BIG type 4

[Fast Eddie]

I have been lucky to get hold of alot of type 4 parts off a very good friend for a very good price and am in a mixed mind of what to do..

currently i run a 2056cc type 4 which i think i have gone as far as i can without spending alot of cash on.
This motor has 44x38 heads, 86b webcam, 45dellortos etc which so far has given me a best of 15.3 1/4 mile at santa pod in my split panel van... This motor is nice because it drives nicely on the street and allows me to cruise into Europe from England to do the euro shows.

So.....

One idea is to keep this as my regular engine, and build another for Racing 

The parts i have for the other engine so far are:

103mm barrels and pistons and crankcase already machined for these
BIG valve heads.... look to be 50x40! machined for 103s
webcam 86c
and lots of smaller bits and pieces.

I need a crank, what would you go for? i have seen everything up to  86mm on ebay for £300,
i think from AA performance.. any good?

any thoughts or opinions welcome 

[GeirH]

If your cam has a std. base circle, and you use std. rods you have trouble already with a 78 crank.
 

[Fast Eddie]

the engine they came from was a 2.6 something if thats anything to go by..

[Udo]

You know that this project cost a lot of money ?? I think a 300$ crank will not be strong enough - heads are like 2800 euros + for good ones .....You need cunningham for 86 or pauter rods  for 80mm  1600-980 euros ....

Udo

[dannyboy]

fit nitrous to existing motor

[GeirH]

If it was a 2.6, then it had 78 stroke with those 103 barrels and I would think you could use the rods and cam that came with the "kit".
Or you can get a crank with even longer stroke, but be prepared to buy a new set of rods and cam as well to get the clearance needed.

[Fast Eddie]

Believe me, Nitrous has crossed my mind many many times Danny!! I'm just not sure about it....

I have had a better look at some of  the stuff i have. The rods are standard 2litre that have been clearanced ALOT!  i dont like the look of them to be honest, who ever did it has not only clearanced the cap, but the original rod bolts too! scarey stuff.
Apparently from a well known UK vw builder..

i am currently using some AA performance rods in my 2056 with no problems there, so thats a possibility for this motor.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5-158-Chromoly-H-Beam-Rod-2-0-Porsche-914-VW-Type-4-/130829746999?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1e760f8337

i know there is going to be expense wth any project, but so far its pretty low and i  have alot of goodies 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Porsche-914-VW-Type-4-76mm-Stroker-C-W-Crankshaft-Crank-/180962279674?pt=Other_Vehicle_Parts&hash=item2a223140fa

these are the cheap crankshafts...  there are different strokes, but this one would give the 103s 2533cc
 accordng to the john maher engine calculator 

[tikimadness]

Believe me, Nitrous has crossed my mind many many times Danny!! I'm just not sure about it....

I have had a better look at some of  the stuff i have. The rods are standard 2litre that have been clearanced ALOT!  i dont like the look of them to be honest, who ever did it has not only clearanced the cap, but the original rod bolts too! scarey stuff.
Apparently from a well known UK vw builder..

i am currently using some AA performance rods in my 2056 with no problems there, so thats a possibility for this motor.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5-158-Chromoly-H-Beam-Rod-2-0-Porsche-914-VW-Type-4-/130829746999?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1e760f8337

i know there is going to be expense wth any project, but so far its pretty low and i  have alot of goodies 




http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Porsche-914-VW-Type-4-76mm-Stroker-C-W-Crankshaft-Crank-/180962279674?pt=Other_Vehicle_Parts&hash=item2a223140fa

these are the cheap crankshafts...  there are different strokes, but this one would give the 103s 2533cc
 accordng to the john maher engine calculator 

Is there any data on those parts? I use stock rods and only the labor on a set of those cost me 600 euro. I had a 86 mm crank that was 1600 euro. That's 1100 more then what's advertised.
I sold all my 86x 103 stuff because I couldn't afford to do it the right way

Michael

[dannyboy]

Believe me, Nitrous has crossed my mind many many times Danny!! I'm just not sure about it....

I have had a better look at some of  the stuff i have. The rods are standard 2litre that have been clearanced ALOT!  i dont like the look of them to be honest, who ever did it has not only clearanced the cap, but the original rod bolts too! scarey stuff.
Apparently from a well known UK vw builder..

i am currently using some AA performance rods in my 2056 with no problems there, so thats a possibility for this motor.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5-158-Chromoly-H-Beam-Rod-2-0-Porsche-914-VW-Type-4-/130829746999?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1e760f8337

i know there is going to be expense wth any project, but so far its pretty low and i  have alot of goodies 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Porsche-914-VW-Type-4-76mm-Stroker-C-W-Crankshaft-Crank-/180962279674?pt=Other_Vehicle_Parts&hash=item2a223140fa

these are the cheap crankshafts...  there are different strokes, but this one would give the 103s 2533cc
 accordng to the john maher engine calculator 

it seems to give good results even on small shots, it might be a cheap bit of extra power then allow you to save some more £££ to build another real monster

[bedjo78]

what valves and dual springs?  could we use T-1 valves and dual springs

[Udo]

type1 valves are too short . you can get manley 48x38 type4 valves , all others are special orders and expensive

Udo

[Fast Eddie]

i will measure the valve's  i have got tomorrow, but they look big, inlets must be 48mm minimum

the heads are complete with dual valve springs etc...    must be some serious moneys worth i guess.?

[Fast Eddie]

inlets are 48mm, and the exhausts are 40mm..

What about these crankshafts...?
someone somewhere must know of one being used surely?
http://www.europeanmotorworks.com/pvw/014-039/type-4-crankshaft/78mm+2.0+Rod+Journal+Forged+Crankshaft

[andy198712]

Turbo your existing?

[Fast Eddie]

Turbo your existing?

that is another thing i keep thinkng!

The main reason  said about going big is because i have a fair few bits for a big motor.. barrels/pistons, heads, case, cam, rods.

I have thought about selling it all off, putting it towards NOS or turbo or ........ WHO knows! lol.

[nicolas]

Believe me, Nitrous has crossed my mind many many times Danny!! I'm just not sure about it....

I have had a better look at some of  the stuff i have. The rods are standard 2litre that have been clearanced ALOT!  i dont like the look of them to be honest, who ever did it has not only clearanced the cap, but the original rod bolts too! scarey stuff.
Apparently from a well known UK vw builder..

i am currently using some AA performance rods in my 2056 with no problems there, so thats a possibility for this motor.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5-158-Chromoly-H-Beam-Rod-2-0-Porsche-914-VW-Type-4-/130829746999?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1e760f8337

i know there is going to be expense wth any project, but so far its pretty low and i  have alot of goodies 




http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Porsche-914-VW-Type-4-76mm-Stroker-C-W-Crankshaft-Crank-/180962279674?pt=Other_Vehicle_Parts&hash=item2a223140fa

these are the cheap crankshafts...  there are different strokes, but this one would give the 103s 2533cc
 accordng to the john maher engine calculator 

Is there any data on those parts? I use stock rods and only the labor on a set of those cost me 600 euro. I had a 86 mm crank that was 1600 euro. That's 1100 more then what's advertised.
I sold all my 86x 103 stuff because I couldn't afford to do it the right way

Michael

and you probably gave in to Richies idea about type4's 

it has always amazed me how much more expensive type4 parts are compared to what type1 can cost. so type1 it is.

[richie]

I know this is really constructive but couldnt help myself thanks to Nicolas for that


[ Attachment: You are not allowed to view attachments ] Prototype Big type 4 project scrapped and now displayed as an ornament

[richie]

I know this isn't really constructive but couldn't help myself thanks to Nicolas for that


[ Attachment: You are not allowed to view attachments ] Prototype Big type 4 project scrapped and now displayed as an ornament

[tikimadness]

I know this isn't really constructive but couldn't help myself thanks to Nicolas for that


[ Attachment: You are not allowed to view attachments ] Prototype Big type 4 project scrapped and now displayed as an ornament

Well I think you at least sent me that picture 3 times to keep my morals high

Michael

[richie]

I know this isn't really constructive but couldn't help myself thanks to Nicolas for that


[ Attachment: You are not allowed to view attachments ] Prototype Big type 4 project scrapped and now displayed as an ornament

Well I think you at least sent me that picture 3 times to keep my morals high

Michael

Is that all,I must be slipping

[nicolas]

too much pork chops. anyway

sorry for polluting  your tread...

[TSAF]

I have been lucky to get hold of alot of type 4 parts off a very good friend for a very good price and am in a mixed mind of what to do..

currently i run a 2056cc type 4 which i think i have gone as far as i can without spending alot of cash on.
This motor has 44x38 heads, 86b webcam, 45dellortos etc which so far has given me a best of 15.3 1/4 mile at santa pod in my split panel van... This motor is nice because it drives nicely on the street and allows me to cruise into Europe from England to do the euro shows.

So.....

One idea is to keep this as my regular engine, and build another for Racing 

The parts i have for the other engine so far are:

103mm barrels and pistons and crankcase already machined for these
BIG valve heads.... look to be 50x40! machined for 103s
webcam 86c
and lots of smaller bits and pieces.

I need a crank, what would you go for? i have seen everything up to  86mm on ebay for £300,
i think from AA performance.. any good?

any thoughts or opinions welcome 

I own a 1303 GL with a hot 2.6 type 4 engine. As Udo already told you do not buy cheap crap from ebay. I am using a pauter crank on mine.

[fish]

Why not use stock crank and rods, modified 1700 rockers, have everything balanced and run it.

[tikimadness]

Why not use stock crank and rods, modified 1700 rockers, have everything balanced and run it.

I run stock crank and stock lightened rods 385hhp @ 13psi

Michael

[Udo]

Those stock lightened rods work nice , but only up to 78 stroke. I have also found a way to make one cheaper crank work for a longer time .

Udo

[Fast Eddie]

Why not use stock crank and rods, modified 1700 rockers, have everything balanced and run it.

I run stock crank and stock lightened rods 385hhp @ 13psi

Michael

i like the idea of forced induction, but i also like simplicity of normally apsirated... BUT, any info on turboing a type4 welcome 
My current motor is 2056cc, 113bhp at the wheels, 15.3 1/4 mile @ santa pod in my van , but i want  MORE!!

I only asked about big type 4s because of the stuff i got hold of.. big valve heads and 103 b+p's etc..

Whilst i am on about big stuff again, cheap being bad 
Anyone used anything from DPR machine shop?

[paul_f]

I have a DPR 78.4mm crank in my bus.  I am happy with it

[fish]

Hi Eddie, any more updates on this build?

[Fast Eddie]

Still haven't decided what way to go with it so for now will be keeping it 2056cc..

[bugnut68]

Still haven't decided what way to go with it so for now will be keeping it 2056cc..

I would recommend directing questions to Jake Raby in the U.S. The guy's a master with Type 4s in a no-nonsense, no-BS fashion.
The Type 4s are more pricey to build, yes its true, but that comes with higher-quality parts that aren't churned out by the dozens in China/Taiwan, etc. VW people, as a general rule, are notoriously cheap, and that's largely why the Type 4 following isn't as broad as the Type 1 crowd, at least here in the U.S. 
The Type 4 engines have proven to do more than simply go fast in a straight line, but drag racing is certainly not the end-all, be-all mark of high performance.  Just something to consider.