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Author Topic: Small powerhouses and old school  (Read 654599 times)
Gabetion2000
Newbie
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Posts: 25



« Reply #240 on: February 15, 2008, 04:10:30 am »

Hello everybody,
I am a first time poster in the cal look lounge. And I have to say that this forum is awesome. Especially this thread. I have alway been
interested in mouse motors ,and planned on building one in the future. Awesome info guys. Keep it up.

Gabe Scott
Ventura,CA
USA
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A and G's Racing
73 Super
BeetleBug
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 2836


Snabba grabben...


« Reply #241 on: February 15, 2008, 09:01:45 am »

Hello everybody,
I am a first time poster in the cal look lounge. And I have to say that this forum is awesome. Especially this thread. I have alway been
interested in mouse motors ,and planned on building one in the future. Awesome info guys. Keep it up.

Gabe Scott
Ventura,CA
USA

Hi Gabe and welcome to The Lounge! Don`t forget to keep the rest of us in the loop when you start building your mouse engine.

Best rgs
BeetleBug
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10.41 - 100ci - 1641ccm - 400hp
Jon
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Posts: 3214


12,3@174km/t at Gardermoen 2008


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« Reply #242 on: February 15, 2008, 09:44:18 am »

When you have decided the closing point chose duration so the intake valve does not hit the piston at tdc including the depth of your valve pockets.

Could you explain this for us dummies, Johannes?
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Johannes Persson
Jr. Member
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Posts: 67


« Reply #243 on: February 15, 2008, 12:08:50 pm »

Hello there,

JHU, I ment that you should open the intake valve early because you want as much flow available as possible when the piston accelerates down(more flow area under the curve), but there are mekanical limitations you have to deal with(valve hitting piston).
I decided to cloce the intake valve 57deg abdc @ 0,05", then the fk45 became a good choise together with 1,55:1 rockers.
I am close to 6mm lift @ tdc so the valvepockets are pritty deep.
Maybe I am not clear enought ,please let me know.

Regads
Johannes
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Jon
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12,3@174km/t at Gardermoen 2008


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« Reply #244 on: February 15, 2008, 12:39:20 pm »

That helped quite a bit, thanks.  Smiley
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Eddie DVK
Hero Member
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Posts: 864



« Reply #245 on: February 15, 2008, 17:09:50 pm »

Damn I speechless and that doesn t happen that often.
Very very cool and that with stock parts appart from the pistons..
......
Where can I bring mine 1600............ Wink
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Regards Edgar

" Type 4, it is a completely different engine. You have to drive one to understand! "
Jim Ratto
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 7121



« Reply #246 on: February 15, 2008, 17:34:58 pm »

Hello everybody,
I am a first time poster in the cal look lounge. And I have to say that this forum is awesome. Especially this thread. I have alway been
interested in mouse motors ,and planned on building one in the future. Awesome info guys. Keep it up.

Gabe Scott
Ventura,CA
USA

Wow... a neighbor...I'm in Simi.
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Peter Shattock
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 340


« Reply #247 on: February 18, 2008, 22:35:49 pm »

Johannes,

As suggested on here many times already great effort with the motor, and some really interesting insight, but best of all, it’s great to see someone actually doing it, rather than just talking about it.

I was wondering what fuel you were using as I see you will be running the motor on the street with the CR set at 12.3:1, also how do you find the cooling with such a high CR on the street?

Thanks again for you part in a great thread

Peter


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The fastest beetle in the village
Johannes Persson
Jr. Member
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Posts: 67


« Reply #248 on: February 19, 2008, 09:10:33 am »

Hi Peter,
Good to hear that you like the project.
I use our best pump gas "V-Power" from Shell gas stations, Shell says 99 octane.
When you are using a smaller diameter piston the heat transfer thrue the piston rings to the cylinder are better than with a bigger piston.
The area of a circle increases by the square, the circumference does not, that is why a smaller piston can use higher CR.
I always use the cooling fan from a 1303 bug then you need a really good oil cooler with electrical fan and all your cooling tins has to fit to 100%, no leakage.

Regards
Johannes

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Harry/FDK
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Posts: 3613


Every Rule Was Made To Break, Even Callook...


« Reply #249 on: February 19, 2008, 17:48:43 pm »

Fantastic Project Johannes, Youre a hard working artist !
BTW, maybe you have seen the Topic: Drilling Your Heads (Cooling Fins), by me dummy.  Do You have experimented with this ? Or maybe share your thoughts ?

Thanks,
Harry
« Last Edit: February 19, 2008, 17:52:14 pm by FDK/Hurry » Logged

Done ? Not Yet.
sonic
Full Member
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Posts: 177


« Reply #250 on: February 22, 2008, 18:40:35 pm »

Its nearly unbeliveble Johannes
Could sombody go there to witness this , longlivity and torque must be hurting , live in Baastad from time to time ,
like to visit ...
Its more effective than a 1000 RR bike  , like whatch that..
Reg
Erich.
"lot more than impressed"...

« Last Edit: February 22, 2008, 18:42:42 pm by sonic » Logged
speedwell
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Posts: 14701


the archivist


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« Reply #251 on: February 22, 2008, 22:07:46 pm »

how does it cost for a similar motor Huh just simple question  Roll Eyes
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oldspeed 61 standard empi/speedwell
Lee.C
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Posts: 6458


I might be an Idiot but I'm not an Arsehole!


« Reply #252 on: February 23, 2008, 02:38:28 am »

Yeah Johannes lets have a rough idea of hours/cost involved  Huh Wink Smiley

I would REALLY like to know how many hours went into those heads  Wink Smiley
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You either "Get It" or you don't......
Johannes Persson
Jr. Member
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Posts: 67


« Reply #253 on: February 26, 2008, 08:26:47 am »

Hi there,

I will soon post a list with the parts used in the "Mouse Motor" and prices.

Monkiboy, I have spent between 40 to 50 hours on the heads from start to finish including flow tests and welding.

Regards
Johannes
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Type1/DVK
Sr. Member
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Posts: 315



« Reply #254 on: February 26, 2008, 09:48:56 am »

looking forward to it! (and many others i think  Wink)  a whole week in the heads  Shocked
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DDD#8 - 14.74sec @ 1776cc - Member of:  DVK ~ Der Vollgas Kreuzers  - www.ultimatevw.nl - and racing engines
Udo
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 2077



« Reply #255 on: February 26, 2008, 18:44:41 pm »

Hi there,

I will soon post a list with the parts used in the "Mouse Motor" and prices.

Monkiboy, I have spent between 40 to 50 hours on the heads from start to finish including flow tests and welding.

Regards
Johannes

Hi Johannes
For German street use i would relocate the spark plugs .  Wink 

Udo
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Johannes Persson
Jr. Member
**
Posts: 67


« Reply #256 on: February 26, 2008, 22:32:13 pm »

Hello,
Here is the parts list.
Most of the parts are from CB performance but some from CSP in Germany, CSP in Sweden and JPM.

IDA carb kit 1099,95
Heads 043 bare pair 211,9
CB Ti valves  503,6
OTEVA 75 valve springs 185
JPM ti retainer 173
JPM rockers 1046
Push rods 49,95
Push rod tubes 167 CSP
Cam 104
Lifters 22,95
Cam gears Magnum 172 CSP
Bearings 39,85
Oil pump 27,95
Pump cover full flow 28
JE pistons 1206
Cylinder kit 165
Fuel pump block off 4,95
009 dist 109,95
Compufire 63,95
Cables 27,95
Valve covers 12,95
Clips 5,95
Gasket kit 9,95
Oil sealing flywheel 3,95
Clutch disc 29,95
Pressure plate Kennedy 180mm 179
Flywheel bolt 56
Deep sump 105
Lash caps 12,95
Pully 18,95
Pully bolt 4,95
Cyl studs 119
Header S&S 1 5/8 332
Old engine 155


Total parts 6454 USD.

Hopefully I did not forget too many parts.

The time I spent on the total build is aprox 100 hours(night hours).

Regards
Johannes



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Jim Ratto
Hero Member
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Posts: 7121



« Reply #257 on: February 26, 2008, 22:36:22 pm »

Nice of you to take the time to come up and share the list... thanks Johannes

off topic, I am sorry, but could you read my thread in Cal Look section about Porsche valve timing characteristics, powerband, etc?

here it is: http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php?topic=4395.0

Thank you
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richie
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 5620



« Reply #258 on: February 27, 2008, 05:48:43 am »

Hello,
Here is the parts list.
Most of the parts are from CB performance but some from CSP in Germany, CSP in Sweden and JPM.

IDA carb kit 1099,95
Heads 043 bare pair 211,9
CB Ti valves  503,6
OTEVA 75 valve springs 185
JPM ti retainer 173
JPM rockers 1046
Push rods 49,95
Push rod tubes 167 CSP
Cam 104
Lifters 22,95
Cam gears Magnum 172 CSP
Bearings 39,85
Oil pump 27,95
Pump cover full flow 28
JE pistons 1206
Cylinder kit 165
Fuel pump block off 4,95
009 dist 109,95
Compufire 63,95
Cables 27,95
Valve covers 12,95
Clips 5,95
Gasket kit 9,95
Oil sealing flywheel 3,95
Clutch disc 29,95
Pressure plate Kennedy 180mm 179
Flywheel bolt 56
Deep sump 105
Lash caps 12,95
Pully 18,95
Pully bolt 4,95
Cyl studs 119
Header S&S 1 5/8 332
Old engine 155


Total parts 6454 USD.

Hopefully I did not forget too many parts.

The time I spent on the total build is aprox 100 hours(night hours).

Regards
Johannes





Wow,there some pricey parts in there for a little 1600 Cheesy    Johannes which lifters did you use at only 22.95?   cheers richie,uk
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Good parts might be expensive but good advice is priceless Wink
Johannes Persson
Jr. Member
**
Posts: 67


« Reply #259 on: February 27, 2008, 15:49:00 pm »

Hi Richie,
The lifters are std VW part # 1512 at CB.

Regards
Johannes
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Udo
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 2077



« Reply #260 on: February 28, 2008, 20:31:28 pm »

Nice of you to take the time to come up and share the list... thanks Johannes

off topic, I am sorry, but could you read my thread in Cal Look section about Porsche valve timing characteristics, powerband, etc?

here it is: http://cal-look.no/lounge/index.php?topic=4395.0

Thank you


2,0 ltr and 185 hp is the same we had on our last Käfercup circuit engiens . They worked good and the whole race season without problems

Udo
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n2o
Full Member
***
Posts: 137



« Reply #261 on: February 29, 2008, 15:39:50 pm »

Hello,
Here is the parts list.
Most of the parts are from CB performance but some from CSP in Germany, CSP in Sweden and JPM.

IDA carb kit 1099,95
Heads 043 bare pair 211,9
CB Ti valves  503,6
OTEVA 75 valve springs 185
JPM ti retainer 173
JPM rockers 1046
Push rods 49,95
Push rod tubes 167 CSP
Cam 104
Lifters 22,95
Cam gears Magnum 172 CSP
Bearings 39,85
Oil pump 27,95
Pump cover full flow 28
JE pistons 1206
Cylinder kit 165
Fuel pump block off 4,95
009 dist 109,95
Compufire 63,95
Cables 27,95
Valve covers 12,95
Clips 5,95
Gasket kit 9,95
Oil sealing flywheel 3,95
Clutch disc 29,95
Pressure plate Kennedy 180mm 179
Flywheel bolt 56
Deep sump 105
Lash caps 12,95
Pully 18,95
Pully bolt 4,95
Cyl studs 119
Header S&S 1 5/8 332
Old engine 155


Total parts 6454 USD.

Hopefully I did not forget too many parts.

The time I spent on the total build is aprox 100 hours(night hours).

Regards
Johannes





Wow,there some pricey parts in there for a little 1600 Cheesy    Johannes which lifters did you use at only 22.95?   cheers richie,uk

Are lifters normaly expencive?

In my engines I use STD lifters (made in mexico), and when used with easy cams (nice ramp open/close) like my fk-98, I do not feel the need for anything else. (BTW its a race engine, maybe street engines need other types of lifter)
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9.88 @ 134.25 mph
Jon
Administrator
Hero Member
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Posts: 3214


12,3@174km/t at Gardermoen 2008


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« Reply #262 on: March 03, 2008, 09:32:18 am »

Thats exactly it n2o, with K800's you don't need to gamble on lifters, sticking to VW's own.... so am I, until I learn  Grin
And a race engine has it easy compared to a street engine...

CHECK out the mouse in the house!!

http://www.griebel.blogspot.com/
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Diederick/DVK
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Posts: 3692


They're never done till they're sold


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« Reply #263 on: March 04, 2008, 00:44:28 am »

how about web cams? i read you can't use std lifters with those... Huh
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Diederick
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Proud member of:
DVK ~ Der Vollgas Kreuzers
Harry/FDK
Hero Member
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Posts: 3613


Every Rule Was Made To Break, Even Callook...


« Reply #264 on: March 05, 2008, 16:39:51 pm »

Webcam with SLR treated Lube-A-Lobes works absolutely perfect for me. (Aircooled.net)
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BeetleBug
Hero Member
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Posts: 2836


Snabba grabben...


« Reply #265 on: March 06, 2008, 09:09:27 am »

how about web cams? i read you can't use std lifters with those... Huh

Why not?
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10.41 - 100ci - 1641ccm - 400hp
Diederick/DVK
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They're never done till they're sold


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« Reply #266 on: March 06, 2008, 17:20:51 pm »

no idea, that's why i'm asking.
lately i've come to a conclusion that stock lifters aren't that bad after all Wink
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Diederick
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DVK ~ Der Vollgas Kreuzers
BeetleBug
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Posts: 2836


Snabba grabben...


« Reply #267 on: March 06, 2008, 22:38:32 pm »

As long as you have enough spring pressure I do think every lifter is good enough. To little and every lifter would pit - no matter what.

Best rgs
BB
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10.41 - 100ci - 1641ccm - 400hp
71CALRIPPER
Hero Member
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Posts: 1530



« Reply #268 on: March 07, 2008, 10:38:25 am »

Having just read this thread while eating my cereal at work , i have a massive grin on my face.

Well done guys !!!
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n2o
Full Member
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Posts: 137



« Reply #269 on: March 07, 2008, 20:30:10 pm »

Having just read this thread while eating my cereal at work , i have a massive grin on my face.

Well done guys !!!

That must have been a big bowl of cereal.. Grin
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9.88 @ 134.25 mph
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