Stance problem (KYB)

[Diederick/DVK]

Hola,

i just suggested we need a tech help here as well, cos i have issues...

tonight i finally picked up my wheels are decided to install the rear shocks that my brother actually bought, but his resto-cal turned out to need my coil-over shocks that gave me a nice high ass...

so i decided to swap mine for the KYB GR-2 shocks but as i haven't had much time i didn't install them up until now. anyhow, i got my wheels rapped in firestone 145 and 165. and now it turns out that my rear is just as low as my brother's. but his is lowered 1 spline and mine is original height. are these shocks really that soft? cos the stance police will definitely kick my ass, though the rear is original.

now, my brother can't use these shocks cos he will have clearance issues with the tyres and i lost my ass up stance, so i'm thinking... what purpose DO these shock serve?

any ideas? what are you lot running for shock absorbers?

nice little treat taken tonight

[Diederick/DVK]

and

[richie]

I am running Koni reds all round,nice simple adjustable shock,but shocks do not affect your ride height,only the spring[torsion bar]can do this unless is so low that the shocks bottom out[another issue alltogether] What has proberly happened to your car is that the torsions have got soft threw age& wear allowing the suspension to sag,you can remedy this by reajusting the torsions or replacing them with new or stiffer ones,cheers richie,uk

[Rocket-Racing]

I don't think you can blame the KYB shocks.. They are by no means softer than original shocks.
Anyway, the shocks are just there to slow things down in the suspension, your car will not get lower even if you take them off..
Unless of course you have stiff gas shocks or coil-overs that push outwards instead of just being slow.
I'd say your car is lowered a little in the rear, but the coil-overs made it high again. No more..

[lowfastbus]

I'm running the KYB GR2 on the back too, and it's by no means too low... I will be adjusting the spines to get it al little lower because it even has positive camber on the rear.  Picture is taken at the end of the 1/4 mile and it's ass went up a little, but you can see what I mean.

[richie]

I'm running the KYB GR2 on the back too, and it's by no means too low... I will be adjusting the spines to get it al little lower because it even has positive camber on the rear.  Picture is taken at the end of the 1/4 mile and it's ass went up a little, but you can see what I mean.

You should proberly put some sort of limit strap on the back of this car to stop it doing that,it can get out of shape very easyerly when you have positive camber under breaking,just for your own safety,cheers richie,uk

[lowfastbus]

Hi Ritchie,

I surely will do that, I must admit that it was allready rather sketchy when I lifted the gaspedal...

Greets
Jelle

[Martin Greaves]

Also when you get to the end of your run take it out of gear let the car settle then start to brake.

[Zach Gomulka]

You can lightly brake with the parking brake to keep the ass from jacking up

[Dokke/DFL]

Hi Diederick,

I think Richie has it right, the problem is not your KYB.
BTW, nice chooise of wheels !!! You can also get it in different size like 4,5 and 5,5 ...

Cheers, Dokke

[Diederick/DVK]

Thanks Dokke! I have 4.5 up front and 5.5 in the back. With 145 and 165 Firestone F560 tyres. It was a royal pain to prep them for all the stages of paint  2 layers of primer, then black, then mask the black and get silver on it and finally a transparent layer for the shine, as can be seen from those night pics above. Now, I'm still in doubt whether i should buy the hubcaps, i can get a set for 80 Euros 

I think you are right about my height, the coil-overs just "kept it up" and now it's dropped down a bit. So i'm still in doubt what to do... My rear is still higher than the front. But not as much as I'd wish to. 15cm front and 17.5cm rear.

I also don't know yet about dropping the front beam a tad... What do you reckon?

[The Ideaman]

Just adjust the rear torsion bars to a stance you like.  It may take a couple tries, but not difficult.

[JeePee/DVK]

Hi Diederick,
Nice wheels,I like them to.
I think you must rice te back a litle,and lower the front a litle.
Like the others tell here,with shocks you don't lower your ride.
I use stock shocks at the back.
Grtz:JeePee.

[Zach Gomulka]

When you look at the side profile of your car, I think you have the right stance. If you raise the rear any more you will have more fender gap in the rear than the front has- right now the fender gap matches very well from front to back.

[Diederick/DVK]

thanks guys!

zach, i know what you mean. but i must admit that my right rear wheel there is a bit tucked in on a little bump. i have negative camber. i think i just need to raise the rear by 2-3cm. so should i figure that out and keep the KYB shocks, or should i buy coil-overs? i placed an ad for the KYBs and everyone wants them 

btw, i think i have positive camber on my front wheels. is this possible? what does it mean or do? should i fix it?

cheers and merry boxing day 

[Zach Gomulka]

btw, i think i have positive camber on my front wheels. is this possible? what does it mean or do? should i fix it?

It means you need an alignment!

[javabug]

Diederick I think so far that it looks quite good as is.  Hard to say with out a shot on good, level ground.

Have you tried a jack in the back to see if you would really like it higher?

[Dokke/DFL]

Maybe you don't have to change anything first except a bigger rear tyres ...
Think about 195/70 0r even 205/70 ?
It should make a lot different for now.

[Diederick/DVK]

Maybe you don't have to change anything first except a bigger rear tyres ...
Think about 195/70 0r even 205/70 ?
It should make a lot different for now.

I will get the 205s once these 165s are worn...  still the rear tyres have too much negative camber, see the attached pic:

It means you need an alignment!

yikes, better get this done quickly then...

about the stance... perhaps i should lower the front one more tad on the avis adjusters, the only problem is that i've tried to loosen the bolts but i think they're stuck  i have 2 more teeth left on the adjusters, does anyone know how much 1 tooth is on these thingies?

[Zach Gomulka]

That is a better picture. It looks like the front should come down a bit, the rear up some (just to lose the camber), and taller tires for the rear.

[Diederick/DVK]

i know i should get 205/70, but i thought 165 might still work as well as i had a pair lying around and early cal-look cars had 165 in the rear as well, but i'm sure you're right and it will help slightly.

do you use avis adjusters zach? any idea how much 1 tooth will be? i need to prepare for this job as my front is already to low for my jack... and the bolts were stuck as hell. 

[Diederick/DVK]

Hey buddy....car looks good!
I don't think I would mess with your stance....it looks fine to me.

I think '67's sort of sit soft in the ass end stock. My memory is bad, but isn't the spring rate softer anyway on '67? They utilized a Z-bar to assist the torsion bars under load. Also, not sure about this, but '67's use longer axles and tubes. When I converted my '67 to short axle and tubes, without adjusting torsion springs, my car gained about 1/4" in height and went a little more positive camber.
Personally, for safety's sake, a smidge of negative camber isn't a bad thing.

Car looks fantastic, man. Of course, I'm partial to '67's!!!

thanks pal! 

i waited a long time posting pics here, took me a few months to get those wheels sorted 
you might be right on the softer rate etc, and yes, i also have a z-bar.

so i hope the stance police won't call me off when i lower the front a tad and keep the rear height for the moment, right? 

[javabug]

Jim's right, I think 67s (maybe 66 as well) had a smaller torsion bar in the rear.  Before I lowered my car, the front end was definetly higher than the rear.



I would maybe try one notch lower on the Avis adjusters.  When the front end of my car dropped, the rear actually came up a slight bit.  I think there's some geometry/physics/voodoo when the front comes down.

[Sander/DVK]

Maybe you don't have to change anything first except a bigger rear tyres ...
Think about 195/70 0r even 205/70 ?
It should make a lot different for now.

I will get the 205s once these 165s are worn...  still the rear tyres have too much negative camber, see the attached pic:

When you chance the 165's for the 205's, you lost your negative camber.. I think..
It still looks very well!

Cheers,
Sander

[Diederick/DVK]

Maybe you don't have to change anything first except a bigger rear tyres ...
Think about 195/70 0r even 205/70 ?
It should make a lot different for now.

I will get the 205s once these 165s are worn...  still the rear tyres have too much negative camber, see the attached pic:

When you chance the 165's for the 205's, you lost your negative camber.. I think..
It still looks very well!

Cheers,
Sander

thanks sander, i'll see you in 10 days. we'll have a good chat 

i should change to 205, but then i would just waste a nice set of firestones... 
and i'll have to get the outer ring painted again cos with all the balancing i lost a few chips of paint 

still i'm well chuffed now, just have to find a way to get the bolts of the beam loosened up 

[H67bug]

Just soak them in WD40 or a similar releasing agent for an hour, use correct fittng spanner and all should be fine. Once you get that front down you will wear them off on the road anyway! :-)

If you are too low for your jack then get a friend to help lift the front up a tad while you fit the jack under or jack it up from rear/ side first to lift the frnt a tad.

[Diederick/DVK]

thanks for the advice heydon! i should be able to raise the front that way 

thanks to jordy i now have a nice pair of good year eagle nct 70 205/70/15 with over 5mm thread left for cheap
those look huge sat next to my rear end in the garage here 

thanks again for the tip jordy!

[Jordy/DVK]

 So you got ém! Me jealous...
 I Still have to find a nice set of 205/70 tyres to shift my bugs arse a little...

 Are you gonna mount em before KWF? I'm curious how it'll look..

[Diederick/DVK]

no, i won't...  i'll have to get the outer rings repainted etc so i'll do it in the course of the next few months.
and i think i'd best not raise the back before mounting the 205s otherwise it might turn out differently...

i'm very curious too!

...if only i had a few more horses in the back to burn these then i'd have an excuse 

[Jordy/DVK]

...if only i had a few more horses in the back to burn these then i'd have an excuse 

 A cigarette lighter and a little gasoline will do to... 
 Creates a nice bonfire (which on its turn is a good excuse to mount the 205s)...