78 vs 82

[fredy66]

what I'm  wondering is do i get a 78 or 82 crank
i'm looking to do a drivers engine
want to go to Norway no problem
is it your first engine build you can do it

whats the best crank and roods combo for me
if I'm going 40 35,5 8,5 to 9 comp
a ifk8 ore  a  w125 40 35 heads

help there is many thing

yes I  do  have  the 94b pistons

[Trond Dahl]

want to go to Norway no problem

Good to see you have the correct motivation in place at least :-)
So I assume to see you with a new engine @ SCC 2011 then. Good luck with you build.

[Speed-Randy]

Go 82, fk8 cam, 1.4:1 rockers, 5.5" chevy journal rods, make sure to order the crank chevy journal as well. For street use you don't need the giant valves but can use them if you want to impress the ladies .

[dragvw2180]

 I don't think the size of the engine is going to detirmine  how dependible it is, it has more to do with the quality of the parts and how they are assembled.  I have used 5.4 rods with both those cranks in my race car with no problems. My sons 2275 street car has a FK8, 8.2 compression, 1.4 rockers, 40x35 valves , t3/4 turbo and he drives it every day back and forth to work in it. If he stays out of the gas pedal it gets great gas mileage which is not often,hahahhahaha   Mike

http://s91.photobucket.com/albums/k300/dragvw2180/?action=view&current=080406_McCarthy_Farmington.mp4

vid of my car

[fredy66]

Mr dahl you go the BASIC idea
dragvw you car is col but not what i,m looking to do.
but then your sons 2275 is Moor what i want no turbo

[dragvw2180]

Before we turboed my sons car we built the engine with the idea of turboing it later. This is the combo we used including the carbs ( it is a blow through setup now)

case /    arpm
crank/    82 wedgemated vw journals
rods /     5.4 h beams
cam/      FK 8  , straight cut gears , single thrust bearing
rockers/  1.4
heads/    Brothers machine    w/ 40x35    CB double springs , copper head gaskets
compression/ 8.2
pistons and cylinders/   CIMA b's
weber carbs/ dual 48 idf's
 only mistake we made was using a new chromolly flywheel, it's so hard that the clutch disc cannot bite into it properly under boost.

[fredy66]

after some help from Jim i ordered a 78 crank
next problem I-beam 5.5 5,4 (cb scat) or stock vw
this is going to be a Long road

[dragvw2180]

 I am not a rich man, I buy one part at a time and when I have all the parts for an assembly I will prepare all the parts to the best of my ability ,put them together and then wait till I can afford more parts. I like the I beam rods with arp bolts, but the ones I used on a friends engine required clearancing, the H beams went together with no problems. If I remember correctly with a 78 stroke and 5.4 rod I used A pistons with cylinder spacers , B pistons gave me too much deck .If you use a longer rod it would take care of the deck.

[fredy66]

I am not a rich man, I buy one part at a time and when I have all the parts for an assembly I will prepare all the parts to the best of my ability ,put them together and then wait till I can afford more parts. I like the I beam rods with arp bolts, but the ones I used on a friends engine required clearancing, the H beams went together with no problems. If I remember correctly with a 78 stroke and 5.4 rod I used A pistons with cylinder spacers , B pistons gave me too much deck .If you use a longer rod it would take care of the deck.

when i,m looking I-beam its my budget i,m thinking of .
a bit if clearing no problem.

5.5 rod ??

[Donny B.]

Stay with the shorter rods.  It makes for a narrow engine which is a better fit.  In my 78 x 94 engine I have 5.352 length rods.  The problem I had was that I needed to shorten the barrels .040".  I have large combustion chambers, that didn't help.  I am running 8.1 CR.  K8 with 1.4 rockers.  It is very driveable and is still fast.  I am running 42 DCNFs and the valves are 40 intake and 37.5 exhaust.  Makes for a fun combination.

[Sarge]

I've always had good luck with stock rods but have never run anything more then a 78.4mm crank on the street.  Like Donny mentioned, they make for a normal width engine.  The best part is no trimming and shimming with a 78."4" stroke and "b" pistons; an easy, dependable combo to screw together.

[bugnut68]

I've always had good luck with stock rods but have never run anything more then a 78.4mm crank on the street.  Like Donny mentioned, they make for a normal width engine.  The best part is no trimming and shimming with a 78."4" stroke and "b" pistons; an easy, dependable combo to screw together.

My 2017 build is a near copycat of your combo, Sarge!   Only difference I'm aware of is I'm running 45 DRLA Dells and 42x37.5mm Tims Stage II heads, but I think everything else lines up identically.

[dragvw2180]

Stay with the shorter rods.  It makes for a narrow engine which is a better fit.  In my 78 x 94 engine I have 5.352 length rods.  The problem I had was that I needed to shorten the barrels .040".  I have large combustion chambers, that didn't help.  I am running 8.1 CR.  K8 with 1.4 rockers.  It is very driveable and is still fast.  I am running 42 DCNFs and the valves are 40 intake and 37.5 exhaust.  Makes for a fun combination.

 I'll bet it runs cool too even on hot day

[Donny B.]

I'll bet it runs cool too even on hot day

Yes it does.  Cruising back from Tucson two weeks ago it sat right between 175F & 195F at 75mph.  It wasn't that hot, but it was around 100F.  It doesn't seem to matter too much how hot it is outside.  It still stays within the safe range...

[fredy66]

so 5.4 it is then ??
got my crank  aircooled is the place to shop excellent service
and my as 41 case is all stock  
next it machining .
happy man

[Jim Ratto]

I've run both 82 and 78 stroke motors in my car.
The 82 stroke motor was gutsier, but wasn't as "sweet" and the 78 stroke motor has more character to it as well. I went 78 in my latest motors because it was what I had to use, and man it was easy to assemble, just like Sarge mentioned above. I have built 82mm motors with aftermarket H beam rods where rod and cam lobe touched, aeven after rod clearancing, requiring a smaller lobe base circle cam. No biggie.
My motor:
94 x 78
VW 311B Rimco rods
9.8:1
Web Cam 86C advanced 1.5 deg
Scat 1.4's (.579" @ valve)
44 x 37.5 044 heads by Clyde/me
48 Webers
1-3/4 header, Tiger muffler
runs cool, like Donny's, I can drive it all day long in 100F heat, oil stays @ 180F

This weekend I will put my "winter" pulley on (thru April) so it will run warm enough in the colder weather.

[fredy66]

Jim i think that's a bit bigger then what i can afford and need moor street engine

was reading ultar vw issue 50 51 Si engine 2165 that looks interesting but sadly I'm missing issue 52

[Jim Ratto]

Jim i think that's a bit bigger then what i can afford  and need moor street engine

same size motor would run well with Engle 125-130 and smaller valve heads too, but I do drive mine as a real "street car", it doesn't get babied by any means. Trips to see DKP guys mean a 140-150 mile round trip, and besides that this motor sees regular trips to work and back and weekend fun runs. Without driving it, I can't know what to stay on top of as far as maintenance or what needs to be upgraded for better longevity or more refinement.

I've been toying with idea of building a 2nd motor, 90 x 74 with smaller port/valves, similar CR and 140 Engle, just for something different and less "big motor-ish"
of course, with kid # 2 coming in 3 months, this will never happen.

[fredy66]

any body tested  2165
w120 40 35 heeds
8.5  to 9 co
or is that to mild

[dirk zeyen]

mark herbert

82X 94   40/37.5 valves engle w120 1.25 ratio rockers

[Tony M]

That is the motor in my stand right now - went 125 cam - same heads and c/r - will be and is a good motor

any body tested  2165
w120 40 35 heeds
8.5  to 9 co
or is that to mild

[Jim Ratto]

Engle 125 is one of the legend cams. Works in most anything.

Good call.

[fredy66]

that sands promising my think a bout that.
so we have
 
as41 block
78 crank
I-beam or og vw ( i have a set needs to be looked at)
vw flywheel 8 dowel (or is it better to get a new one )
w125
40x 35 heads
8.5 to 9 comp

i,m i an the write Way ??

[streetvw]

this motor is starting to sound like the 2007cc that hot vws put together in 1996 which can't be all bad

[dirk zeyen]

162 hp without fanbelt and muffler @6000RPM never rev that baby higher...

8.04/1 compression
40/35.5 valves in not welded heads (fumio)
w 125 stock ratio rockers

but the roads are to long.....

[fredy66]

162 hp without fanbelt and muffler @6000RPM never rev that baby higher...

8.04/1 compression
40/35.5 valves in not welded heads (fumio)
w 125 stock ratio rockers

but the roads are to long.....

that's excellent any body have a copy of that magazine and a scanner.
what rod ratio i,m i looking at.
i can send my 311 rods of for work if that's whats needed.
160 hp  i love that

[streetvw]

paging Deano, Deano to the white keyboard

Dean was the guy behind the article maybe he can help

[fredy66]

that be excellent

[dirk zeyen]

sorry no scanner.

there are 2 articles

the first is the building
second is dyno time.....

[dirk zeyen]

you can ask "speedwell"

for sure he can scan!!!
you can also ask him about the dellorto drla build up article he had scanned for me....

ASK THE ARCHIVIST!!!