185/80x15 tyres

[RichardinNZ]

I think there are only very limited 185/80x15 tyre options here in NZ; some of them appear to be van tyres. Can anyone let me know what tyres they have used in this size that look OK on a Bug?  I can then see if I can get a pair at a reasonable price.

Many thanks

Richard

[maX cal-look]

Hye,

I ride with HANKOOK Tyres 185/80 x 15 ...(Not van tyres).
Search HANKOOK in the web for delivery near your home ...

[RichardinNZ]

Hi maX
Great. I can get those here OK.

Do you have any pictures of them on your car?

Regards
Richard

[streetvw]

if you can get em 185x75x15 XWX michelin's look great on the back of a bug (as shown below)

[El Dub]

Vintage Pirelli Cinturato looks great also... 

[RichardinNZ]

There is a classic tyre supplier here. I'll double check what they have in stock and prices too as they may have Pirelli or Michelin.  Think they may  sell others too but I think they have high prices due to the cost of importing low volumes.

Thanks
Richard

[maX cal-look]

Sorry for delate, very busy !

[maX cal-look]

[alstare84]

Vredestein Sprint Classic 185R15 

http://alstare84.net/?p=470

[RichardinNZ]

Thanks everyone; definiately set on the 185/80 now; will take the gearing of my 36hp '58 back up to stock again which will be good on longer runs.

Richard

[qubek]

It will? 185R15 is taller then stock tire.

[RichardinNZ]

It is a similar height to the standard crossply tyres it originally came with.  Whilst 165/80 and 155/80 are now seen as standard they are a lot shorter than original.

Thanks
Richard

[Rocket-Racing]

A 185/80 will be higher than the stock 5.60-15 bias tires.
Bias tires used to vary a lot in height and width from brand to brand even if the numerical size was the same but in general a 165/80 is the same height as the stock 5.60 tires. The Firestone 5.60's that are often used now are a little higher buth they are also higher than what the car had when new.
I have alot of old different brand 5.60-15 tires and they are a little narrower than a 155/80 and the same height as a 165/80.
The 185/80 will work and give you lower rpms but is a little wide for the stock rim.

Enclosing a couple of pics of my oval. The front tires are 165/80 on the Sprintstars and old Goodyear 5.60's on the Rockets. The tire height is almost exactly the same.

[RichardinNZ]

Hi Rocket.  Thanks for the information; I found a site with a table of tyre heights somewhere that showed the Cross-Plys as being about the same height as the 185/80....can't find it now though! I guess they varied a lot.  I wonder whether we only had tall versions here in NZ....the roads were pretty basic in the '50s!

Richard

[spillo491]

if you can get em 185x75x15 XWX michelin's look great on the back of a bug (as shown below)

Can I see others pictures and have some info on wheels/tyres ?

[hotrodsurplus]

Just to be specific, the common callout for this tire size is the old Euro Metric standard, 185R15. The Euro Metric callout assumes an 82-percent aspect ratio. The Vredestein, Dunlop, Avon, and Pirelli models are such tires: 185HR15 or 185VR15 (the H and V are speed ratings). That's the common radial analog for the 6.40-15 tires on cars like E-type Jags and Austin-Healey 3000s.

That differs from the later standard Metric callout that some brands use, 185/80R15. Based on my research the tires available in that size are for commercial (truck and van) use.

So don't just assume that a 185R15 and a 185/80R15 tire are the same. They're not, if only for aspect ratio. And the two point spread between the two ratios is enough to make a difference. Calculations based on the callout size show the 185/80R15 is 26.7 inches tall where the 185R15 is 27 inches tall.

Yes, both of these tires are taller than the stock 5.60-15. The 5.60-15 ranges from 25.75 to 25.9 inches tall depending on manufacturer and model. Understand that the 165r15 radial analog is shorter, 25.4 to 25.6 depending on manufacturer and model.

I prefer the 185r15 on the back of a Beetle for three reasons.

1) they raise the effective gear ratio. That reduces the engine speed by about 140rpm. For comparison sake, the jump from a 4.37:1 gear to a 4.12:1 gear reduces engine speed by 170rpm. So tThe engine in a car with a 4.37:1/.89 gearbox and 185r15 tires will spin only 30rpm faster than the engine in a car with a 4.12:1/.89:1 gearbox and 165R15 tires.

2) they better fill up the unsightly gap between the tire OD and the wheel arch on a stock-height car.

3) the taller size lets you decamber a swing-axle rear to a degree or so negative camber for stability reasons yet the rear of the car remains effectively stock height. That's very important as a stock swing-axle Beetle has 2.5 degrees positive camber to '66 and a degree positive camber from '67 onward. Positive camber on the back of a swing-axle car promotes wheel tuck which will induce intense oversteer which can cause a spin and possibly a rollover. You can still go quite low with a 185r15 tire--it's only .6 inches taller than a 205/70 and people go quite low with those. But as cal-look snobs we don't slam cars anyway. That's for the idiots who came from the minitruck scene, right?

The caveat, of course, is whether a car can pull the taller tire. I know from experience that a stock 1600 with a 12V trans (4.12:1) will pull a 27-inch-tall tire quite handily. It will reduce engine speed and cabin noise and I never noticed that i had to reach for third gear to climb hills any more than I did with 165s. But a stock 36er or 40-horse engine may not be able to pull a 185r15 tire even with a 4.37:1 transaxle. There was a reason that Volkswagen used the 4.37:1 and 4.44:1 ring/pinion with those engines: they're not very strong.  

I did lots of research before I bought my Vredesteins. I have 155r15s for the front and 185r15s for the back based largely upon alstare84 and christoph's cars. I like the wheel/tire fit of both cars although I think they could come down just enough to get negative camber in the rear--less than an inch for sure. Those cars have 5.5 wheels on the back but the 185R15 fits well on a 4.5-inch rim. It's a little bulgy but not offensive. A 5.5 would be better and I'm having a set of P-car wheels widened to those specs for that reason.

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[RichardinNZ]

Thanks for the additional information; very useful.  What are the p-car rims (I think I've missed something obvious)?

regards
Richard

[hotrodsurplus]

Thanks for the additional information; very useful.  What are the p-car rims (I think I've missed something obvious)?

You're welcome. P-car is Porsche.

[RichardinNZ]

I did wonder whethe that was the case!  Thanks
Richard

[streetvw]

here's another angle the combination in this shot is front 4.5" with 145 XZX Michelins and rear 5.5" with 185 XWX Michelin's

[hotrodsurplus]

here's another angle the combination in this shot is front 4.5" with 145 XZX Michelins and rear 5.5" with 185 XWX Michelin's

That's not a 185R15 or even a 185/80R15. The XWX is a 70-series tire. So that's a 185/70R15, a considerably shorter tire than the others. At 25.2 inches tall it's even shorter than a 165R15. 

[Zach Gomulka]

A 165/15 (assuming 78 profile) comes in at 25.13", the 185/70 is, like you said, 25.2".

I love the 145, 185/70 combo. Especially with staggered wheels, ideally 4.5's and 6's. They look perfectly balanced to the car from all angles. I wish the 185/70 was still readily available!

[hotrodsurplus]

A 165/15 (assuming 78 profile) comes in at 25.13", the 185/70 is, like you said, 25.2".

I love the 145, 185/70 combo. Especially with staggered wheels, ideally 4.5's and 6's. They look perfectly balanced to the car from all angles. I wish the 185/70 was still readily available!

Actually the assumed Eurometric profile is 82, not 78. The 78 profile applied to domestic bias-ply alphanumeric tires like G78-15. Calculating by the callout  (the numbers cast in the sidewall) a 165r15 is 25.43. The actual diameters are quite close to that--according to Coker the Firestone 165 is 25.43 and the Michelin XZX 165 is 25.4.

I agree that the 145 and 185/70 does look right on 4.5s and 5.5s or sixes when coupled with a good stance. It's a different look than the 155 and 185r15 but it's sharp in its own right.

[Zach Gomulka]

Good to know. That 78-82 stuff always confused me. Seems like I've ran across 165's that had heights all over the board.
Tire Rack also has 195/70's available now. Would be a good compromise.

[hotrodsurplus]

Good to know. That 78-82 stuff always confused me. Seems like I've ran across 165's that had heights all over the board.
Tire Rack also has 195/70's available now. Would be a good compromise.

Yeah, tire dimensions are kooky. The callout number is almost irrelevant sometimes. I did a tech piece about a shop that recaps radial tires with pie-crust slick caps (don't bother; they're all too tall for street Volkswagens). The owner said that the biggest problem was finding a tire with the right case dimensions. He said the varies size varies so radically among brands that in one brand he could use one callout size but in another brand he had to use another callout size. 

195/70 is a great size but a terrible tire for any kind of performance beyond load capacity. I'm not aware of any other application beyond cargo vans for that tire. 

[RichardinNZ]

Ok...not strictly a 185/80 issue, but as we strayed on to other tyres in this post I'll mention that I heard recently that Pirelli are remaking their 185/70x15 CN36.  I think these were standard fitment on some 911s so I guess the price may be high!

Richard

[Stevo_L]

I have also Vredestein Sprint classic front 155R15 and rear 185 R15

http://german-ghia.blogspot.co.at/2014/11/fotoshooting.html

[leec]

Cool bug. Like the rear wheels

[Stevo_L]

thank you. 
rear rims are lemmerz 5,5x15 et 25, front stock 4x15

[speedwell]

got some news vredesteins too on my 61