                                                             AND "THE SIZE" OF THE INCREMENTS "NEVER CHANGED" !!!
                                                 "YOU MIGHT OF" READ SOMEWHERE.... "THAT TIME IS NOT" LIKE THAT......   "AND BELIEVED IT" !!!
            V-8 BOOKS ARE GREAT FOR THAT.....     "SOME BIZZARE CONCEPTS"   OF    "TIME BEING DIFFERENT"   AT    "DIFFERENT RATES" OF "ENGINE SPEED" !!!
                                                                   "GIVE ME A BREAK" !!!      "THE INCREMENTS NEVER CHANGED SIZE" !!! 
                   "LESS TIME" TO "FILL THE CYLINDER" JUST CAUSE IT'S SPIN'N FASTER....   "WHAT" ?     "UNLESS YOU THRU A RAG DOWN IT'S THROAT"....
                                                                                               HOW DID THAT HAPPEN
               IF "THE PISTON"....   GOES UP & DOWN   "IT MOVES"  THAT MUCH AIR PERIOD !!!  IT'S NOT LIKE "YOUR PILE'N WOOD" !!!  "YOUR MOVE'N AIR" !!!
                                     ("AIRSPEED".... "SUPER SONIC AIR SPEED".... WHAT COMES AFTER THAT   MACH WARP ?  "I DONT KNOW")
         I KNOW I KNOW "SPARK RECOVERYTIME" !!!      WHAT       "YOU BETTER FIRE"....   YOUR PLUG LIGHT'R THEN !!!  & FIND SOMETHING ELSE !!!
              COMPUFIRE MULTI COIL PACK BATCH FIRE   MSD WAZOO  WHATEVER !!!  (LIKE THEY "DONT KNOW WHAT THERE DOING" AND CANT KEEP UP !!!)
                                                                                                   GIVE ME A BREAK !!!
                                                 I WONT GET INTO FUELS SYSTEMS CAUSE...   "I THINK" YOUR GET'N MY DRIFT HERE
                              IF THE ENGINE CAN GO 110% V/E + POSITIVE !!!    "IT ALSO"      "CAN & DOES"   "HAS TOO"     GO 110% VE - MINUS !!! 
              "OR BEYOND SCAVANGED"  LIKE OPEN'N A VALVE ON RETARD'D CAM !!!   LETS BUILD SOME SIGNAL HERE !!!  (VACUUM)    AKA....    FAST FILL !!!
     AND THEN "SOME SELF PROCLAIM'D GURU"  WILL TELL YOU "TO ADJUST THE VALVES AT ZERO" !!!  "LIKE HE KNEW MORE" THAN "THE GUY WHO GROUND IT" !!!
             COME ON NOW !!!     THE #'S ARE ON THE CARD NORMALLY !!! (I'VE HAD 'EM SAY .012 BEFORE !!!) AND "HE" (THE SPG) SAYS 0....  WHAT "DO I DO"

                                THE PISTON & CYLINDER "DID NOT" GO TO COLLEGE (NOR "I")  AND THEY "DO NOT KNOW" WHAT TIME IT IS !!!

                              TAKE YOUR HOSE (WATER "IN ON" POSITION) (SPRAY NOZ "ON TIGHT")  OK      AND START "JACK'N THE HANDLE"..... 
                       ON OFF ON OFF ON OFF ON OFF   ETC.......       GET IT   "THATS IN & OUT"  AIR BACK'N UP ON THE WAY IN !!! (BACK OF VALVE)
                       & COMPLETE OPPOSITE GOING OUT !!!            GET IT         (HOW BOUT "UN" BACK'N AIR) (UN PACK'N)   YOUR CHOICE HERE !!!
                                                                                           YET EQUAL OPPOSITE !!!
                                                    "COMPLETELY DIFFERENT" FROM JUST HOLD'N IT ON !!!!   ("THE HOSE THAT IS")
    "IT BUILDS PRESSURE"  BEHIND THE VALVE ON THE WAY UP !!! (RPM)   GREATER & GREATER CHARGE PRESSURE !!! JUST BEG'N TO GET INTO THE DANCE !!!
                                                                                    AND READY TOO ROCK & ROLL !!!

                    MY "MOMS DAD" WAS "FORREST"...                                                                                          SO IT'S :    "LIL' FORREST"

maybe my thinking is in error, but this is the way I look at it.....
let's say you have an elevator that has a max capacity of 1500lb, has an entry of 54 sq ft, and stops for a duration, with doors open for 2 min, so people can get in. No problem, right? You can get your 1500lb of people in, doors shut and off they go, the elevator is being used to its full capacity (never mind folks waiting on other floors for this analogy).
But what if the elevator sat for only 3 sec with doors open. It stops at the floor, doors slam open, closed and takes off. Think you're going to fill it with 1500lb of people?  Maybe guys that set records in the 50 yard...  What if elevator stops, opens and closes doors in .5 sec?
I know, you're thinking air is compressible (so are people, to an extent).
But the cylinder, can go beyond its "1500lb capacity", right? That over 100% VE thing. I think the best motors are the (naturally asp) ones that show a pressure over 1atm in the cylinder somewhere before the piston gets to BDC and starts its trip north on the compression stroke. But at what rpm? I bet the point (degree wheel) where that cyl pressure nudges over 1atm moves all over the scale, dependent on rpm. We're talking a constant of full throttle here.
then we can drag rod ratio into play. I like to tell guys, a piston sitting still isn't doing its job (making vacuum or compressing air/fuel), and the more the piston is in movement, the more the carbs and heads "feel" the pull of the motor, maybe fooling them into "thinking" they're on a bigger motor. (if you take stock length rod, and hang it on an 82 crank instead of 69, with same bore... do the heads and carbs get a stronger signal? , above and beyond just the increase in cyl volume )
if you can get through the incredibly dry text, the book by Philip H Smith (Scientific Design of Exhaust and Intake Systems) is dated, but informative on this stuff.
At that point, before BDC, where we want the cyl to be big and full and fat (above 1atm)... what role does "venturi" effect of valve throat and closing int valve (low lift) play?

[Jim Ratto]

what kind of rock and roll posters are hanging up in this "room" of yours, Doug?

Mind if I pin a few up?
 

[DOUG BERG]

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[DOUG BERG]

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[Jim Ratto]

                                   THE ONLY "ERROR" IN YOUR ANALOGY "THAT I CAN SEE IS"...    YOU FORGOT 1 MAYBE 2 "KEY" POINTS HERE !!!

                                                                      "FIRST IS".....          THE "AMERICAN OBEISETY" PROBLEM !!!

                                                                     SO:      "THAT MEANS" MAYBE 4-5 GUYS IS OVER CAPACITY !!! 

                               AND.....      AT "10% TO LESS" MENTAL CAPACITY... IT COULD TAKE ALL WEEK TO GET "EM IN THAT ELEVATOR !!!



                                                                                                       LOVE DOUG....

actually I should have said the situation is you need to get the payload of folks on before doors shut, while the elevator is in MOTION. 

[DOUG BERG]

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[Jim Ratto]

                                   THE ONLY "ERROR" IN YOUR ANALOGY "THAT I CAN SEE IS"...    YOU FORGOT 1 MAYBE 2 "KEY" POINTS HERE !!!

                                                                      "FIRST IS".....          THE "AMERICAN OBEISETY" PROBLEM !!!

                                                                     SO:      "THAT MEANS" MAYBE 4-5 GUYS IS OVER CAPACITY !!! 

                               AND.....      AT "10% TO LESS" MENTAL CAPACITY... IT COULD TAKE ALL WEEK TO GET "EM IN THAT ELEVATOR !!!



                                                                                                       LOVE DOUG....

actually I should have said the situation is you need to get the payload of folks on before doors shut, while the elevator is in MOTION. 

or maybe that the room is always changing in volume. Those walls that you know, breathe... or like the Haunted House @ Disney. Cylinder volume is always moving.

[Jim Ratto]

            POSTER'S HELL YES !!!

                   I  WAS HOPE'N  "IT WAS ALRIGHT" TO STEAL THE GREEN CAR SHOT DEANO HAS & CLYDE ON ONE WHEEL !!! FOR MY ROOM ....


                                                        SINCE I "BUILT BOTH CARS" !!!   KINDA "PROUD" OF HOW THEY TURN'D OUT !!!

                  THE MUFFIN II IS SPECIAL TOO,,,   SINCE IT'S "THE BLACK CAR"  GONE NEGATIVE....   FROM THE ORIGINAL  SALT & PEPPER TEAM !!!

                                                 ANYBODY HAVE PIC'S OF IT....     WHEN IT WAS UNDERDOG "UNDERCOVER" ?

                                                                                                LOVE  DOUG...

[DOUG BERG]

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[DOUG BERG]

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